Non verbal autistic children

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I hope it doesn’t come across wrong but can they be ‘normal’ in every way except verbal speech?

By that I mean, can they understand everything, follow instructions, communicate clearly (but without speech), be attentive to their surroundings etc just like a verbal child, just without speech and still be autistic?

My youngest DS still isn’t talking, not even babbling.
He communicates by shaking his head, pointing/grabbing/holding out hands and squeaking.
He was 2 at the end of September last year.
He has seen a therapist who says she has never before seen a child like him which isn’t terribly reassuring...

He is being referred for a hearing test but seeing as he responds to absolutely everything and understands everything I don’t see how it could possibly be a hearing issue.

I didn't talk until nearly three. I didn't need to as I could communicate effectively without talking. I now have a degree. DD was a late talker too, but when she did start it was in complete sentences.

Dn was nearly 4 before we discovered her hearing loss. Everyone felt guilty as we hadn't noticed.

Just in response to PP who said sometimes people jump to intervention too soon, please ignore this advice! Studies consistently show that early intervention is key. If it was to be ASD then the sooner you can provide support with language or other developmental delays, the better, as maladaptive behaviours can become ingrained from early on, which can make learning much more difficult. I've worked with children with ASD for over a decade and so often have seen cases where the child could have had much better outcomes for their learning if intervention had occurred earlier. Not saying your child has ASD OP but regardless of any diagnosis it's better to give support early than to not intervene (even if it turns out they don't have a diagnosis)

Just to add my previous post is a more general point in response to PP's comment, not necessarily a comment on your LO's issues OP

DD wasn’t making eye contact at 2y 10m, and her language was very poor. The speech therapist said she had no realised all speech is communication; she never listened long enough to learn the language and she thought we all just spout jargon. It was a difficulty processing sounds meaningfully into language - not autism at all. I had to make eye contact every time I spoke to her, by turning her chin until she was looking at me while I spoke. She needed intensive speech therapy.

I’d get a good speech and language therapist to do an assessment if it were my child.

I think it is really good he is being checked, my daughters limited and unclear speech was picked up at 2 year check, turn out she had glue ear and moderate hearing loss, but also she is now 7 and awaiting ASD assessment so not all of her communication issues were due to hearing loss, but it was a good place to start.

Think what I'm saying is, you can't know until things start being investigated, if hearing turns out fine, then ask for further assessment, berserk should support you in this, find out who is the lead for children with additional needs and ask to meet with them. Good luck,

Nursery not beserk?

Neither of my DC babbled.
One went straight to talking at 9 months (later diagnosed with ASD), one didn't talk until close to 3. I raised concerns and he was referred to a speech therapist who discharged him with no concerns. He's 6 now and speaks fine.

Even though you say you aren't worried about his eyes, I'd advise you to have them checked. I wasn't concerned about ds's either - no clumsiness, no trouble finding things - but he needed glasses very much indeed and as soon as he got them, his eye contact improved exponentially. He still is a long way behind in his speech but he has picked up signing and has some words now (at 3), and we start speech therapy next week.

He smiles so much now that he has his specs, and seeks them out in the morning.

So get it checked op, it's a simple enough thing to fix if there is a problem and it can make such a difference. We were referred directly by our HV but you might be able to get somewhere with an optician - ask around a bit.

Also (apologies if I missed it) you don't mention signing. If you aren't already doing some, do start. It doesn't delay speech, it promotes it - and it gives you a way to communicate in a two-way fashion. I picked up DS from preschool yesterday and he smiled, signed 'hello', then 'Mummy' and ran to me... it was lovely and not something he could have done without signing (well the running part he could, but not the rest). Mr Tumble is a good place to start. Again, apologies if I've missed that you already do this!

I didn't talk until nearly three. I didn't need to as I could communicate effectively without talking. I now have a degree. DD was a late talker too, but when she did start it was in complete sentences.

This doesn't really answer the OP though. Lots of autistic people have degrees.

