Class Discrimination?

[Moomintroll3]

I have noticed the notion of class discrimination being discussed recently R4 has a program on the idea which was interesting. I believe the last Labour Government planned to make it illegal in the same way that disability or racial discrimination are illegal but the tories scrapped the idea when they got it.

I think its a very interesting idea. I think that there can be no doubt that class discrimination exists in the UK and on several levels. We are a very stratified society and the UK is one of the most unequal countries in the developed world. In the UK you can also be rich and successful but if you don't have the right background people will still look down on you.

Even where I am in Scotland where I don't think inequality is quite so extreme as say london there is very little mixing /socialising between the classes. I am from a working class background and have a strong regional accent I did go to uni and I have had my accent mocked and assumptions made about me because of my background. I don't know if any of that held me back directly but I know I was a lot less confident than my middle class peers and that I didn't have the same expectations as them I was just amazed to be at university at all.

I think that sometimes it is assumed that because of the post war boom and many working class people in the 50's and 60's moving into traditionally middle class jobs that the question of classisim was sorted and that issues such as racism and discrimination against the disabled or elderly were focused on. Now looking back the situation in the 50's and 60's was a unique situation, economically driven and didn't really solve the issue of prejudice about class in the UK.

I think that in the past 10 years due to austerity and the nastiness of the british press that any positive image of the working class has been further eroded and we are encouraged to think of strivers and skivers and so on.

I think it would be very difficult legislate for class discrimination, to try and work out what counts and what doesn't, what makes you working class, is it your income, where you came from, what your parents did, if you have a degree etc, then their are questions of cultural capital, confidence and expectation. I also don't think it can be seperated from our current economic model. How can you make class discrimination illegal in a country where the economic system relies upon the stratification of society?

I just wanted to start a conversation about this really and get some views on this issue, what do you think?

Don't you think it's easier though to get AAA at Roedean/Eton etc with (generally) smaller class sizes, and better resources though?

Unless we're going to have blindfold interviews behind a screen with a voice changer...

No, but it's a start isn't it. At least a wider variety of people might get an interview. There is also diversity training and other things that can be done at interview stage.

I rejected th RG offer, completely smashed their entry requirements out of the water.

Working class and said "no thanks".

I don't consider my degree to be of less worth.

Looked at a job board recently, the job I looked at is one which does not need a degree in any way, shape or form.

One advert wanted a degree and clearly stated they preferred a red brick university. Now I dismissed them immediately from consideration as a) don't have a degree but far more important is b) I never want to work for someone who is so limited in their outlook for staff.

why don't you (generic / neutral you) cherish regional accents and dialects?

Because over time traits have been attributed to various accents and some are very negative.

It would be so hard to do unless you do away with interviews altogether.
I’d have no idea what class to call myself anyway, not so easy as knowing I am a woman and knowing I was born in 19XX.

Also I’m another one that does not think a 1st from an average university is worth a 1st from Oxbridge. If you wanted to make it equal you’d have to do standardised testing issued by a universities exam board and with essays all marked by teachers not at that university. Much like A levels and GCSEs. Maybe Edexcel should be setting the papers for all universities.
Universities set their own papers and it’s well known that some subjects at some universities are “easier”. I know they do share tests and a sample of essays and projects with similarly banded universities (but again, banded assumes that a Top 10 is of a different academic standard to a 100-120 university no??) to keep standards similar and to keep grade inflation at bay, but it’s no way standardised.
I’m not saying I support standardisation btw but I’m saying I don’t think all universities are created equal. The universities themselves know that full well.

One thing I guess could be done generally to combat class discrimination is to not see names of candidates for jobs until the decision was taken to progress them to interview or not. In the same way no one puts age on CVs now.

I think the case for name-blind recruitment is unarguable. Institution-blind is more doubtful.

This is a recent article about habits that MC adults have in the workplace which aids them ahead of WC adults. And, more impotantly, the sorts of things that employers and individual mangers should be doing to even things. EG - the academic said that WC students rarely come to his office hours; so he made all students come so it normalised approaching staff etc. Or employers recognising that if they find it harder to find common ground with some rather than others, consider why: is it because you can't chat about skiing or whatever

www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2019/02/class-ceiling-laurison-friedman-elite-jobs/582175/

I don’t agree with institution blind - a 1st from Surrey is not the same as a 1st from Oxbridge or even RG

^I agree

Why? If a degree from Surrey is as good as a degree from Oxford then AAA is the same no matter where the student lives.

This is simply not true! I would say AAA from a deprived inner city school from a pupils living in poverty, working while studying, maybe caring for a parent is worth more than a child who went to Eton with tutors, comfort, opportunity.

Students generally take the same exams in school. In university it's completely different with different curriculums and tutors etc

I have no idea how you would go about defining "class"

I can only look to my own family...my father (graduate engineer) whose parent was a graduate engineer too who always lived in owner occupied housing etc will swear until he is blue in the face that he is working class.
He isn't and has never been.

No private education until our generation but that was largely due to geography. The area the family lived in when my Father was a child had excellent state schools and virtually everyone went there except the landed gentry who boarded.

He regards my siblings and I as "class traitors" for identifying as middle class!!

🤷‍♀️