Goodnight, Mr Tom......

[BertrandRussell]

...too much for imaginative, sensitive 8 year old bookworm? I’m inclined to think so.....

I don't think anyone is saying we shouldn't let child ldeeb read sad books. Just that we should "temper the wind to the shorn lamb".........

Bert what about Swalliws and Amazons? There are some beautiful facsimile hardbacks around at the moment if that’s your thing?

Or E. Nesbit?

As for the Green Knowe books - I love these took, but how on earth are they better?!

Perhaps they're not. I nominated them because they were some of my favourite books as a child and they didn't make me cry! I kinda forgot to account for human variation.

Oh, no, I love them too!

My point is more that, when I think about it, a lot of the books I loved as a child did have sad bits. I totally agree with waterbird that the bit about Tom's wife and child is so sad too. As he watches helplessly as the 'old, familiar colour of scarlatina spread across their faces'.

But I think it is wrong to think children don't need and/or can't cope with sadness. Children aren't actually the 'shorn lambs'. We are. Seriously! Don't you find you're much more sensitive to things about dying mums/children one you have children? I never used to be.

Huckleberry Finn , Mark Twain

My favourite kids book of all time. Always makes me feel so cosy. (Good bits obviously). One thing that confuses me is his mum sewing him into his underwear (vest stitched to his kecks). Why? It's the only book I've ever read that in. She says in the letter Tom reads that she has sewn him in for the winter.

This was my favourite book as a child and I bought it for mine. I think they both also read it in year 5 as part of the curriculum at school.

Sometimes it is good for children to read sad books and realise that not everyone in the world is kind.

Nope. I haven't let my DD (11) read it and I would have complained if the school had made her read it in Year 5. Primary school kids do not need to read about dead babies.

Read it with my 10 yr old. Both traumatised by how poor it was. Likewise, Hitler Stole Pink Rabbit. Mawkish, cliched. How about Michelle Paver’s Wolf Brother series? Atmospheric, evocative.

cheddar, it was quite common. My dad (born in 1950) knew of children who were 'sewn in'. By then it was seen as a definite social indicator and to do with slum children.

snow, really?! I think When Hitler Stole Pink Rabbit is excellent! Especially considering it's her third (fourth?) language. The later books in the series are good too.

(Also, how can an autobiography be 'cliched'? Obviously it's not a new story - but that's what it was.)

I've definitely read real examples of sewing in. I can't remember the full detail in GMT but in real life I think you were wrapped in paper and grease (or something along those lines) and then the underwear sewn together to hold it in place. It was for insulation in the cold months if you couldn't afford heating and warm clothes.

Not the subject-matter - obviously the effects of war upon children is not cliched - but the writing is sentimental and cloying. Good Night Mr Tom is a family joke for that reason.

I really don't think it is sentimental or cloying. Obviously it's personal taste, but I'm surprised.

Jasper what was done about bathing or toiletting? Was it like putting a swimsuit on?

Get E Nesbit 'The Enchanted Castle'. My DS(6) has just devoured Stig of the Dump and ia reading Tom's Midnight garden and I'm gleefully hanging onto The Enchabted Castle until an appropriate moment. I adored it as a child. Magical and exciting but not too dark. I think he'll love it. I'm also planning on Just William books and little houae on the prairie

But I think it is wrong to think children don't need and/or can't cope with sadness. Children aren't actually the 'shorn lambs'. We are. Seriously! Don't you find you're much more sensitive to things about dying mums/children one you have children? I never used to be.

Depends on the child.
I could never cope with overly sad stories. Probably wouldn't have read an eighth Harry Potter novel because the many deaths just broke my heart, and I wouldn't have wanted to know who else dies in a sequel.

There's children who like dark stories and aren't affected by them, but since Bertrand says the child is sensitive ...

Children have no children of their own, but reading about a boy who can't protect his baby sister would be rather upsetting for a child who has a baby sibling.

Just because a child is capable of reading somethng it doesn’t mean they are ready to understand it properly or can process it.

I have regular arguments about this at work, where people seem to think that because Of Mice and Men is no longer on the GCSE syllabus then it’s just tickety to teach it to Year 8. Maybe I’m old fashioned, but I don’t think 12 year olds need to know, amongst other things, about visits to brothels and why a man would keep his hand in a glove of Vaseline to keep it soft for his wife.

Fair point hestia, though I think plenty of 'sensitive' children would like this story. I guess what I am getting at is that it isn't necessarily about being 'sensitive'. I'm trying to say that I think for adults, the image of the child cuddling his dead baby sister is so utterly horrific and tragic, we react a certain way. But people on this thread have recommended other books that also include fairly horrible scenes of children dying, and they somehow seem less bad. I'd suggest the difference is actually that, as adults, we react more dramatically to the storyline where we know the mother has done something awful. I am not convinced all children would do the same, sensitive or not.

cheddar I am not one hundred percent sure - I get the impression there may have been some form of 'access' left to allow going to the toilet. I imagine that it was not ideal and sewn in children didn't remove the layers to bath. There are accounts of children evacuated from slums in ww2 who were found to be filthy with nits and sores. GTM touches on this more than some other, even adult, fiction about that period.

It must have stunk - I always think that historical fiction and TV never manages to get across the smell that some people had to endure.

@LDRFeministDragon
Yes. The very, very descriptive part about the scarletina was unnecessary. Tom could have just told Willie that they had died, without going into much detail.
I really enjoyed When Hitler Stole Pink Rabbit, too. There were some very humourous parts to it, as well. I didn't know there were more books in the series. I was always curious about what would happen to Anna once she got to London, because IIRC the war was far from over.

AFAIK, Tom didn't tell Willie that they'd died in that detail. That was his internal monologue on the subject.

GMT made me cry at that bit, at Zach's death and the most famous sad bit in the cupboard.

I shall live in hope of a grandchild, niece or nephew who shares my love of the classics after reading this thread!

I think the pp above has a good point about our views on death etc since becoming mothers. I thought lots of the books mentioned were sad when I was a child but moved on as I had no concept of that in real life, now as an adult and a parent I think about the stories more and ca n sob over them or be traumatised because of replacing them to my own children.

My dc just look at me askance, even though they agree it's sad. I also agree with the pp who say that maybe exploring death through reading may help with some situations that hopefully a child won't have to deal with in real life.

Has anyone read Lucy Mangan's Bookworm? I can recommend it!