Maths and statistics bods: how hard is this?

[Bishalisha]

I’m thinking of applying to do a university course with the University of London. A course that has academic direction from the LSE. I’m thinking of either doing the ‘accounting and finance’ or ‘banking and finance’ degree.

Once I complete my AAT level 4 I will be exempt from 2 modules of the first year. However, from looking in more depth, the maths module sounds pretty essential.

The entry requirement regarding maths is grade C GCSE, which I achieved over 12 years ago. In the normal paper rather than the higher ones.

I’ve attached some screen shots from what I would be learning about in the maths and statistic courses. Am I setting myself up to fail?

I am very good at studying, and have so far achieved distinction and merits in the AAT level 4 so far. I’m not sure if this sounds incredibly difficult or if I’m just feeling intimidated by the unknown?

Link to university course: london.ac.uk/banking-and-finance-standard-route

Link to information from the AAT: www.aat.org.uk/qualifications/university-london

This is about the level of A-level Further Maths. So more advanced than a “first” Maths A-level (Though also a lot narrower so much less “volume” to cover) but not really degree level. Have you ever covered any differentiation in the past? How long would you have to do this course?

It depends how much you're willing to work now as you're going to have to probably relearn some of your GCSE material first before moving to the higher level.

When it comes to differentiation, integration and matrices you will find that it's moved into a more abstract world than GCSE and it may be worth paying for some tuition to make sure you really get the underlying principles.

The stats side doesn't look as challenging

The syllabus description gives the impression that it builds up gradually from high school maths before introducing some new concepts. Even if GCSE was a while ago, it looks like it's designed to ease you in gently. I think you'll be fine, don't be intimidated by this.

I would have 6 years in total. So in theory I could dedicate a full academic year to preparing for the exams in regards to the above modules

It sounds doable, it's work they are going to teach you, not that you are expected to know, although you might need to work hard at it. It would be a good idea to revise your maths GCSE though.

That first page looks pretty serious. Someone who tried their very hardest at maths GCSE, with good teaching, and just about scraped a C would be screwed with that syllabus. However, if your GCSE teaching was a bit substandard or there were other reasons why you only got a C then who knows what might be possible. Some very competent academics simply cannot get their heads round calculus even if well taught, but some people who struggled with maths at GCSE are perfectly competent when they have a go as adults: they just had a mental block at school. I’d suggest hitting BBC Bitesize or maybe Khan Acadademt on a couple of topics to see what you think. Take it slow.

At school, I mainly bunked off maths and only started taking my education seriously in the last year. I had a tutor for about 4 months before my GCSE’s. I probably would have done better had I have actually made more effort in the years prior (I was too interested in boys and skunk at that age unfortunately!)

School was ofstead ‘inadequate’ whilst I was there (to give a bit more context)

Go for it, but as already said, do revise the basics first.

I'd fully agree that you'd want to start revision with GSCE and build from there. Depending on the format/applications of use, then it could be challenging, i.e., are you just required to apply those methods (somewhat blindly as many students do), or required to have a deeper understanding of the methods, how they are derived, etc.

On the positive side, there are many excellent text books available now in the maths field. Also, being older tackling such material should be an advantage. And the fact that you are even asking such questions is good!

The material listed is also constrained, not too broad, and a lot of it useful in practice.

A good tutor/support will make all the difference.

Well in that case you may well be fine. I’d perhaps get a couple of CGP GCSE books and spend a couple of hours checking yourself out before you commit to the course.

I agree anyone who scraped a c at gcse would probably struggle unless they had a very poor teacher or weren’t really trying.
We did differentiation & integration in A’level in 1980 so it’s sort of half way to degree level I think.

I think the tutor I had was the only reason I achieved a C (I’m sure sure where about within a C I achieved). The school was honestly horrendous- it was closed down and reopened as an academy a few years after I left.

Fingers crossed I should be taking my final AAT exam around March/April time. Perhaps after that I could buy some GCSE maths books and begin revisiting that area over the 6 months from ending AAT and beginning the course?

I think it would take more than a year to get from GCSE grade C standard to mastering the content on the above syllabus tbh, especially as you took GCSE 12 years ago so would not be at that standard now.

That’s mostly A-level content and even kids with A at GCSE in the previous year struggle to get to grips with it.

They say their entry requirement is a C, but how many students with a C actually pass?

