Being dry at night question

[HeyAssbutt]

Quick question. I'm trying to get dd (just turned 4) to go through the night without a nappy. She's happy to do it, she seems like she's uncomfortable in the nappy now.
My question is, do you wake them to do a wee in the night? For example, she had a wee before bed at 7, do I wake her when I go to bed around 10.30/11? Then see how she goes into she wakes up about 6.30? Any experiences and advice welcome. TIA

And also ok as aparent to not want your dc to be put on education that's isn't strictly necessary.
Or to consider that alarm etc are more of a nuisance that the nappies.
I'm always careful about this idea of normal tbh. Bedwertting also runs in family which suggests there is a genetic component. And obviously you always have outliners too.

Fwiw my child is now a teen. Went in his Y6 trip wo a nappy or accident (remembering this would NOT be surprising fir the teacher if one of the children needed one). And yes also doesn't wet his bed. Wo medication or alarm or anything. And most important wo trauma or him feeling 'wrong' for the bedwetting.

Sorry on phone and it autocorrected many things....
First sentence should be
And also ok as a parent to not want your dc to be put on medication that's isn't strictly necessary.

Or to consider that alarm etc are more of a nuisance that the nappies

And there we have it. Alarms are very effective but hard work - lazy parenting.

Nobody is suggesting a child should feel wrong for wetting, but parents should be helping their child to get dry as much as they can for their child’s own self esteem and development, even if the alarm is a “nuisance”.

My exh was a bedwetter until he was 14. They tried everything apparently regulated drink restrictions alarms medication waking up in the night to go to the toilet. Nothing worked
It was just waiting for a particular hormone kick in - not sure if that was a known thing in the 70’s/80’s

My own 9 year old has only just got dry at night. I refuse to make it an issue Because I know he’s not doing it on purpose pull ups and mattress protectors have been our ‘thing’
They get dry in their own time. You can’t rush that particular hormone

I'm reading all the replies. I'm not very clued up about this which is why I posted. I will do some more research. Fwiw I think with all development, every child is different and will do things in their own time. Obviously, you can teach and help but like pp have said, if they sleep through the wet feeling, which dd has done, then leaving them in a wet bed isn't going to be beneficial.

Dd does drink plenty during the day. The trouble is she is adamant she wants to take a drink to bed. She wakes up at least once every night for a drink. She started doing this after I let her do it when she had a cough ages ago. So I've told her she has to wear a nappy or stop taking a drink to bed so we'll see where that goes

HeyAssbutt
If your child is only 4, well done on addressing this early. There are always going to be some children who do not get dry by secondary school for various reasons including family history, but the majority of children can be dry at night by 6/7 although sometimes it can be hard work for parents. Your daughter should not be having drinks after 1.5 hours before bedtime, apart from sips of water if thirsty or for teeth cleaning. She is “adamant” she is taking a drink to bed? You are the parent, you set the boundaries here - no drinks to be taken to bed, if you can not enforce this boundary then a very very small amount in a glass and tell her she is only allowed sips.

You can find all you need to know here:
www.eric.org.uk/Handlers/Download.ashx?IDMF=a6299b43-345d-4860-ab2c-ed139bef6f3e

Alarms are very effective but hard work - lazy parenting.

You can fuck right off with judgemental comments like that Rhino. You haven’t the faintest idea what is going on in the lives or past of families like ours, nor do you know the child concerned.

The choice to use an alarm has to be weighed against everything else a family has going on. The decision not to use one is highly unlikely to be ‘lazy parenting’.

And you cannot say all families are reluctant to use alarms due to family issues, just because this is the case with you. Sometimes it’s just easier to leave their children in pull ups than have the “nuisance” of an alarm.

No but judgmental sweeping comments have no place on a thread like this.
If I had read your posts when dc2 was 4yo I would have felt shit. But oh what a shame, he was one if those that will be be dry until later on... The result would have been 6 years of feeling pressured to managed something I should ever have asked him to do. And that means guilt both on my side to not managing to be a good even parent, one that isn't lazy!, so my child was dry. And guilt and feeling like a failure on dc2 side because clearly he couldn't something as basic as that.

@HeyAssbutt, please forget people like Rhino who think that they have figured everything out and it's ok to put people down for not doing what they consider the right thing.
See what works fir you and your dc. Go and we the GP and see what they can propose. Decide if this is something that is working for you. Bedwetting isn't a life or death situation. It's ok to say you don't want xor y. Or that z is too hard work fir you or your dc.
And forget about judgemental people.

Yes I do judge people who neglect their child’s health needs because there is something which may work, but it’s a “nuisance” to try it, or they don’t bother seeking professional help and also don’t take on board advice from professionals. It’s not a sweeping judgement, in fact I told the parent on here that it was great they were seeking early on and four years old isn’t a massive issue - see the nice guidelines. Parents are all too keen to leave their child in nappies or “pyjama pants” self diagnosing it to a hormone’ when in fact there are lots of other things that could be tried.

Like others have said, you can't train a child to be dry at night. It's hormonal, and every child is different.

One of mine was dry at night less than a week after becoming dry in the day, just after turning 2 years old. The other was almost 8 before they stopped wearing a pull up at night, despite also being dry during the day at 2 years old.

I waited until dd was dry in the morning 3 days in a row, and she was desperate to be out of nappies. She was doing 2 days in a row for a few months before she got to 3, and so far she hasn't had any accidents touch wood she was just turned 6YO - But still has milk before bed, so if she'd been prepared to give that up it would have been earlier!

