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At a loss with DD8. Please help

9 replies

MythicalBiologicalFennel · 30/03/2019 20:32

Not sure where to start! I don't even know if this is the right place to post.

DD is 8. Also have a DS4. We are at the end of our tether with her behaviour:

Take today. She had an hour nap after a family activity. When she woke up she lay on the sofa for over an hour screaming, writhing and kicking the sofa as hard as she could. We asked what was wrong, can we help, does she want water, food, the toilet, a cuddle. She would just wail/ yell louder. If I approached she would push me away. Eventually DH took her to another room as DS was trying to watch a film. Then she started slamming doors - hard -. Eventually she calmed down and was all sweet and smiles. These episodes are not unusual.

She is rude and full of attitude. Her language skills are brilliant and she has a sharp tongue. She will tell us the worst things she can think of - at her age it's things like meanie, bum, dumb etc but also awful things like I wish you didn't exist, I wish you hadn't been born, shut your mouth, it's not my fault you are a stupid idiot etc. Before anybody asks , no, we don't speak to her like that, she is very wanted and very loved. She is hugged, kissed and told she is loved many times a day.

She wants things to go her way all the time. If you say something like I will brush my teeth before reading you a story... BOOM off she goes "I hate you" "DS gets all the attention" which is not true. It's more that she wants all the attention all the time - she can be jealous and visibly cringes at seeing us hug her brother, will make negative comments if we praise him for anything. She is strong and intelligent at the top of what everything on school. He is clumsy, Summer born, just about hitting his goals etc.

She can be nasty and mean, will lash out and hit - she pushes us parents and her brother, throws things at us, punches, kicks. No, nobody hits her or pushes her and we make it very clear that it is not acceptable.

But punishment, loss of privileges and rewards don't help - she is incapable of waiting for delayed rewards, the idea of building up good behaviour tokens or whatever to achieve a treat completely passes her by. Things like naughty corner or reflection corner have never helped with her - it would involve physically forcing her to remain in a place and she gets more anxious and it escalates the situation.

She constantly imagines negative scenarios: "you're not going to want to read me a story" when we are happily getting ready for bed and choosing a book. "You think I'm stupid" again out of the blue. "Daddy forgot to bring the ball to the park" "he hasn't, I can see the ball on the grass" "YES HE HAS YOU LIER" yelling at the top of her voice. Reasoning, praising, reassurance don't work. Sometimes she seems very anxious and I can see that she cannot help herself in the middle of an episode - but not always.

She tries to control situations - playing with other children, trying to control all aspects of play with DS down to the clothes he wears "you have to hold this toy with you right hand when you walk down the street . If someone doesn't toe the line she refuses to play, complains bitterly, "I hate you", "I want to go home", "he's horrible". Apparently she has no friendship issues at school but she rarely gets asked for playdates. She can be very silly, loud, too bouncy and not knowing when to stop, unable to calm herself down like an overexcited puppy. I guess this puts other parents off?

My issue is that she is an angel at school - "a model pupil" says her teacher. So I cannot go down the path of diagnosis via the school or the impact in her education. She does very well, a year ahead in maths, two years ahead in reading. She understands rules and what is required of her perfectly and fulfils her role to a T. When I ask her teachers if she hits others or calls adults an idiot they are shocked we are talking about the same child.

I thought of approaching the local authority but many in the relevant team are known to me and I feel uncomfortable about sharing personal details with them. Am I being silly? I have no idea what the diagnosis / help path is in my LEA anyway, their special needs website doesn't work!

I thought of seeing a private psychologist but have no idea how to start. I guess my question is, in view of the above do you think we have grounds for thinking something is not right and that we could do with a diagnosis or failing that some strategies? And how do you approach a private psychologist? Do you explain what the issues are or leave them to assess your child with no prior knowledge, on a blank slate?

Be gentle please. We are exhausted and slightly scared of her. I have been here since before she was born under different names. I have felt there was something about her from day one. We were hoping she'd grow out of the tantrums and aggression and would develop some empathy but it's getting worse. Basically she seems so unhappy I just want to help her whatever the problem is. I feel so sory for her. But also DS is getting distressed and confused at her outbursts and I am at a loss to explain them to him.

