The death penalty

[Sparrowlegs248]

I've just finished watching Conversations with a killer, the Ted Bundy tapes. I can remember seeing news reports as a child about people being killed by electric chair or lethal injection (I think).

This series didn't go into too much detail about the many murdershe commited, but I understand that they were particularly horrific.

I'm still struggling to get to grips with the death penalty though. The reporting, the crowds gathered and cheering. Some of those involved saying they were elated that he was dead.
I don't really know what I'm hoping for with this thread. Others thoughts maybe. I'm struggling with my own..

I saw Albert Pierpoint (the last hangman in England) taking part in a debate on capital punishment. With all his years of experience being the man who pulled the lever, he was against it.

The death penalty involves the state, in the cold light of day, killing someone. As far as I'm concerned it's unconscionable. Add to that the very clear racism, class-system, industrialized nature of death row in the USA, which loves to execute people, there is no way I'm ever be in favour.

There are some utterly foul and repulsive crimes. And I understand the emotional impulse. But emotion isn't justice, that's revenge.

I suppose that's the thing, some of the people would have been very emotionally involved having heard the awful details, seen the bodies and crimes scenes etc.

I suppose when you know all these details, you may be inclined to agree with it but it just seems so.......wrong.

I watched the Ted Bundy doc and quite a lot sickened me, but what was a shock was the people outside on the day that they executed him, singing, partying etc. Dispicable.

Yes, I know he committed some terrible crimes, but celebrating the death of someone just seems so inhumane.

Either it's wrong to kill someone or it isn't. I don't think it matters whether it's an individual or a state doing it.

The irony of your name

Aw, babies don't know any better. And I didn't kill anyone really, she fell down the stairs and he left the gas on. 👺

I am totally against the death penalty, but I have to admit i am glad Ted Bundy got it.

I know that makes me an awful hypocrite and rationally and logically I am aware that I shouldn’t feel that way.

But my emotional and irrational brain is pleased that he got to experience a tiny bit of the terror he inflicted on his victims.

I don’t feel that way about the death penalty in general though and actually don’t think it has its place in a civilised society.

pleased that he got to experience a tiny bit of the terror he inflicted on his victims. And as long as you aren't the judge, that's OK.

What we have to think about is what sentencing is for, because it cannot do everything. Some outcomes are counter-intuitive. That's why Joe Blogs might be on a jury, but shouldn't decide sentencing guidelines.

Do we want:

Revenge, a satisfying feeling of blood-lust.
Public safety, to keep members of the public as safe from criminals as possible.
Crime reduction. To disincentivize and reduce crime.
Pure justice. Eye for an eye stuff. Equality in punishment (this one is really outdated and doesn't work, and also that's not actually what an eye for an eye means).
To make money (this is what 'justice' in the States is for).
To rehabilitate. To reform criminals into productive members of society.

You cannot have all of those things so it's really important to choose.

Supporters want to show murder is the ultimate crime by having the state carry out murder.

I think our crime statistics prove our currant rehab system doesn't work

I don't agree with the death penalty

It lowers the state to the same level as the criminal

If someone's innocent then you can't bring them back to life, not that Bundy was but in other cases there have been miscarriages of justice

It seems to let the criminal off too easily, they're dead so they don't have to feel remorse or miss their freedom outside. It seems a worse punishment to just never be released from prison to me.

But my emotional and irrational brain is pleased that he got to experience a tiny bit of the terror he inflicted on his victims.

But he probably didn't experience any terror. Most serial killers like Bundy completely lack normal responses to things that would terrify others. Most of them want the death penalty and ask for it. They would rather die then live in captivity.

abbis think our crime statistics prove our currant rehab system doesn't work

But neither does the death penalty. It doesn't seem to be a deterrent when you look at the crime rates of the places that have if.

I think that some people do just deserve it. However, it’s also an easy way out for those given life without parole in my opinion. If I was told I could have life without parole, locked up for 23 hours a day in a 6x9 cell, or just drift off to sleep, then I know what I would pick. Particularly if I had committed the crime at 18. They also shouldn’t bleat about it hurting. Oh diddums. They weren’t bothered about their 10 victims that they stabbed to death 🤷‍♀️

Yes, I get that this may be an unpopular opinion on MN and there have been cases where the person has been found innocent after death but that’s rare. Perhaps they need to suspend the death penalty for, let’s say 5 years, whilst they review everyone who hasn’t confessed. Because let’s not forget, some of them have confessed to their crimes.

I think our crime statistics prove our currant rehab system doesn't work

Because the methods of rehabilitation don't work. There needs to be less of a focus on punishment/reward for good behavior and more of a focus on job training/education and preparing offenders for life outside of prison, as well as a bigger support network once they are out.