How can this be right? It isn’t . Martin Lewis on uni costs.

[Dowser]

Watched Martin Lewis tonight as grandson is off to uni in two years.

So...it’s £9000 a year tuition
Then the highest living allowance is presently £8700 per annum

So...if your parents earn over £25k , your maintenance loan is reduced.
Some parents didn’t realise that they were expected to top up to the full amount
One poor lad was attempting to live on £4K . His parents hadn’t realised they were meant to top up

Then there was a young girl who had to leave uni because her mum got a new partner. The students loan went down from full to low and this guy who wasn’t her father, had only been with the mum was expected to pay for someone else’s child. I think there was a shortfall of £5k

Martin Lewis rang up the student loan company and was told it was correct.

He’s looking into it.
I was shocked at that.

I tried to help one of DS's friends with a similar situation. She had been living independently of her parents since 16, supporting herself by working while taking A-levels, sofa surfing or staying with friends. Her parents had moved away, leaving her to fend for herself during her first term in the sixth form. She'd ended up taking the rest of that year off to get a job and starting over again the next year, so she was already a year behind her peers. Yet, when it came to applying for student finance, it wasn't quite enough for the 3 year rule to apply, so her funding was based on her parents' income, despite not having had a penny off them in support during the sixth form.

Here we go with middle class people with no idea of inflation wondering why a student loan in 2019 is not the same as a mortgage in 1980.

The simple fact is Tony Blair conned the whole of society into thinking they needed a degree - doesn't matter what degree, it can be Media Studies at the University of East London (formerly a sock factory in Whitechapel), we all need a degree.

What's needed is a sea-change in society. No, you don't need a 2:1 degree to become an accounts clerk, you need a decent Maths GCSE. No, a 2:1 from North London University (formerly Enfield IKEA) isn't worth the same as a 2:1 at Oxbridge. A three-year university degree should be the preserve of the academic elite: the kids who get A and B at A-Level, not those who are getting C and D at A-Level, they should be actively discouraged from wasting three more years studying (for a given amount of studying).

Kids who aren't at that standard should be getting jobs at 18, not putting it off for another 3 years and devaluing all degrees in doing so.

My son left home then 2 years later decided to go to Uni in London I told him we wouldn't be able to help him we have 5 children between us 2 still at home, he doesn't get the full loans because our income is just over the threshold ( it's a couple of hundred over not thousands) it's hard for him he's doing a fashion degree and says the people who get the best marks are the ones who have a lot of money to spend on materials, I wish I could help him more.

"The vast majority of students are over 18 and therefore independent adults."

Well, no. If you don't have a job, you can't be financially independent, can you?

^So basically my grandson will leave uni with £53k debt aged 21

Our mortgage has never been that much^

Sounds like you need to find out how student finance works. Chances are that he won't pay much of that £53k back. It's not debt, it's an increased tax liability, if his income is high enough, which it isn't for most people.

There's unfairness in the student finance system, but how loans are repaid is generally OK.

My DP tells me off at least once a week because I exhausted myself working through uni because my parents (£250k gross income) wouldn't top up my loan and I never questioned them on
it. I was told I was too young to understand money and that was that. I went to uni 2014-2017 and had £3900 maintenance a year. My accommodation alone was £4000, so they took all my student loan, topped up the other £100 for my rent, then sent me £50 a week to live off.

£50 a week sounds okay but broken down after paying £100 for books, £300 for annual bus pass, stationary etc, plus £20 a month for a cheap phone with contract, plus essential clothes (very northern cold uni so needed a good coat etc) I had very very little to live off. Only went on one night out in my first year because of it. Struggled a lot with anxiety because I didn't make many friends as I couldnt afford to go on nights out, cinema, ski trips, weekend trips to surrounding cities etc. It was very very hard and actually out of the three years I only actually enjoyed my second year, the rest was bloody miserable.

One benefit was I lost 2 stone during my first year cos I couldn't afford meat, fancy foods, or much alcohol.

My son is off to uni this September, he accepted a place today. The only reason he can afford it is because we are lucky enough to be just 5 miles away from his first choice so he can stay at home for the first year at least. A bus goes from right at the end of our street. Plus he is autistic and gets a small amount of PIP so that will help. Otherwise he would never be able to afford it as part time jobs are like hens teeth ( especially for the disabled and cripplingly socially awkward).

I agree that the entire system is a disaster. I remember doing a 60 credit module with the OU in 2005 and it was £450 compared to £3000 ish per 60 credits at my local uni..... and this year it's the same price for OU as a bricks and mortar uni..... How can that price hike be justified?

