#metoo and such

[Lushlemming]

Only because we were discussing it at lunch today in work.

A colleague pointed out that the whole #metoo movement and the associated fallout seems to exist only in the media and ina very small number of real life situations.

What I mean is that in my office, which is rather large, about 40 or so, slightly more women than men, maybe 60/40 split, there is no let up in the interaction and banter (sexual) between colleagues. Several are sleeping with eachother and it changes daily and is a source of much gossip and amusement.

And I havent seen any thing in real life which seems to fly with the whole idea that men are scared to approach women and that women will report any man who tells them that they have nice perfume or whatever. The media would have us believe that all offices are barren sexless, joyless places where men are petrified and women are on the warpath just waiting to cry abuse.

Has anybody actually experienced whats being portrayed in the media?

Are your husbands, boyfriends, sons, male friends apprehensive when interacting with women?

Do you or your female friends, family, colleagues actually call out men on their behaviour?

I realised I have never seen it happen in real life. Today for instance a colleague came back from holiday all tanned and bleached hair, straight away everybody was joking (male and females) about tan lines, whit bits, you get the picture. The colleague in question was teasing one of the men about taking him into her office and letting him see the "little bit which isn't tanned" implying she had been sunbathing topless. All good fun and nobody took any offence.

Is my office just not with the programme or do you guys get what I mean about not seeing anything in real life which the media seems to suggest is everywhere?

I've never ever known a workplace like that. Consensual relations and genuine "banter" are not what #metoo is about in any way shapes or form. The movement is about stopping men abusing women, using them for sex to get what they want, harassing them and raping them. It's about encouraging people to call out bad behaviour (and yes I do call men out on sexism)

I don't know a woman IRL who hasn't either been raped, sexually assaulted or sexually harassed though, with varying degrees of severity.

Gunpowder.

Thanks for the reply. But that's exactly what I mean. I dont know anybody who has been raped, assaulted or abused. And as I said, surely most of the women I work with even me, should be appalled at the things the men in our office say to us. But we're not. That's my point. I can't inagine where you must live or who you have in your life to say the say the things you did.

Why didn't the guy I spoke about feel abused for being told a colleague was going to expose themselves to him? If the roles were reversed would it have been different?

But I just cant ever think of a time I have ever felt abused by a man or ever seen any woman I personally know take any offence or be assaulted. How is that? How is it that some women seem to have serial abusive partners, know loads of women who have been assaulted and others like me don't?

You don't know a single woman that hasn't been groped or touched against her will, somewhere like a night club? Or had lewd comments shouted at her by a group of workmen or drunken blokes on a night out? Had a creepy bloke sit next to her on a bus and sit just that bit too close? Or been followed down the street?
You dont know a single woman this has ever happened to?

Yes, I do think women are more inclined to call men out for sexism and gross words/behaviour. It's a frequent topic of conversation among me and my female friends. One friend confronted a man recently who had done something she was uncomfortable with, and I actually know a handful of women, myself included, who've publicly come out about the behaviour of someone in our industry, proper metoo-style. The man was ostracised as a result, people were appalled by what he'd done. Likewise I also don't know any women who haven't AT LEAST been leered at or groped against their will, but more serious instances of harassment or assault have happened to most women I know. And it's nothing to do with who you know or where you live - I've lived in four different cities and my social group has been fluid as a result, mixing with people from all walks of life. Misogyny doesn't discriminate

Yeah I suspect people just aren't telling you.

It doesn't matter where people are from, I have lived both a lower working class and upper middle class life. I've worked in pubs and universities and hospitals and offices. I've known women who have been sexually assaulted in all settings.

I simply don't believe you've never been sexually harassed. I don't believe you've never been to a nightclub or bar and had your bum felt by a random man passing. Maybe you don't feel bothered about this, but it is assault. You also sound like you're insinuating women who have experienced sexually inappropriate behaviour are somehow to blame - 'how is it that women like me have never had this'?

Well if u enjoy the atmosphere of sexual liberation, banter, as well as being entirely free if women who have been assaulted; that's great news. However, it isn't how the rest of the world is unfortunately. And just because you work I such an environment so free from all the ugly goings on in some world you can't possibly believe exists, don't ask us to somehiw xonvi ce u it does.

That should read convince you...Not the random chain of letters i seem to have typed

You say that you don’t know anyone who’s been sexually assaulted- I’ve been sexually assaulted many a time (and seriously as child) but no one else knows this.

I dont know anybody who has been raped, assaulted or abused.

Yes you do, they just havent told you. They might not have recognised it themselves.

Fucking hell, OP. I’m struggling with whether this is abject lack of imagination, abject lack of empathy or just a straightforward egocentric social view. Good grief.

Even if you didn’t know anyone who had never directly been affected as a victim by any aspect associated with #metoo (and here’s the hint: people don’t tend to use it as a conversation starter...), that would be called chance. And a frankly rare one at that.

Out of interest OP, are you in your twenties or thereabouts? And work with quite a lot of other young people?

Why didn't the guy I spoke about feel abused for being told a colleague was going to expose themselves to him? If the roles were reversed would it have been different?

To be blunt - yes. Women don't have a history of abusing men behind closed doors in way that starts with "banter" about showing their genitals in a closet. They don't fear women in a way women fear predatory men, and as a class women don't pose a danger to men the way men as a class do to women.

In the UK:

1 in 4 women experience DV
1 in 5 experience sexual assault
1 in 10 are raped.

The above is a result of men's behaviour, the same men responsible for 96% of violent crime and 98% of sexual violence.

Flirting in the office doesn't in any way negate the dangers men pose to women.

And I can guarantee that you know someone who's been raped or sexually assaulted - they just aren't telling you, and TBH it's no wonder with your attitude.

I'm always suspicious of these type of posts and I always presume they're either a MRA thinking they're clever and can go "gotcha" or someone desperately wanting to be told they're soooo cool not like those pesky feminists