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Why oh why did I watch EasyJet in the cockpit?

47 replies

Dowser · 05/05/2019 23:32

I’m a nervous flier
We fly EasyJet 4 times a year to Tenerife and back and Thomas cook for other trip
We’ve already been struck by lightning on an EasyJet flight
It was mesmerising viewing...but I shouldn’t have done it 😱
Innsbruck ...in bad conditions 😱
Did anyone else watch and now regret it?

OP posts:
Backinthebox · 09/05/2019 11:06

I am obliged to wear a tie at work. Just to prove you can't keep everyone happy all of the time regarding pilot's ties, here's a link to the first thread I decided to engage in as a pilot on MN. The OP withdrew their pearl-clutching posts ranting about falling standards in British society when BA pilots wear clip on ties, but you get the general idea. Enjoy!

Backinthebox · 09/05/2019 11:08

And turbulence is just fine. The aircraft is designed to ride through it just as a boat is designed to bob about on the waves of the sea. But because you can see the waves you are not surprised when little waves cause little bounces and big ones cause big bounces. You cannot see the currents in the air, but pilots usually know they are there and do their best to avoid them. Sometimes it's not possible. But an aircraft is in it's element in the air and turbulence is just part of that.

Summersunny123 · 09/05/2019 12:48

Backinthebox- do you know specifically re the situation with Easyjet? As in, if I was to train as a pilot would there be an alternative to the tie , similar to what Captain Emma had Thanks!

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Backinthebox · 09/05/2019 15:02

I don’t know about easyJet’s uniform, but each airline has a uniform and you must wear it. I work for an airline that has a tie for both men and women. Tbh if the thought of wearing a tie is enough to put you off a particular company you probably don’t have quite the determination an airline would be looking for in a pilot. It’s a highly competitive career to get into and people accept you’ll wear what you are told to.

Summersunny123 · 09/05/2019 15:42

Backinthebox- I’m already at a place which is extremely difficult to get to and you can’t get there without determination It’s absolutely nothing to do with drive or determination
It’s simply that I find it very difficult to wear things around my neck

Backinthebox · 09/05/2019 18:41

I just unclip my tie (I wear a clip on) and unbutton my top button the second I close the cockpit door. I don't like wearing things round my neck either but wearing a uniform is part of the job.

CakeNinja · 09/05/2019 19:04

Flying through lightning is something that happens all the time. The plane is basically kept safe by a giant protective faraday cage, it’s very clever!

hudyerwheesht · 09/05/2019 20:55

OP, I completely sympathise- I made the same mistake because I started watching at the bit with the female pilot and co pilot joking about that not being the reason they had not been able to park the plane after landing and thought it would be lighthearted!
I'm really hoping that what a pp said about it being massively exaggerated and sensationalised is true.
I was surprised how much actual visibility the pilots needed to land (thought I'd heard that the plane practically lands itself) - what about heavy fog/mist/low cloud? That must happen loads in the uk?

Backinthebox · 09/05/2019 22:32

hudyerwheesht "I'd heard that the plane practically lands itself" Hmm I'm not even going to grace this with an answer!

Dowser · 09/05/2019 22:53

It astonishes me that people actually choose this as a career.

Just called round my daughters with ice creams and my sil looked deathly
They just flown in from Florida this morning , overnight flight
How the heck do you cope with that on a daily basis

OP posts:
Likethebattle · 09/05/2019 23:16

Take off and landing are the most menial parts is d flying are they not? They are the most difficult times and when most accidents are likely to happen, a plane certainly does not ‘land itself’

Likethebattle · 09/05/2019 23:16

*manual not menial

LatinforTelly · 09/05/2019 23:45

To back up hudyerwheesht, I've definitely read (pre-internet, must've been mainstream press) that a plane can land in fog/zero visibility using the computer. Is this completely wrong? Is it only certain planes, in certain, safe airports, or not at all?

fwiw, Dowser, my reading of that foggy landing in Innsbruck was that it was completely controlled, pilot saw all the things he needed to, and if he hadn't, would've done a go-around. It's hyped up to sound dramatic and make good telly.

Backinthebox · 10/05/2019 08:46

Not wanting to derail this thread too much but I can answer questions.

@Dowser
"It astonishes me that people actually choose this as a career.....How the heck do you cope with that on a daily basis"

People do still choose it as a career because the image is of a career spent swanning round glamorous places looking tanned and beautiful and earning a shed-load of money doing it. They are less aware (to begin with anyway) of the fact that you start your career by paying approx. £100000 for your initial training then spend the next 20 years in a scratchy polyester uniform trying to hide the wrinkles while you fly night flights, weekends and holidays round the world's dodgiest locations.

On the plus side it is exciting and if you want to see the world it is a great career. The earnings are not as much as they used to be (salaries have fallen as air travel has got cheaper. We want our pilots to be safe and professional....and cheap.) but they are still good. I wouldn't earn as much in another job. I am in a position atm where I fly 2 trips a month to places like the St Lucia, the Maldives, Capetown, Hong Kong, Singapore, etc. and stay in a 5 star hotel when I get there. Not too shabby places.

The time zone changes and night flights DO mess with your body. You get used to it, and develop strategies to make it 'least bad.' Your SIL probably isn't treating a flight back from holiday in the same way I would treat a night flight at work. I would sleep in the run up, sleep at every opportunity I can during (we have 3 pilots on a Florida flight. However the Caribbean is only half an hour closer to the UK and we only get 2 pilots for an overnight flight - less rest opportunities here.) and sleep once I've finished work, till I have done the equivalent of a full night's sleep. I also don't go onto local time zones if I can help it, so on a florida flight I would only be there for one night and I would be up at 4 am catching up episodes of stuff I haven't watched, as I will sleep at noon so I am ready for work at 5pm. Your SIL otoh will enjoy the last day of her holiday, be firmly in the Florida time zone, and will be thinking about unpacking/laundry/supermarket shop when she gets back.

