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Original poster

Electrician demanding cash payment - how to handle?

75 replies

Usernamealreadyexists · 04/07/2019 07:34

I was recommended an electrician as needed old halogen spot lights switching to LEDs. I got a quote verbally and we agreed. He finished the job yesterday and fucked up my sink in the process due the debris. He said he’d be back on Friday to fix it and wanted cash payment. I said we never agreed that and I want a proper invoice first. He then muttered something about VAT (I will only pay what we agreed as I assumed vat was included). I’m a single parent and feel a bit worried about challenging him on this. He is doing some work for a neighbour too. Any advice?

OP posts:

LoopyGremlin · 04/07/2019 08:05

OP
How were you intending on paying him? Cheques are now pretty much obsolete. Chip and Pin machines can be quite pricey so he might not have one.
I agree with others...no guarantees he’s trying to avoid tax. The hairdressing salon I go to doesn’t accept cards which is a bit annoying but hey ho. Does that mean I assume they are tax dodgers?!

DonkeyHohtay · 04/07/2019 08:05

@EleanorLavish cash for thousands might be a bind but you can understand why they wouldn't want to accept a chq which could bounce. If I were a joiner, electrician or whatever I think I'd be asking for cash too.

Then I could do my job rather than spending time chasing payments.

coral13 · 04/07/2019 08:05

@redcherries agree with this completely. For small jobs especially, if paid cash on the day it's all dealt with rather than having to chase a customer for 30 days.

I was shocked when we had our bathrooms done how many people keep putting off paying for weeks and weeks.

Kazzyhoward · 04/07/2019 08:08

If the trader is VAT registered, their quotes to a domestic customer MUST BY LAW include the VAT. They can't BY LAW add VAT to a quote for a domestic customer later - it all has to be VAT included in the quote.

A lot abuse the system by weasel wording such as "VAT applicable" giving the impression that VAT is included but then trying to add VAT when it comes to the invoice claiming it meant VAT would be added.

pelirocco123 · 04/07/2019 08:08

He may not be registered for vat
He quite rightly might not be happy with a cheque as it will take days to clear and may not be honoured , he should be paid in clear funds when job is finished...he may be prepared to accept a fast pay bank payment
Just pay him in cash , why make such a fuss

ProfessorSlocombe · 04/07/2019 08:08

How were you intending on paying him? Cheques are now pretty much obsolete. Chip and Pin machines can be quite pricey so he might not have one.

C&P machines shave a %age off for the bank ... but bank transfer is quick, painless and with the recipient in no more than 2 hours.

theworldistoosmall · 04/07/2019 08:09

A lot of my work involves cash payments. It’s all declared. I don’t ever accept cheques as they can bounce. Bank transfers I don’t leave until I see the cash in my account.
I’ve been screwed over by dodgy customers

There’s lots of small business that take cash and it’s all declared. They aren’t all like big businesses who find all the loopholes to avoid taxes etc.

Snowy111 · 04/07/2019 08:10

There should probably be a helpline to report this sort of thing, so that all workmen have to compete on a level playing field and all put jobs through the books. As a consumer you are probably losing some protections by doing this. But it’s cheaper and most transactions seem to be done this way!

Kazzyhoward · 04/07/2019 08:11

The sooner we become a cashless society the better. Tax evasion will plummet. Talk of getting thousands out of the bank to pay tradesmen is like going back to the dark ages.

20poppy14 · 04/07/2019 08:11

.....agree with everything you say kazzyhoward- & yep to paying by bank transfer. Dosh there in under 2 hours.

Kazzyhoward · 04/07/2019 08:12

There’s lots of small business that take cash and it’s all declared. They aren’t all like big businesses who find all the loopholes to avoid taxes etc.

The "black" economy is the biggest component of the UK tax gap - far more than corporate tax avoidance.

azulmariposa · 04/07/2019 08:13

@Cookit sites like rated people aren't trustworthy as people pay to be featured on there. Always ask people for recommendations, friends, family etc.

Kazzyhoward · 04/07/2019 08:16

We've just had scaffolding right round our house. Had 5 quotes from "reputable" scaffolding firms. Every single one said they'd knock the VAT off if we paid in cash.