I am a mature student and after completing my BA and MA my student debt is £59,500 ish. I am doing a Phd this year so now aiming for the £100k mark. And I know full well I am never going to repay that debt, a vast majority of women never do. So I am not worrying about it and just enjoying my education and thinking of it all as monopoly debt.

"What's needed is a sea-change in society. No, you don't need a 2:1 degree to become an accounts clerk, you need a decent Maths GCSE. No, a 2:1 from North London University (formerly Enfield IKEA) isn't worth the same as a 2:1 at Oxbridge. A three-year university degree should be the preserve of the academic elite: the kids who get A and B at A-Level, not those who are getting C and D at A-Level, they should be actively discouraged from wasting three more years studying (for a given amount of studying)."

Maybe you can just select the ones you think are sub-par and send them down the mines?
The more education the better in my opinion.

Obviously it is not fair for new partners, etc to affect entitlement but I do think there should be a means tested element. Why should a family struggling on minimum wage fund the children of the wealthy?

"It's not debt, it's an increased tax liability, if his income is high enough, which it isn't for most people."

How much does someone have to be earning to have to pay it back?
When I was young (pre fees, but they'd just introduced small loans you could get on top of grants or money from parents) it was the average wage, but I've known people much younger than me having to pay it back even when on quite a low income. Did it then go back up again?

ADropofReality is truly vile and does not know what he or she is talking about.

A student should be able to live on 4K. 76 pound a week! Drinks are about a quid at universities and you can easily feed yourself with that too

My ds is off to uni and the cheapest uni accommodation is 110 per week (not London)

How does it work for separated/divorced couples?

I remember over a decade ago when I was in 6th form one girl received the EMA (education maintenance allowance) of around 30 pounds per week, her parents were separated but her father was very wealthy. She lived with her mum who was on a more modest income and was therefore entitled to the money even though she happily admitted she really didn’t have a need for it like the other eligible students in our year.

HellsBellsAndBatteredBananas I'm doing a OU degree atm and my 60 credit module was under a grand, no where near 3k! I've not seen any cost that much!

They have to pay their accommodation out of that @Newbie1981
They're on a minus figure without parental support if they don't qualify for the full maintenance loan.

I think it's unfair that degrees with placements (so no time for a job) don't get the full loan.

Includes rent though!

We could potentially have 2 at University for years on end. Currently only our eldest is there but we pay over 4k for his halls and he took a smaller grant to live off. There was no reduction or any kind of consideration that we still have 3 younger kids at home who we need to buy £400 a year bus passes etc for. I know it was our choice to have four kids and we can afford it as we both work full time in reasonable jobs but for someone on a lower income it would be impossible 25k is nothing for a family to live off.

In N Ireland maximum maintenance loan you can get is around £4,500 pa because we've had no fucking government because it hasn't been reviewed in a few years... my sons accommodation costs are more than that & we need to support everything else.... it's totally wrong, as pp say, they are adults, our income shouldn't come into it!! And, if it has to, surely our outgoings should be considered too!!! Salary level is not an indicator of disposable income by a long way....

I dropped out of a top uni one semester in mainly due to the cost. My DM earnt 50k but was a single parent with no pension and a huge mortgage. She couldn't give me any money and I couldn't afford to stay.

Lucky for me I got a first from a rubbish uni near my DM's house (I lived at home so paid no rent and that made it affordable) and did get onto a great graduate scheme. On paper I should have been OK, we weren't 'poor' but I couldn't afford to stay.

I dropped out of a top uni one semester in mainly due to the cost. My DM earnt 50k but was a single parent with no pension and a huge mortgage. She couldn't give me any money and I couldn't afford to stay.

Lucky for me I got a first from a rubbish uni near my DM's house (I lived at home so paid no rent and that made it affordable) and did get onto a great graduate scheme. On paper I should have been OK, we weren't 'poor' but I couldn't afford to stay.

I think you are right ADropofReality, Blair did con the whole of society. Rather than a sensible situation, where academic people go to university and there are good paths to well paid and interesting employment for everyone else regardless of wealth, I suspect the upshot will be that eventually only the children of the very rich will go to university, they will nab the best jobs (however little work they do for their mediocre degree) and bright kids without financial backing won't get a look in.

clairstandish - This is similar situation for my ds's friend who is at Uni. he gets the top level of student finance because he officially lives with his mum who is in a low paid job yet his dad is very well off but his income doesn't seem to count for student finance at all.

My latest 60 credit OU mod is in the region of £2700. I'm on my final module and I've never seen one for under a thousand.

In the next four years I'll have two at uni.