Any social workers around to advise?

[NALFB]

Ex is in a relationship with a woman who has had two children removed by social care. I don’t know why and ex won’t tell me (none of my business apparently).

I don’t want DD around this woman. Ex refuses to see DD unless she can be there too. He won’t be “told what to do” by me and doesn’t believe there is an issue.

I have called SS for advice today but have been told they are unable to advise me?! And it is my decision.

I don’t know if I am being over the top or not? DD hasn’t seen her father for 5 months now. He’s refusing to see her until I change my mind or SS confirm she isn’t to be around DD.

He has also refused to take me to court to get this sorted.

Am I being over the top not allowing DD around this child? What would usually happen in cases like this?

Thank you

[Apolloanddaphne]

It really depends why they were removed. She may pose no threat to your DD at all in which case SS won't divulge any information. Actually they won't release any information at all about someone. They will assume your DH to be a protective parent whilst she is in his care. I would just let her go but be vigilant. How old is your DD?

[liitlepenguin]

Hell no would she be going !!! Wonder why he won't take you to court over it

[NALFB]

She’s 4.

[darkparadise1]

No way on earth would I let my child go without full details and even then maybe not. You're doing the right thing 100%

[dreichuplands]

Ex social worker.
Social services aren't going to discuss another family over the phone with you.
However if they believed your dc to be at active risk of harm by having contact with this woman they would step in and say so. For example in relation to risk of sexual abuse.
Personally given that you have no relevant information to make a judgment on I would stick with the idea that the courts need to make the judgment. You need to be prepared that if it gets to court it is likely that contact would be arranged.

[jellycatspyjamas]

It depends on so many things, like why her children were removed, how long ago, whether her circumstances have changed since then etc etc none of which social work will or should share with you. Unless she’s committed a schedule 1 offence there’s no defacto legal reason for her not to be around your daughter - it’s a matter of assessment.

Where do you think your ex would see your DD if his partner wasn’t around, eg do they live together in which case any kind of substantive contact with your ex is going to involve his partner to some degree. What are your concerns based on what you know of your ex and his partner in daily life - have you seen how she interacts with your DD, is the house clean and child friendly, does she have adequate sleeping arrangements etc?

I can’t see social services or indeed court blocking contact with your ex without very good reason to think there’s a current risk of significant harm to your DD.

[negomi90]

If he wanted to see his child, and genuinely believed that his partner was no threat and was putting his child first. He would either - explain to you the details, understanding that any responsible parent (including him) would want to know who their child was around. Or he'd go to court and explain to a judge why she was safe to be around.
The fact that he hasn't and that he is refusing to see her along, means he is prioritising partner over child. That in itself is a red flag. I would continue as you're doing, though if she's old enough and willing, consider offering phone contact.

[Marylou2]

I absolutely wouldn't let my child be with someone who has had their own children removed for what ever reason. Her Dad is also choosing to pursue a relationship with this person so I wouldn't consider him to be a responsible carer either.

[Drpeppered]

SS can’t divulge details of this woman and her family to you. However I think you have a right to be wary.


I’d be asking your ex to explain why her kids aren’t in her care, before you allow them to be around her. Then you can make an informed decision about if it is safe or not.

[jellycatspyjamas]

explain to you the details, understanding that any responsible parent (including him) would want to know who their child was around.

You don’t lose your right to privacy because you’ve had children removed, if social services knew if any legal reason to prevent her being around children they would tell her the DC can’t have unsupervised contact. Outside of that, it’s really none of her business what happened and why.

While I think her ex could do more to reassure her, he’s actually the parent here and equally responsible for his child’s welfare. Assuming he’s assessed that his partner is ok, and in the absence of any evidence to the contrary, I doubt any court would prevent contact.

[Unsurprisinglysurprising]

If he wants to see her he will have to take it to court if you refuse. There's not much else he can do. Cafcass will assess and make a recommendation. Some kind of contact will likely be ordered. I'm not a SW.

[TwattingDog]

You could make a Clare's Law application to the police.

threshold-das.org.uk/claires-law/

It may have been that she was a victim of DV and failed to keep the children safe by not ending the relationship despite social services input. That's quite common.

Children are also removed for multiple reasons that do not make people BAD.

Parents can be medically and psychologically unable to cope with their children's needs, especially if those children have extra needs themselves.

Children go into the care system or are adopted for so many reasons, and it doesn't make their birth parents bad, evil, neglectful, nasty people. Sometimes life is overwhelming. Walk a mile in their shoes sometimes.

[BykerBykerOoh]

He doesn’t want to see his daughter. Personally I would wait for him to apply via the courts.

[tictoc76]

Not a social worker but just wanted to say you need to bear in mind that sometimes children are removed because the parent simply can’t put their needs first and care for them. That doesn’t necessarily make her a threat to your children as long as your ex is a responsible parent. Personally I would struggle with the unknown though.

[Starfish0]

Children go into the care system or are adopted for so many reasons, and it doesn't make their birth parents bad, evil, neglectful, nasty people. Sometimes life is overwhelming. Walk a mile in their shoes sometimes.

True but if this was the case there her ex could disclose this.
It’s her child, the op is right to be cautious when she has very little information.
I’d rather judge someone too harshly than risk leaving my child around someone inappropriate.

[dreichuplands]

The threshold for removing dc permanently is high so is that as happened then significant harm or the likelihood of it has been proved in court.
This doesn't mean this person is an active risk to your dc but it would suggest they would not be able to keep them safe.
It is likely there are past issues which could include drugs, alcohol misuse, mental health issues, spending time with people thought to pose a risk to dc, possibly a sexual risk and domestic abuse.
Your ex needs to be having a much more open conversation with you about the care of your dc.

[NALFB]

They do live together. They’ve been together 6 months. From what I know she doesn’t work and was sofa surfing before she met ex.

I don’t expect SS to tell me anything about this woman. Just if it was reasonable to keep DD from her until more information was known.

If a woman posted on here complaining that she couldn’t have her DC around her partner of 6 months who’d had his children removed from him she would be hauled over the coals. I see no difference because she is a woman who’s had her kids removed.

Aside from this whole issue is the fact that ex has been happy not to see DD for months and has prioritised a woman he barely knows over his child. I agree that for me this is a massive red flag!

His previous girlfriend (3 year relationship) was lovely and adored DD. However he left most of DDs care to her from the start of their relationship. I’ve no doubt he would do the same with this woman.

[NALFB]

From what I do know about this woman from a friend of a friend is that she is a pathological liar. I wonder if ex even knows the truth to make an informed decision

[HJWT]

@NALFB my sister has had her 3 children removed at birth that doesn't mean shes not safe to be around children, she just isn't capable to raise her own or safe to care for them or another child alone.

But would I let MY child around my sister without me there ? NO, I would not.

[morra26]

I would contact CAFCASS for advice. If her children have been removed it would have had to have been substantiated concerns in order for a judge to grant an order. If he is choosing to not inform you why and will only see his daughter when this woman is around then he is not putting his daughter’s needs as priority and that is his choice as he doesn’t need to see his daughter around her she should be the number one priority and he should make other arrangements to see her

[NALFB]

Following on from this thread I asked the friend of a friend if she had any more information.

It isn’t quite clear if she had her children removed or if she put them into care

There are apparently long standing drug issues, criminal record and no employment record to speak of. Not someone I would like around my child at all. Kind of glad ex hasn’t pushed the issue now and hopefully will just remain not seeing DD.