Is the EU undemocratic?

[Yogurty]

I have a question: why do some people believe that the EU is undemocratic?

Quite a few people have told me that the EU is undemocratic, and/or unaccountable, but haven't been able to explain to me precisely why.

Op why don't you Google it..
The eu like anything else is open to pay offs, corruption, lobbyists... Bad politicians etc etc

I'm sure it is - but are MEPs and European officials more likely to be so than UK MPs and officials? Are the EU political structures less democratic than UK's?

I have in fact Googled it in various ways, including asking "Is the EU undemocratic?"; at the top of the list is an article in the Guardian, which argues that it isn't. But the Guardian supported remaining in the EU. I'm hoping that someone who is in favour of leaving could tell me why they think that the EU is undemocratic.

I'm not implying that everyone who wants to leave the EU thinks that it's undemocratic, by the way.

The EU has a very clearly defined democratic structure divided into 3 parts - the Council of Europe, the European Parliament and the European Commission. The Council is made up of the leaders of the member states and the most important decisions are taken at this level. The Parliament is made up of elected MEPs from each member state - the number of MEPs each member state has is based on population size. The Commission is not a decision-making body but drafts legislation that must then be voted on in Parliament. Voting is done either by unanimity - every member state must agree, or by qualified majority voting - a certain proportion of votes must be in favour.

Any claims about lack of democracy that I have heard seem to be based on the Commission not being elected or the issue of Qualified Majority Voting. The first issue just shows a lack of understanding - it doesn't matter if the Commission are unelected because they are not able to pass legislation. The second seems to suggest that member states can be railroaded into things they don't want by QMV. In reality, only minor legislation is passed by QMV, all significant legislation must be passed by unanimity. I posted a link recently which showed which areas must be voted on unanimously - I'll see if I can find it.

These are the areas under which the Council of Europe, ie leaders of the member states, must agree unanimously:

Common foreign and security policy (with the exception of certain clearly defined cases which require qualified majority, e.g. appointment of a special representative)

citizenship (the granting of new rights to EU citizens)

EU membership

harmonisation of national legislation on indirect taxation

EU finances (own resources, the multiannual financial framework)
certain provisions in the field of justice and home affairs (the European prosecutor, family law, operational police cooperation, etc.)

harmonisation of national legislation in the field of social security and social protection.

Guardian article here

Thank you, Dippy. That''s a really clear and succinct explanation as to why the EU is democratic. But I think I'm trying to ask a different question, which is: "Why is the EU undemocratic?"

The EU being an undemocratic, unaccountable entity to which the UK has ceded power seems to be a fairly recurrent theme when people tell me why we should leave, but no-one has ever been able to explain to me exactly why. People generally just get cross when I push for an explanation, or they say it's all about 'taking back control'.

Sprouting - thank you. That's the article I was referring to. But it's really an explanation of what is democratic about the EU, rather than what is undemocratic. It concludes that the difficulty is that 'voters mistrust the EU and are unfamiliar with its unusual structure and multiple presidents', but that's an issue of perception and understanding, rather than a lack of democracy.

Maybe there isn't a reason. I was hoping there might be though since so many people seem to believe it.

Interesting article. At the end of it, is says that the EU isn't perfect, but could be improved, but it doesn't say how.

I think part of the problem is comparing the democracy of nations with the democracy of an international institution as they have different functions so it's hard to understand how it works. Doubtless it could be improved but there are no other similar institutions to compare it to and it is always going to be tricky to balance the needs of 28 members.

But I think I'm trying to ask a different question, which is: "Why is the EU undemocratic?" I did try to answer that .

From my experience, complaints seem to be about the unelected commission - which is just down to a poor understanding of the mechanisms.

As regards ceding sovereignty, member state governments have chosen to cede sovereignty in some very specific areas, mainly trade regulations, for economic and efficiency reasons. There are other areas - environment, worker's rights - but they are linked to trade and business.

The vast majority of policy that affects our day-to-day day lives - health, education, domestic transport, taxation etc, are decided solely by national governments.

I have found that if you push most people who complain about the undemocratic nature of the EU to give you an example of what bothers them, they generally can't. Or they cite examples that are actually nothing to do with the EU. Eg, I have heard people complain about zero-hours contracts, but these are in fact banned in several EU member states.

For me it's because each country only votes for their own MEPs. They have no democratic power over the representatives of the other member states.

So in the UK we can elect our MEPs but just have to accept the MEPs from all of the other countries.