You might be better in not devoting a full year to maths modules straight away but take them in a couple of years and brush up your GCSE maths to a decent standard before starting alongside different modules?

I did an economics undergraduate and postgraduate without a level maths, and while I did well at gcse, I never really ‘got’ maths, iyswim. Consequently, I was terrified about the maths element of the economics courses. It was fine in the end, I finally overcompensated by studying calculus and stats much more intensively than my other modules (I was good at studying too, and that was what made the difference). They were the ones in which I got the highest marks.

In terms of the maths level I'd say depending on the complexity it builds to A-Level/ 1st year degree levels maths - that being said I can't be sure as it isn't a pure maths course. The good thing about maths is that it does build from the bottom, so if you attend all your lectures and ask questions to your tutors as you have them you should be okay!

Also there is a wealth of really good maths lecturing/questions on youtube and online now if you are stuck which wont come to a financial cost.

I definitely think you can do it - if you are worried about it I'd recommend going over GCSE syllabus and A-Level syllabus in the mean time, before starting to build up your knowledge in advance.

I'm sure you can smash it :)

As PPs have said, it looks like A Level maths/further maths stuff. It has been a while since I've had to do any maths revision, but I remember watching videos on Youtube (Patrick JMT and Khan Academy in particular) was much more helpful to me than reading text books. It isn't advanced enough that you'd have difficulty finding plenty of helpful material online, so I say go for it!

What are you hoping to do after it? I think this is key.

I’m hoping to get into the accounting/finance/banking industry after.

Accountancy would be most suitable as I’m already experienced in that area, however I don’t want to do an accountancy degree- even if I did the maths and stats modules would still be required.

My thinking is also that studying as an adult is different as to when you’re studying at school- I actually WANT to do it and I WANT to do well, whereas when I was at school I didn’t want to be there and couldn’t be bothered.

When they reopen after Christmas I should have more details.

I’m thinking along the lines of completing my AAT my April, cracking straight onto the GCSE maths syllabus and if I have to take the maths and stats modules in year 2 (of 6 years) I could try to study maths and stats alongside the first year modules but leave the exams as long as possible to give myself as much time to get up to date. I might be panicking over nothing and doubting myself.

Fingers crossed but I am determined!

A level/further A-level (can't comment on the statistics side though as I did mechanics)
Depends how high marks you need to pass.

I know when I did A-levels there were people who got A at GCSE (at end of year 10) and A at A/S (end of year 11) who didn't fully understand some of those.
It also depends on the exam. If, for example, it says "integrate this using parts" you may be able to work to a formula and be able to get enough right.
If it just says "integrate this by whatever method you need" you will find it much harder. That is what a lot of my friends struggled with. They could do the work, just working out what method to use foxed them.

I would agree with Noble in that working up to this after getting a C at GCSE 12 years ago (and not even doing the higher band so you will have quite a lot of that to cover too) seems too much for a year.

I would suggest working up to GCSE level A (or level 9 which is harder) in the next year (no need to take the exam unless you want to) and if that has gone well, aim to do the syllabus above in the following two years.

Thank you everyone for your feedback, it has been really helpful.

I’ll speak to the course leader in the new year and see what they recommend but my thinking so far is...

after I complete my final AAT exam (March/April) I’m going to purchase a GCSE maths distance learning course with tutor support with the aim of relearning the syllabus and the additional higher paper content

If realistically, a level maths is needed and I’d be setting myself up to fail with only the above then I’ll aim to do the a level syllabus via distance learning before revisiting the idea of the course

It’ll be worth doing regardless as the whole idea of doing the degree in the first place is with a specific career in mind after and lack of maths knowledge will ultimately hold me back.

A-level maths won’t be needed before starting the course - a lot of the syllabus is A-level maths so you’d just be duplicating effort. It’s a great idea to work on higher GCSE though - if you can get up to a grade 7+ level you’ll be well-placed to take the module.

Thanks @noblegiraffe! The fire in my belly has been well and truly lit!

Studying today to get my remaining AAT exams out of the way so I can crack on with maths!

As others have said, this looks like A-Level Maths heading towards Further Maths. I did Further Maths many years go and found it a huge step up from A-Level Maths - basically my mathematical ability ran out after the 'easy' bits of Further Maths. So my advice would be not to underestimate the challenge.