How long would you give someone for murder?

[Porla]

A) pre meditated
B) heat of the moment
C) manslaughter/accidental

Would you change your sentence if it involved a child or otherwise vulnerable person?

I’ve been thinking a lot about sentencing guidelines recently. The thread the other day about David McGeary seemed to show such a strong support for never realising someone like him who committed such an awful crime. Then today I was reading that Rosdeep Adekoya is out on day release getting ready for full release and it seems like only yesterday she was sentenced.

Shouldn’t the sentencing guidelines of a country loosely follow the general feeling of its citizens? If the vast majority feel like murderers don’t serve enough time, shouldn’t guidelines be changed to reflect that?

So many variables to consider.

Someone who walks down the road one day, grabs a child and kills them...life meaning life. No chance of rehabilitation and should never be free again.

A drug dealer who murders another drug dealer...decades probably but should have a chance at being free again one day. Someone like this is much less of a threat to an innocent member of the public than the example above.

Woman who murders her abusive husband in the heat of an argument. I think some jail time should be served but not decades.

Two blokes having a punch up outside a pub...no intention to kill, just a fight but one punch proves to be fatal...definitely prison time but not decades.

So many variables its really hard to say.

A) Death Sentence - if only we had it here!

B and C totally depend on the circumstance.

I imagine some behave themselves in prison because they know they'd get beaten up otherwise, whereas when they are out in society they'll seek out the weak and vulnerable to harm them. Just because they can behave themselves when someone twice their size is looking at them sideways, it doesn't mean they're fit for society.

DonaldDuck that's a good point. I was just basing the category on the first murder being unplanned. The 2nd and 3rd and events after were premeditated. Either way that case sickens me.

Me too Eggnog one of those that always sticks with you that one

I don't believe in state mandated murder - the death penalty is barbaric.
All crimes of murder need to be judged on the circumstances. A woman subject to years of DV may commit a pre-meditated murder if she is not strong enough to retaliate while being attacked and too broken by abuse to leave... each case should be judged and sentenced appropriately, there is hope for rehabilitation.

A civilised country should have a legal system that is not subject to the whims of public opinion. I don't think our judiciary are representative enough, reform is needed but not mob justice.

Too many variables to give a 100% answer. I do think, on the whole, that taking someone else’s life if it’s premeditated or a heat of the moment act of violence type scenario deserves a very lengthy sentence where they are unlikely to ever be released, or if they are then they will be elderly and forced to wear a tag for the rest of their days.
I don’t know if agree with the American system where young kids get life without parole sentence for murder as I would like to think they could be rehabilitated with extensive therapy etc. It’s difficult to say without knowing the ins and outs of each specific case and whether or not they pose a threat long term

a) Life, and life should mean LIFE, so until the person dies of natural causes/old age, no chance of parole
b) Again life, if for example someone stabbed/beat to death a person in an argument - shook a baby to death etc, minimum of say 40 years
c) Completely depends on circumstances, ie. if a child ran out suddenly on to a busy road & was hit by a non- speeding law abiding vehicle driver then that would prove very difficult to pass sentence on...
Not sure where I stand on the death penalty, I think I would feel very strongly 'for it' if someone murdered my child and they were proven guilty beyond reasonable doubt for example...

If you kill a child you should live the child's potential life span in prison

I had never heard of the David McGreavy case, my god, how the hell that monster can be allowed to walk free is complete and utter madness. He should have rotted till the end of his days in a cell with no window.
There is no rehabilitation for a human being if you can call him that like that. Urgh I feel sick.

A - life with no chance of parole
B - a minimum of 30 years
C - it depends on the circumstances

I would also do away with concurrent sentences, they should all be consecutive. I wouldn't give credit for a guilty plea or a reduced sentence for good behaviour - I would prefer to see time added on for poor behaviour

A, B and C - jailed indefinitely.

Irregardless of the reasons, you've still taken someone's life.

Just read the Rosdeep Adekoya headline as well... Beat her 3YO son TO DEATH and hid body in suitcase in woods?? And free on day release just 5 years... Jesus Christ. Stop the world I want to get off...

Life = For the rest of their life
I don't understand concurrent sentencing, makes no sense to me, it should be consecutive to have any meaning or purpose.
I certainly not convinced rehabilitation actually works, just what does it me? How on earth do you determine whether someone is safe to release or not? Just because the individual appears 'changed'?
Sentences of 99 years with no parole might deter a few.

I remember more than 20 years ago a case where the mother shot her daughters killer dead right in the courtroom in Germany. I can understand that. I also don't believe that such a person needs rehabilitation (because no more daughter) or that she was a danger to society. She got sentanced to six years. She was fine with that.

I can find empathy for some murder cases.

Like if they were driving and at the last second, someone walked out in front of them, then not life for that because depending on speed and situation it's difficult to avoid something like that

That isn’t a crime, it’s an accident. There’s be no prosecution or sentence in the situation above.

If they were breaking driving laws at the time of the accident- on phone, speeding etc, then yes, it would be a crime and yes i would see them sentenced for manslaughter/murder.

Dear God, did anyone like RealJudas think I support capital punishment? I was despairing at all the Daily Mail reading ignoramuses.

About an hour, then I'd give up, and go and do it myself.

Fuck, I didn't realise Rosdeep Adekoya was going to be released so soon. So Ben Butler beats his six year old daughter to death and he's sentenced to a minimum of 23 years. Whereas Rosdeep Adekoya beats her three year old son to death AND stuffs his body in a suitcase and dumps him like he's trash, and she's out walking the streets four years later? That's just wrong, she's even more evil than Butler.

@lostinjapan I’m honestly dumbstruck

Unbelievable she’s being considered for release, that poor boy, what justice for him? Makes me so angry and sad.

"Fortunately these matters are decided by wise, educated and experienced people"

If you read the thread about, News stories that have stayed with you, in all of the violent worse ones, the perpetrator has prior convictions for similar offences.

So I don't put faith in,
""Fortunately these matters are decided by wise, educated and experienced people" "

When I'm reading about Rapists going free and the offences against children that get very little punishment, I don't have faith in our justice system of keeping us safe.

I think cases should be decided on the details. Many manslaughter cases are worse than some Murders.

I like the Chinese sentencing of sex offenders to 100 years, with Parole after 60.

Theres been many extreme DV cases, were by chance the Woman has lived, yet a five year sentence has been given.

Judges seem reluctant to impose maximum sentences and not just because it gives rise to legal challenges.

I don't have faith in the Judges and I think sentencing should reflect the feeling of horror. Especially in cases like Baby P's 'step dad'.

Its right to rehabilitate some people, but it's equally right that others should die in Prison.

lostinjapan, they are very different cases.

She wasn't charged with Murder and isn't considered a danger to others.

Ben Butler is a very dangerous Man.

I agree that she should have a load of conditions put on her and should have served half her sentence as a full custodial one.

A - They stay locked up until the person they killed comes back to life and can go back to their family.

B - See above.

C- depends on the circumstances. In my opinion, most cases of manslaughter are just accidents. Not sure how prison solves anything. Absolute explicit gross negligence, where it was obviously a case of when, not if. Then I would say five years.

@Birdsgottafly I followed both cases very closely, so I’m aware of all the details. And I think she was let off extremely lightly, probably because she’s female. I don’t think anyone on Mumsnet would say that a father who, in sound mind, beat their child to death over three days then dumped their body in a suitcase, was no longer a danger just four years later. And if she’s no longer a danger, does that mean she should be allowed to go on and have (and keep) more children?