InvestIN Education Young Lawyer Programme - is it useful? pls advise if you have any experience. We are letting our bright son down :(

[Shiklah]

DS has always been very academic and able. It's been a bit of a shock to us. He is predicted 13 level 9s at GCSE and we were told at parents evening that his ambition to be a barrister and go to Oxford is not ridiculous or over ambitious.

He will be the first in the family to pursue anything like this, to give context I left home at 16 and DH grew up in and out of care, this is all very new to us.

As we have no experience or idea, the school recommended that we look at this InvestIn Education day course in London. The cost is £130 and there is also cost of the train from Yorkshire (£100) and a hotel for the night (£80). Is it worth it? I am concerned that it will be a rip off, essentially a power point presentation? It is a lot for us to spend, but we will if it is worth it.

Any advice is appreciated. We have been able to support him so far but as he progresses we are out of our depth. I don't want him to be another intelligent working class boy who fails to achieve his potential. Thank you for any advice on this course and it's content and usefulness.

Sorry ive no advice for you

I really hope you find someone to help

Can I suggest you also try posting in secondary and higher education as well as the people there are very knowledgeable and they might have some suggestions

Youre not letting him down

I'm afraid I can't help either. But to add to Rufus's suggestion, it might also be worth posting in Legal Matters www.mumsnet.com/Talk/legal_matters - perhaps some of the legal eagles over there might know of the course and be able to give you some advice.

Hmm ...

I'd be surprised if an expensive, commercially driven course offered anything advantageous to aspiring lawyers.

If he is likely to do well in GCSEs and A'levels he should be on track for a good university anyway. And I thought the trend in university admissions was away from advantaging applicants whose experiences had been bought by parents.

So I'd say he'd do better to seek out shadowing and mini-pupillage opportunities himself (assuming these still exist!) over the next few years.

Thank you Rufus - I hope not too. I have started to feel very anxious about it, even more so after the news items last week about all the clever working class students who fail in the UK. I will repost thank you

Thanks for the advice, this is what I fear regarding the course but it was recommended by the school as a way to get a few contacts.
The problem we have is no contacts and no way to get any. We are small scale farmers and DH works in a factory and I run a small business, we do not have a way to network and get experience, shadowing or mini pupilage whatever that might be. Neither of us have ever met a Barrister! DS emailed 20 law firms last summer and did not get a single response. I would really appreciate any advice on this.

It is sad that Unis will reject 'paid for' things when in fact some working class parents do have the ability to graft and save for their kids whereas we have no hope whatsoever of gaining prestigious internships etc as we have no contacts.

Have a look at the Sutton trust or the social mobility foundation for schemes as well as insight days at universities. I don’t think you should feel like you have to pay for something so commercial. Quite a few universities offer taster sessions over Easter or summer holidays which might be an option.

Everything I have seen in terms of Unis is tailored towards people who know what they are doing and it is very intimidating. When I called a local University and enquired about A level requirements they barked so many requirements and different scenarios to me and I have no clue what they are talking about.

I hear what everyone is saying, thanks for the advice, we need to find a mentor or information source that can explain what is needed for ucas personal statement etc. The problem is finding someone, but thank you all.

Would you first source of information not be his school? They sound encouraging.

I really wouldn't get hung up on contacts!

(And, btw, if you are asking about the legal profession on MN you are (likely to be) talking to barristers and solicitors! Not everyone announced their profession before responding.)

Anyway. After the school - use the Internet. Your son has shown great initiative in contacting law firms - but he was probably too young for them to be helpful. But he's more than capable of finding out everything he needs to know pre-university. For the moment he just needs to concentrate on GCSEs. And enjoying life!

Typos!

'your first source'.

'announces'.

Probably more ...

Agree you should start with school. They should be finding him extension opportunities and putting him forward for stuff. Did he do work experience via school ?

He’s prob too young for Chambers right now and Id also be dubious about paid-for opportunities but many Chambers do focus on work experience for kids without the usual MC advantages. Again talk to the school.

Also a meeting with your MP? They ought to be pleased to help with this sort of thing in terms of signposting local charities and opportunities for someone like your son.

Sorry I just realised the school suggested the paid for course

We work with this group Access who may or not be in your area but could maybe suggest people who do work in your area.

OP you are not letting your son down! You sound very engaged in helping him realise his dreams.

The best thing he can be doing for now is getting the high grades he is capable of and looking towards achieving an excellent degree in a subject which interests him (not necessarily law) at a good university.

At the undergraduate stage there will be lots of opportunities for suitable experience and networking. Outreach schemes to encourage applicants to law from diverse backgrounds are growing and improving all the time. One which may be of interest in due course is the Pegasus Access and Support Scheme.

In the meantime there are helpful introductory insights in publications by the Bar Council and the Chancery Bar Association, among many others.

Barristers also participate in Speakers for Schools, which may be of interest to your son’s school if they don’t already know about it.

I am not familiar with the scheme you mention, but personally I think you would be better off finding out about the many ways in which access to the Bar is promoted without any expense on your part.

See also the excellent Pathways to Law programme run by the Sutton Trust and supported by the legal profession.

I mentioned networking (because you mentioned a lack of contacts). I should stress that networking/contacts are really not necessary to make a career at the Bar these days. Your son’s applications for mini-pupillage and (in due course) pupillage will be looked at entirely on their merits. I hope the various links upthread will help you and him to understand the opportunities available without thinking that you need to know people in order to get a foot in the door. You really don’t.