And she's a deep sleeper too, odd occasions when we've forgotten a nappy always ended in a sodden bed, practically hypothermic child still blissfully asleep!

My son’s paediatrician said alarms shouldn’t be tried on children under seven which is why everything else has been tried with my DS first because guidelines are just that - guidelines. Not a religion. Not wrong, neglectful (it’s bed-wetting FFS, not cancer) or ‘lazy’ if not followed.

Get off your fucking pedestal and wind your judgy neck in.

And the biological effect of the alarm? It stimulates production of vasopressin, so your blanket statement about people ‘incorrectly’ blaming hormones is, sorry, incorrect.

ElphabaTheGreen
Your defensiveness says it all, do you think you could have done better?

Couple of points:

Age 7 for the alarms used to be advised by the old out of date nice guidelines, it is now 5 years old.

The alarm doesn’t stimulate release vasopressin, it trains the brain to wake up to the feeling of a full bladder so a child can wake up and go to the toilet.

Yet again, you are giving misinformation like it’s fact. Check your evidence base.

And whilst it’s not cancer - bedwetting and wearing nappies to bed has an adverse effect on a older child’s self esteem and mood, and they feel really embarrassed by it. If it is something which can be addressed why would a parent not so so at the earliest opportunity?

While I appreciate all the help and advice given on this thread, I am quite shocked that a thread about something as innocent as bed wetting has caused a bun fight. Everyone has different experiences and opinions, there's no need to start a slanging match because you have a difference of opinion.

The reason I started this thread is because I (wrongly) assumed that most children were dry overnight by the time they went to school. Now I see that's not the case I won't stress too much about training her to do it, she will do it when she can.

Like ask for a referral to a paediatrician at the age of five like I did with my son?

I’m really not sure what else I’m supposed to have done, having followed the advice of said paediatrician to letter (they won’t even try to provide him with an alarm until his next appointment in three months). I have also consulted the ERIC website on a number of occasions but have clearly not studied it to your satisfaction, such that you decide that me and others on here are ‘lazy’ and ‘neglect[ful]’ parents.

I’m also clearly not the only person you’ve pissed off on this thread. I think you need to step away and have a really hard think about how you phrase and present the advice you have to give. It’s really offensive.

HeyAssbutt I think it is difficult when one strong opinion is drowning out the experiences of others and calling parents lazy just because our experiences are different to theirs.

Ds1 was dry in the day before he was 3, however he wasn't dry at night until he was 10. Ds2 was dry day and night before 3.

If you do go to the GP they are not concerned until the child is 8, (or they weren't here) we tried everything recommended by Eric guidelines, including monitoring the amount of liquid consumed by Ds and the amount coming out (using a measuring jug in the bathroom.) We did it over the six week summer holidays.

We had sacked off nappies because they burst with the amount of urine he produced at night. So his bed was filled with the gel filling of the nappy, we tried every brand going.

We tried the alarm, all that happened was Ds woke completely distressed with the noise and it woke all of us up because he slept so deeply through the alarm for what seemed like ages. We tried all the different settings, upshot was the bed was still soaking wet, his heart was racing and he was so out of it we had to physically drag him to the toilet to do the rest of the wee.

We have paid a lot of money to incontinence websites for bedding protectors. Due to the sheer volume of wee, Ds would wet his pillowcase as the wee soaked all the way up the bed as he blissfully slept through it.

Ds2 had been in reusable nappies so I was used to doing a lot of laundry, bedding washing was nothing for us.

Ds1 responded well to Desmopressin which showed us very clearly that he was not producing vasopressin himself. We used it for hotel stays and school residential trips but like a PP we were not prepared to medicate him constantly.

Numbers wise (according to Eric who were a Godsend for us) 98,000 children aged 10-15 wet the bed. 86,000 adults aged 20-24 do as well. It isn't lazy parenting for everyone. For some, yes, but not everyone.

I think no-one talks about it for fear of judgement about a supposed lack of parenting skill or that there is still somehow a stigma attached to it.

@HeyAssbutt
It’s not been me who has been swearing.

And sorry to the OP if you think this is a bun fight, I just don’t like seeing the wrong health information being given on a parenting forum. I worked for years in specialist paediatric continence and have had ERIC training - the information constantly trotted out on here re vasopressin is wrong and stopping parents following proper interventions.

And no I am not calling parents lazy for their children wetting the bed, I was referring to an alarm being referred to as a “nuisance” when in fact it is very effective.

Wait until her nappy is dry most mornings. Many children are 6/7.

But happy to step away and leave posters blaming everything on a hormone, but sorry if you think I have derailed OP, please let me tell you what I would advise professionally.

The previous link to ERIC is all you need to follow for now at age 5, start with the bladder training - drinking more - 1300-1500mls water based fluid a day, this will strengthen the bladder and improve capacity. If bladder capacity is poor even if the child is releasing vasopressin they may still wet the bed. No drinks 1.5 hours before bed, double wee at bedtime - once they have done a wee count to ten and try again to ensure fully empty bladder. Rewards can be given for things such as drinking more, helping change the bed, doing the double wee - but not for having a dry bed as this is something that the child cannot help.

Paediatricians are not great support for primary enuresis, although very knowledgeable they have time constraints. if you have a school nurse or specialist continence service they can offer more support at a community level.

I find swearing a damn-sight less offensive than obliquely calling people, families and circumstances you know nothing about lazy and neglectful. If you did work in paediatric continence then you are best out of it if that’s how judgemental you are on the subject.