Apologies for the essay and TIA.

OP posts:
BlackeyedGruesome · 30/03/2019 22:54

Google the Triad of impairments for autism, see if it is relevent, if so make a list.

Also look up ADHD and anything else anyone suggests.

See your GP and ask for a referral to a neurodevelopmental team.

Not uncommon for autistic children to mask in school. Known as pop/ coke bottle effect by parents.

Look up PDA and see if those parenting techniques help.

Go on a parenting course, not because you are shit at it or anything but it hey do like to send you on those first. If you can say you have done it and use the techniques and they still do not work it may help miss a step.

If you can afford private pay for an assessment, it check your local authority accepts private diagnoses first.

Read about autism and see if you can find stuff that helps.

After school, give food, drink quiet, (no talking,no questions) deep pressure maybe.

BlackeyedGruesome · 30/03/2019 22:56

Sorry it is a bit disjointed, my autistic noisy one is emoting loudly upstairs.

MythicalBiologicalFennel · 31/03/2019 10:57

Thank you so much BlackeyedGruesome. Lots of good advice there.

OP posts:

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

LilyMumsnet · 31/03/2019 11:38

We're moving this over to chat at the OP's request. Flowers

Flyingarcher · 31/03/2019 12:22

Sounds like PDA. She is less anxious at school because there are cast iron rules and boundaries and that makes her feel safe. At 8 children are very accepting. However, as they all mature, banter, social media, fads, pop bands, etc all come into the mix and it all starts becoming less predictable.

You could try social stories with her. Weighted shoulder blanket may help too. Visuals rather than talking. If you look up comic strip conversations this may help where you draw stick people with what they say as speech bubbles but also thought bubbles. The words you say aren't enough. She needs it in a more obvious format so simple picture clues. The anger Gremlin and the 5 point anger scale Re slso good.

ItsNiceItsDifferentItsUnusual · 31/03/2019 12:51

My ds is 5 but I recognise a lot of what you've written. I've also felt there may be 'something' in the background since he was a baby.

We've had a lot of success recently by absolutely going back to basics with a marble jar. He starts the day with 5 marbles. If he wants to play Lego with daddy before bed (his favourite thing) then there needs to be 5 marbles in the jar at bedtime. Marbles are taken for any negative behaviour and returned for positive.

It's worked so well because it's a) very visual and b) it's really simplified things. Instead of having delayed rewards or different consequences over the course of the day we only have this jar and the one 'reward'.

I don't think we're out of the woods with his behaviour but for now it's working.

MythicalBiologicalFennel · 31/03/2019 13:56

Thank you everyone for all the advice. I had never heard of social stories and have just googled them - it looks like something DD could relate to. Off to google comic strip conversations.

OP posts:
Thepearofwisdom · 31/03/2019 14:49

Try reading 'the explosive child' premise is 'children do well if they can' so if she is not doing well there are things in her environment that are challenging her.

She sounds VERY like my daughter who is awaiting assessment for Autism and ADHD , PDA has also been mentioned.

Best thing we did when we were unsure was to adopt autism parenting strategies, they will help whether she turns out to be autistic or not.

Also, reducing demands totally, no getting dressed if not leaving house, giving her control over what we can, tuning into how very challenging everyday life is for her and massively shifting our expectations, all of these things have had a real positive effect on all our lives and enables our girl 7, to show us her funny, quirky beautiful self, the anger is a cover for so so many emotions.

Above all of this- trust your gut you know your daughter best, good luck ThanksThanks

CurcubitaPepo · 31/03/2019 16:12

She sounds a bit like my ds who is nearly 10. There’s always been something different about him. We are being assessed for aspergers. Social stories we feel has helped, as one of the things we had problems with is new experiences.

He was referred via school as they have the full measure of his behaviour. However, girls present very differently to boys. I think I also have aspergers and I was similar to your daughter in the respect that I was an angel in school and terrible at home.

Best of luck OP, some good strategies upthread. Flowers

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