You have probably heard enough from me for now, but a couple of further ideas:

“How to become a barrister” career days

The Bar Placement Scheme

I'm a barrister and I've done mentoring of kids in your son's position through IntoUniversity - no idea if they have branches outside London but worth a Google. Their aim is to mentor kids to be the first in their family to go to university and they try and put e.g. aspiring lawyers with lawyer mentors.

There are loads of excellent barristers chambers in Leeds, your son should take a look online (everything is online!) and go through their various routes to a mini pupillage.

Paying for a course sounds wrong to me, but I have never heard of the one you mention, it could be more worthwhile than it sounds, I don't know.

Good luck to him. It's a hard job no mistake but if it's the right career for him he won't be able to contemplate a different one

Solicitor here: Just to echo a few points:

• congratulations to you and your son! you sound lovely and supportive and it's great he is doing so well. He should keep aiming high.
• I don't know about this course, but paying for anything seems unwise. People have suggested other free courses from well known places like Sutton Trust.
• law firms and chambers typically don't host students below about 2nd year university for any extended period. I'm sorry he didn't get any responses last year, but it won't have been personal, it will be because he is too young for their formal schemes. A smaller local solicitors' firm might be a better bet for school work experience (I know he wants to be a barrister)
• Another organisation to look at is Aspiring Solicitors (yes, I know, barrister! - but good intro to law generally)

Basically, law can be a brilliant profession - and is trying hard to move away from being about "who you know"/background. But, it is very competitive so good grades above all else (and that does NOT need to be a law degree, but definitely needs to be academic subject), coupled with a reason why you want to be a barrister.

My DD studied law and Cambridge, nobody in our family has ever gone to university and we were in a similar position to you.

She did attend a residential 5 day inspiring excellence law course at Villiers Park (an education charity) when she was in year 12 (lower sixth) which was £325 but was structured so professionally that dd really felt the benefit of it and it gave her the much needed confidence and encouragement to aim high.

The Sutton Trust also run an excellent programme called Pathways to Law which is free. You have to fulfill certain eligibility criteria and the more you fulfill the higher the chance of getting on the course.

Don't worry about not having contacts in the law, if you DS cant get any specific law work experience it wont scupper his chances of applying for a good Uni at all. My DD spent her summer holidays sitting in crown court and following cases from start to finish, reading law related books and keeping up to date on current affairs. She also had a part time job in a bridal shoe shop.

She did take part via her school in the national Bar Mock Trial competition and made it to the national finals so if his school offer this at all then I would encourage him to take part. DD was a "prosecution barrister" and it taught her valuable mooting skills.

Good luck to your DS

Thank you so much for all this information. I will do some research. He is at a selective school and got all level 9s in his mocks - I was told they were the best grades in the year. He got 100% in 4 subjects and the teachers are very encouraging but when it came to work experience he was told to sort his own and 3 local solicitors knocked him back because they had others signed up (relatives and friends children).

I will research and continue to try to get him some experience.

The schools response to his A Level choices was 'that looks ok' and they gave him info about US colleges and scholarships but I woudl much rather him stay in this country as airfares etc are v expensive even if he did get a scholarship.
The school seem useless tbh!

Thanks

Do you mind my asking what his A level choices are?

English Lit, Spanish, History and Maths are his A Level choices. Thanks

I can echo the Sutton Trust OP. My friend's son is doing lots with this at the moment, he is in Y12. Your son will easily be admitted as neither of his parents went to University.

Ex lawyer here, from a state school that was pretty rubbish at careers advice.

I'm also sceptical about the expensive day course - never heard of it, it could be great, but it doesn't sound like the school know what they're doing in general and there are so many outreach schemes that are much less expensive and are definitely run by people who know what they're talking about. For example, if he's interested in Oxbridge, Oxford do plenty of events targeted at kids from state schools, there's a law one which is free to attend and has free accommodation www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate/increasing-access.

At this stage the most important thing for his CV is getting good GCSEs and choosing A levels that will impress universities, if he can show some sort of relevant hobby (something involving public speaking?) all the better. By university interview time it is a very good idea to have something significant and subject-related to talk about, the current mumsnet lawyers might be able to help more with suggestions if work experience really isn't do-able (I didn't do law at undergrad so not best placed to advise, I'd done a science placement and it got me through all my uni interviews).

Once he's at university, in my day big law firms all did paid summer internships which were like a big recruitment exercise, so if that is still going on I wouldn't worry too much about connections - if you've got the academic side sorted, the vacation schemes will get you the exposure you need. Unfortunately if you're working class I don't think there is a way to replicate the school and family network advantages some people have, but if you get into a good uni and present yourself well in vacation schemes you can get ahead without them (I say this as a working class person with none of these networks :) ).

If he's at all interested in Oxbridge I'd really encourage him to apply, you get so much individual support and attention from tutors, the financial assistance tends to be good, and I've found having it on your CV helps with getting interviews.

Good luck!

Those are good academic subject choices OP, which will set him up well for law later on if he continues to be inclined that way.

Another ex-solicitor here. I’d not recommend that course/day based on the little I know - others’ recommendations upthread are better.

I’ll try to reply in more detail when I’m in front of my computer!