As for landing in fog and who actually lands the aircraft, pilot or autopilot, as per hudyerwheesht's query, the answer is very complicated. All Weather Operations (AWOPS) and Low Visibility Procedures (LVPs) are among the most difficult to grasp parts of flying. On a day to day basis the pilot lands the aircraft. The autopilots are highly complex bits of kit that need no interference from outside sources and on a normal day going into a busy airport there are lots of aircraft all moving within relatively close proximity to each other in the queues for take off and landing. ATC and the pilots are able to see each other, the runway, the other aircraft and any possible problem situations in good visibility. This means aircraft can take off and land on the same runway within sometimes seconds of the last aircraft vacating it. Pilots can also adapt their flying technique for difficult weather conditions such as cross winds and gusty weather. Autopilots do not have the finesse for this so have strict crosswind limits. Once it is past a certain (surprisingly low) windspeed the autopilot cannot land. Nor can it land on a slippery or contaminated runway, ie in snow or in extremely rainy conditions where a blunt application of brakes might cause aquaplaning.

In foggy conditions you are right, the pilot cannot see to land. We have various ways of dealing with this. Each airport, aircraft and pilot has a limit to the lowest visibility they can deal with. Sometimes when it is just low cloud we leave the autopilot in to fly the approach until we reach the cloud ceiling limits then we take the autopilot out once we can see the runway, and still land it manually. This means that the high traffic flow rate most airports work with can be maintained. And if it is a bit windy or rainy, or even snowy we can still land. But if the weather is too foggy even for that we use LVPs.

LVPs require that take offs and landings have more time between them, which is why on days which are foggy there are more delays. Even once the fog has cleared there is a knock on effect on flow rate throughout the day. I get passengers angrily demanding why we are delayed when it hasn't been foggy since this morning and not understanding that the airport needs to catch up. Anyway. The way an aircraft lands in fog is that it has instruments that can detect a very fine signal beam from a landing guidance system located at the touchdown point of the runway. The autopilot does only what a pilot can do, which is to follow that guidance accurately down to the ground. But because you cannot see in fog that guidance system needs to be protected from interference, ie no other aircraft waiting to take off can go anywhere near it. Because this slows down flow rate ATC prefer to hold off on LVPs till it is absolutely essential. The aircraft's autopilot follows this signal - it is like the cruise control function in a car in that it does the last thing it was set to do but does not change it of it's own accord. So it doesn't change speed or slow down, it doesn't select landing flaps, it doesn't lower the undercarriage, it doesn't apply the ancillary braking systems such as speed brake or reverse thrust, it doesn't decide where to taxi off the runway. The pilot does all that, even when 'the computer is doing it all.' Without the pilot input the autopilot would just fly the aircraft into the ground at high speed.

I hope that explains a few things anyway.

hudyerwheesht · 10/05/2019 15:06

hudyerwheesht "I'd heard that the plane practically lands itself" hmm I'm not even going to grace this with an answer!
For someone willing enlighten with such long explanations, that comment is hardly helpful.
I'd heard that (as have others from what a pp says) - I didn't mean that I take that completely literally, I interpreted it as something like the autopilot was used a lot for the final approach and the pilots completed the landing once the runway was close - which is pretty close to what you've explained so I wasn't being entirely idiotic.
It is a fairly popular misconception put out by a lot of well-meaning "why flying is safe" material (because, believe me I've read a lot of that). I'm not paraphrasing - I have literally read the words "modern planes practically land themselves" in such material so excuse my naivete for wanting to believe it was a least partly true.

Backinthebox · 10/05/2019 15:19

"For someone willing enlighten with such long explanations...."

OK, to save anyone the bother of reading a long and technically correct answer, here's a short answer: The plane doesn't land itself. After a fuck of a lot of train, I land it. Unless it's very foggy indeed then after a fuckload more training I get monitor multiple automatic systems that make it possible to fly in fog. And if I get it wrong we all die. The Daily Fail will still tell your the autopilot does it all though. Unless I crash then the pilot did it. Is that better?

Pavlova31 · 10/05/2019 16:05

Thank you for your explanations Backinthebox they are very interesting to read.

Pavlova31 · 10/05/2019 16:10

Actually Backinthebox i hope you don't mind me asking is it the case that the Captain and First Officer have to eat different food altogether in case one of them gets food poisioning ?

Backinthebox · 10/05/2019 17:00

Pavlova31, that used to be the case but food hygiene is sufficiently good these days on aircraft that we are allowed to eat the same thing. It is rare that 2 crew meals the same are out on board for us though.

Dowser · 12/05/2019 17:33

Thank you so much black in the box for all the details you provided

I could only read 3/4 of it as I felt a bit nervous ... so made an emergency exit 😱
I’ve just booked our flights for October, Tenerife with tui
We have a night flight... that’s another scary thought
Setting off in the dark when you’ve left the brightly lit airport
It’s a bit dark out there for seeing where you’re going

OP posts:
hudyerwheesht · 13/05/2019 17:57

OK, to save anyone the bother of reading a long and technically correct answer

I have no issue with that (please see the rest of my sentence that you have only partially quoted) - in fact, the explanations are really helpful and much appreciated.
The implication that I or others are gullible Daily Mail readers, however - not so much.
My only criticism was that you couldn't stick to the former.

Saavhi · 13/05/2019 18:28

My twin brother has appeared briefly on that series! Will be incredibly weird if I'm ever a passenger on his plane- I've seen him do some seriously dumb shit (e.g microwaved beans in the tin as a 15 yo)

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