We had quotes from decorators. Most said that they would invoice for their time, but that we had to pay cash for the materials so that they wouldn't go through their books. (To keep turnover artificially low to avoid VAT registration).

We had a new lawn laid last year. The landscape company asked us to write a cheque to one of their suppliers instead of paying the landscaper directly. I thought it was going to be the turf supplier, but he wanted a cheque written to the garage for a van repair - again to keep the income off his books to avoid VAT.

It's rife. It's costing billions.

Sandybval · 04/07/2019 08:18

Always ask for a written quote first, and an invoice for payment. Surprised as it's MN no one has suggested yet he wants cash so he doesn't have to pay as much CMS!

ProfessorSlocombe · 04/07/2019 08:25

It's rife. It's costing billions

Want to be like Amazon ? Want to be like Google ? There's your inspiration.

That said, there's a distinction between asking for cash to help cashflow (and reduce the need to remove teeth when cheques bounce) and asking for cash to dodge tax. And if it's any consolation, all the idiots customers who do pay cash no questions asked are in a much worse position when if there turns out to be any problems with the work.

charlestonchaplin · 04/07/2019 08:29

If VAT wasn’t included he should have said, ‘£X plus VAT’. Otherwise it is perfectly reasonable to assume the quote given is the full amount to be paid. If he didn’t say he wanted cash upfront, he can’t insist on cash now, but you can tell him you’ll pay cash but you do want a receipt.

Juells · 04/07/2019 08:31

Candymay
Learn how to do your own work in the home and you avoid the angst and the damage to the house. For a single mum it’s very empowering.

Yeah, everyone should do their own electrical work and save money

allthegoodusernameshavegone · 04/07/2019 08:35

He may have a rubbish business account as Some business accounts charge for online transactions and nearly all if not all charge to deposit a cheque.

Collaborate · 04/07/2019 08:41

@BogglesGoggles You can’t assume that VAT was included in the price you agreed.

Actually you can. If a price is agreed for goods or services sold to a member of the public it is assumed to include vat unless expressly stated otherwise.

See here

Or here

Collaborate · 04/07/2019 08:41

Also he may not even be vat registered.

mydogisthebest · 04/07/2019 08:41

My DH is a self employed tradesman. He gives invoices when work is completed and asks for cash or for a bank transfer (done there and then). I do his books and it all goes through.

We got sick and tired of people just not paying. Giving cheques that bounced or promising to do a bank transfer then making excuses as to why they hadn't done so - too busy was a common one even though it takes about 2 minutes!

I would estimate that over the years we have been owed a substantial sum. Did take one customer to court and got the £4,500 owed but if it is a small sum its not always worth the hassle.

He did work for a customer in February and they still haven't paid the £2,500 they owe. It was a friend of a friend and they were going to do a bank transfer. First they kept forgetting, then they were so busy they didn't have time to do it, then they went on holiday! Now they say they haven't got the money!

roses2 · 04/07/2019 08:46

I'm in awe at the number of posters on mumsnet who think cleaners, builders etc who get paid in cash are all law abiding citizens and declare their cash income

Boysey45 · 04/07/2019 08:49

@Candymay , You have to be careful with electrical jobs and know what your doing otherwise the house could burn down.I'm all for DIY but theres a cut off point.

OP get an invoice, give him cash and get a receipt as well.

Sandybval · 04/07/2019 08:50

mydogisbest - interesting you say that, I recently had quite a substantial amount of work done (thousands of pounds worth), and I was so surprised that there was no deposit taken, and even when the work was finished I had to chase the invoice as I wanted to pay asap and it felt weird that the work had been done but I hadn't paid a penny. No idea the rules for small businesses etc, but it seems to be geared so much to the customer and I thought this system is so vulnerable.

InfiniteSheldon · 04/07/2019 08:57

Asking for cash does not equal avoiding tax. Card machines are very expensive for a small business let alone a sole trader, Cheques bounce and bank transfers magically don't happen. Staying under the Vat threshold is the difference between a sole trader surviving and one going under he's not stupid to avoid it where ever possible. You can get an invoice for a cash payment and you'd be silly to pay without one. Did you get a written/e mailed quote? At the very least I'd print that out and ask it to be signed as paid in full, cash.

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