Your son sounds like he has found a great wa to communicate with you and that's awesome.

My son is 2 years and 3 months and is completely nonverbal. No behavioral issues, sleeping and eating is good, happy, smiling, plays peekaboo and cuddles and wrestles with me. He leads me by hand to get his point across. His receptive and expressive speech is none. He has been getting Speech, occupational, and developmental therapy for 1 year now but to no avail. He has no words, only understands 3 words, no hand gestures or pointing, or copying. He plays with all his toys but not appropriately, no lining up anything but surrounds is himself with toys. I quit working because of him and I label, point, talk, do hand on hand...every technique I know of, I use it with him all day long. His hearing is good, he loves getting messy and no problem going places or loud noises. He does not mind people but has no interaction with adults or his peers. I am at a loss, if he had good receptive language I wouldn't be too worried but his understanding and communication is close to nothing. He is my first boy and I worry and cry and can't sleep thinking of his future...my family is supportive but I spend 24/7 with him...is there anyone else who has experienced receptive and expressive language delay and did it get better and how are their kids now, please share, I need some hope because I am deteriorating health wise and already on antidepressants because of lowing my father.

I would say no. People with autism who are non verbal usually have quite significant special needs and difficulties in life.

However, please don’t catastrophise. My son was also speech delayed and didn’t really make significant leaps with his speech until he was around 3.5. Yes, he is autistic, but he’s also quite gifted in some areas. I wouldn’t change him.

Just take things one step at a time at the moment. Hearing test, speech therapy, paeds referral.

Agree with pp that could be glue ear.

My nephew didnt walk or talk until after 2. Had all number of tests but they never found a reason or diagnosis. Hes 4.5 now and walks/talks the same as any other 4.5 year old . They did pay for salt from around 2 though

One piece of advice I will give, is to ignore the many many well-meaning people you’ll encounter who will try to reassure you by telling you about all these kids they know who didn’t speak a word until they were four and were fine. If I had a pound for every person who told me “ah just you wait, he’ll wake up one morning speaking in perfect sentences!”

He never did, but I took all those comments to heart because I desperately didn’t want anything to be wrong with my boy. I delayed getting help because I kept waiting and waiting for him to catch up. If I had my time again I would be less resistant to the idea of getting on the ASD pathway.

Aisha - your child sounds just like my ds. He was diagnosed with a severe receptive and expressive language delay at GOS aged three.

Speech therapy has done nothing for my ds (none of them could get his attention). But we have enormous success with ABA therapy and working through the VB Map.

Feel free to message me if I can help

That doesn't sounds like autism to me (obviously I've never me him!). Have a look up the m-chat test see what that says. Sounds more like hearing loss to me. My son has autism and hearing loss and the hearing loss was what caused his severe lack of speech. Once that was sorted his out his speech came on but his overall communication has continued to be poor. The lack of hearing test with no speech at his age is really poor - I would phone audiology and ask if they can put you on a cancellation list or push up your appointment given his age and total lack of speech. Good luck I remember how worrying it all is.

Oh and my ds4 didn't talk until he was over 3, he was dx with asd at just over 2 years old but now at 6 people dont even realise he has asd and he no longer needs any 1:1 at school

He wasn't like your ds though, didnt follow instruction or point, wave show any form of communication or share interests . No eye contact either

I’d be requesting a new SLT as a first step!! They’ve never heard of a non-verbal toddler?!

Your DS was only 2 at end of Sept if I read your post correctly. That is really young still. From what you’ve written it sounds like he’s got great understand and communication albeit non-verbal at the moment. Obviously my story is just one and others have different outcomes as PP have said but what’s your instinct saying to you right now? Do you think your child has autism or do you think they just don’t speak yet? I think there is a lot to be said for that intuitive thing we sense about our own children if that makes sense. Obviously not saying don’t DO anything ... def get the outside help at this stage so hearing tests, SLT. (New therapist!), etc, etc. But try not to over worry either. Your taking the right steps and are clearly involved and monitoring your child so also try to relax about their speech. Also what does his nursery say? Surely he’s not the only just two year old there that isn’t speaking?

