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Original poster

A question for actuaries

24 replies

TheMallard · 02/02/2019 09:12

NC for this.

Discussing career progression in our jobs with DH. He's found that where he works there are very few women who program financial models (he's an actuary).

Is that the experience of actuaries on here? If so, any thoughts on why? He's genuinely at a loss.

OP posts:
Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknownowt · 02/02/2019 09:19

What is their company culture like generally?

Just asked my DH & he is saying 40+% of students are women currently...now I know that don't translate exactly but does mean they are being trained & are working somewhere.

topcat2014 · 02/02/2019 09:21

Dsis is one - and senior too - not entirely sure what she does though..
am too thick

Original poster
TheMallard · 02/02/2019 09:29

It's doing the computer modelling in particular that DH was thinking of. Both of us are in professions with plenty of women but where not many seem to do a particular thing within it.

He's a contractor but tends to work for the same company.

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Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknownowt · 02/02/2019 09:30

I go back to talk to him & he's been googling furiously & won't shut up!

DM if you want to check his creds as saying is very outing.

Original poster
TheMallard · 02/02/2019 09:58

What does he think Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknow?

OP posts:
Original poster
TheMallard · 02/02/2019 16:58

Bump.

OP posts:
DreamingofSunshine · 02/02/2019 17:34

It's changing with lots more women going into the field, but the management is dominated by men as there weren't as many women becoming actuaries 20 years ago. There's also the trend that more men than women have taken maths or similar at university, which is needed to become an actuary.

Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknownowt · 02/02/2019 22:18

He thinks that pretty much all students will have to model financial uncertainty, so it might be the particular company not recruiting or just random variation & men dominate.

He definitely knows how many women students there are, due to his job.

Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknownowt · 02/02/2019 22:21

Modelling will be included in the exams, so it can't be avoided from this year.

Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknownowt · 02/02/2019 22:23

If he's interested there are actuarial forums, where it might be interesting to ask. Some US & Acted's in the UK.

Actuariesrus · 02/02/2019 22:42

Actuary here. With DH Actuary too. I started circa 20 years ago when the intake was around 40 per cent women. Very few of the women I worked with are still working as actuaries, almost all the men are. I myself haven't worked for a number of years.

Institute of actuaries had done research that shows that non retiring women leave the profession roughly 15 years earlier than non retiring men. Trust actuaries to analyse their gender imbalance!

Most actuarial women I know have married actuaries and given up work when they have children. The profession has a retention problem, although obviously this will vary between company/specialism.

Even the ones I know who have stayed, including those without children, have often moved to less technical areas, part time etc compared to the men I know.

Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknownowt · 02/02/2019 22:45

There's your answer then...in fact, I'm sure I read that stat & had forgotten. I think their was an article in The Actuary...

Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknownowt · 02/02/2019 22:46

Agh, there!!

Actuariesrus · 02/02/2019 23:02

Honestly, I could go on about this topic at length...

Less women train to become actuaries than men because less women take numerical undergraduate degrees. However, I think recruitment to traineeships broadly reflects this or if anything shows a bias towards female intake.

The issue is that a large number of families find it too tricky to balance family life with two actuarial careers/actuarial plus other professional careers.

Honestly, I am surprised that your DH is not aware of this issue/can't figure it out! Is he still relatively junior/doesn't have many people with children in his team? With the release of gender pay gap figures, this has become a more prominent issue for both consultancies and in-house.

Original poster
TheMallard · 03/02/2019 07:19

It's the financial modelling in particular he was pondering on as he does a lot of Moses development work. He notice in a big meeting on their current project that there were only 2 women- one very senior and one student.

He's well aware of the number of women who become actuaries, which is why the question of why so few go into this particular area.

He's part-qualified but works as a contractor.

OP posts:
Actuariesrus · 03/02/2019 07:43

Ah okay - that makes more sense! I get the question now! My guess would be all the reasons that women don't get very involved in computer programming that much. Very cultural, both from within and outside the profession.

Even when I tried to do more technical work I was pushed back towards 'softer' communicative work. My dissertation was programming, I would have been interested in that type of work but it was always assumed I wouldn't be.

Original poster
TheMallard · 03/02/2019 09:10

Interesting. I'd always thought your profession was more equal than mine (law) but I suppose nothing is perfect.

DH also feels there's an element of needing to talk up one's skills to get into the modelling areas, which men have been shown to be more inclined to do.

OP posts:
Actuariesrus · 03/02/2019 13:39

Law has a much higher female intake than actuarial work on average. But the basic issue of being unable to combine two careers and for children to get enough support and family time covers all the professions. I didn't see overt discrimination but there was alot of drinks down the pub networking/promoting in your own image/assumptions about the type of work people were interested in, going on.

Dox · 03/02/2019 13:59

The profession has a retention problem, although obviously this will vary between company/specialism.
I know nothing about actuaries but have a DD who is looking at this for a career. What are the issues causing poor retention?

Actuariesrus · 03/02/2019 14:08

See previous replies - no different to other professions. Other than lots of actuaries marry other actuaries and can afford to give up work when they have kids more easily than the less well paid careers. If she is mathematically minded it will be no different than any other male dominated careers she might consider.

Whatdoyouknowwhenyouknownowt · 03/02/2019 14:15

I was a wee bit dense about the question, as in the profession I trained in, there was a problem at the recruitment stage & from a recent thread, there still is...

Sounds a bit like the tech industry where there are similar issues of expectation & bias.

Shopgirl1 · 30/03/2019 19:13

I work in an actuarial department, I would say the split of male to female is equal but our modelling team is very male dominated actually, one student there currently, I can only remember one other female there is the last 3 years.

Shopgirl1 · 30/03/2019 19:14

No idea why though. All the trainees should be rotated into it, but it doesn’t seem to happen.

DadDadDad · 30/03/2019 19:45

Hmm, I was going to say that your DH's description is similar to what of I'm aware of where I work, but I think that's because your DH actually works at the same place as me! Grin (I believe we've crossed paths before on MN, but you've changed your name).

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