My own story... DC1 didn’t start babbling until 2.5, had under 10 words at 3, speech really started to increases (significantly) from 3.5yrs. I requested slt referral at 2.5. Fee sessions between 3-4.5yrs they did improve but I don’t think it was related to slt but more own development stage. Throughout it all (from non/verbal to verbal communication and understand excellent). Now 7.5yrs no speech or communication issues and performing very well at school. DC2 very similar good understanding and communication skills pre-verbal and started speaking just before 3 but real leap came 3.5yrs. Now 5yrs doing great at school. Also saw slt 3-4yrs. DC3 currently 3.5 and has a lot more speech than either sibling had at same age BUT much much less than friends children and nursery friends of same age. No slt intervention. All DC had hearing tests and no concerns. As I said that’s just my story of non-verbal toddlers but hopefully gives you some indication that not all toddlers are verbal and it doesn’t always mean there is autism or any other issues but always good to get intervention. It won’t do any harm and means it’s in place if your child doesn’t happen to “catch up” with speech themselves.

Oh and to add NO they didn’t suddenly start speaking in sentences. The amount of people that told me of their aunties friends daughters son who didn’t speak then woke up and started speaking full sentences was unreal. My kids just gradually started speaking much the same path I’d imagine a younger child would have take it wasn’t overnight b

As a mother of a ds who is 19 and non verbal I would seriously wonder how experienced she was at her job.

My son understands what you say to him if its kept simple like 1 or 2 words, and we have to tell people not to talk about him within ear shot as he understands exactly what your saying.

My ds generally babbles and will on a rare occasion have a light bulb moment and say a word very clearly.

When my ds was 2 and still not speaking he saw an audiologist who said his hearing is so acute he can hear things that other people wouldn’t necessarily hear, and even now if were trying to hide something in a cupboard he will know which cupboard by the noise it makes his hearing is that good.

He’s now no longer at school but his whole time at school he was under SALT to get him to communicate which sadly never happened, and pecs he isn’t overly interested in, but he now uses his Ipad and proloquo2go program to communicate and we’ve had some success especially when he’s very motivated to ask for it using his ipad which has the item he wants stored on it, still a work in progress though.

Sounds a lot like a little boy I know who has been diagnosed with verbal dyspraxia. With speech therapy he’s making show but steady progress with his language. Good luck OP!

Coming from a different angle- have you had his eyesight checked? The not holding eye contact reminds me of my youngest, who we did not realise until he was 2.5 was visually impaired. He never bumped into stuff, played with toys fine- we have no idea how!

My eldest did not babble or speak until almost 20 mo. She pointed at what she wanted, and grunted. She has Asperger's.

Like you I had concerns about my ds as he only said ‘da’ at 2.5 though seemed to have full understanding. At 3.5 was diagnosed with dyspraxia including verbal dyspraxia. Lots of cued speech (signing) and SALT input over a number of years and his number of speech sounds slowly increased. Got an additional diagnosis of ASD at 6.5. How’s he doing now? He’s now 19 and I’m Not sure how he’s doing today as he’s not back from uni yet :-)

My DS was like this. Very good understanding, in terms of physical milestones all find, great coordination, able to play quite fiddly games, good eye contact, social but didn’t speak. By his second birthday was hardly even babbling. Was referred for hearing problems but it was all fine. Really worried but he showed no issues other than language. Did get referred to a speech specialist who we saw once.

Suddenly at 2.5 he went from nothing to saying several words very clearly - within two months he was conversing as normally as others his age. He is 4 now and his speech is well developed and very clear to the point I get comments on it. He sounds like a wise old man some of the things he comes out with and I have no idea where some of his longer words come from!

I think your DS is still young so it could just be he is slow to start. Speak to your HV and seek advice though (I did). I’m neither a medical professional or an expert in child development. I just wanted to share what my experience was with my own DS.

ZOMBIE thread....