Primary teachers! how do I talk to school over 'overworking' of 6yr olds

[waterrat]

I know teachers work incredibly hard and I know that the year 2 sats are a pressure on them and the school.

But my heart is breaking for my boy coming out of school more than once this week and sobbing . He told me 'mummy I'm not allowed to daydream I hate school I have to just learn all day'. He kept saying - no daydreaming allowed. He says its boring, maths is boring its too hard his hand hurts from writing.

I am aware that kids moan - but he is six yeaars old and usually a very enthusiastic child. He is not averse to a bit of effort either - I HATE this system - I wish he was given the chance for free play/ learning through play at least some down time in class with lego or craft etc - why is play removed so early?

I am going to speak to his teacher - but what can I ask? I would feel like a bad parent and irresponsible person if I just bumbled along ignoring his unhappiness but it feels futile even complaining about it.

Wineinbathtub
They do lots to keep the learning active and engaging. Primary teacher's, especially ks1 are really skilled in that area.
It's why I think it's a sketchy route to go down when people start excusing children not listening to the teachers because bet your bottom dollar when their child isn't doing well they are usually the first to start asking what the teacher. It nurtures a mindset of 'but my darling is a child and they can't help... what are you doing about it... I appreciate they may not pay attention and may ignore instructions so why aren't you giving them 1-1 to make sure they understand everything'.

You're right some days can be taxing. I know my a level students have some days (one when they have a triple of my subject, one with me and 2 with the other teacher) it's really tough on them. But it wouldn't cross my mind to mention lack of focus if it's a case of being a bit tired once a fortnight.
I would only mention staring into space, not focusing, not paying attention to instructions etc if it was a frequent occurrence.

Have a quiet word with the teacher. My daughter broke down in tears twice leading up to the first sats tests. Turned out they were really pushing the kids in terms of their learning especially the higher performing children before the sats - so sad that children get in this state at this young age - it's the system which is just ridiculous. I had a quiet word with my daughter's teacher because it was so unlike my DD to burst into tears about learning.

In lreland 6 year olds would have a lot of constructive play and lots of creative stuff going on. They also finish school an hour earlier .
Eventually their standards are fine as they move up through the years. Actually l have never had a child come from the UK who wasn't quita a bit behind at roughly 9 to 10. We also have to teach a second language..lrish from day 1.
I can never get over how horrendous the UK system is and l am gone through a lot of changes here teaching well over 30 years.
And daydreaming is an important part of a childs life, where their imagination can grow and flourish. Obviously l am not encouraging a class of daydreamers but a little bit never goes astray.
There is huge fuss here over the Leaving Cert and the pressure but at that stage they are 18. A poor 6 yearl old under pressure is desperate

@KatherineMinola

I think some teachers do speak up, as others in other professions do. They may also speak up in a more national way e.g. writing to newspapers etc, or vote with their feet and go to a different school. I agree that people in other professions do have to speak up- but equally lots don't. I'm sure a quick google will find you situations in all professions where people have not spoken up and it is a safety risk- so I think it's unfair to say that everyone else does it.

In some schools, especially if you are an NQT/RQT, it may feel difficult to speak about the culture, and you may feel fearful of losing your job (many teachers are now initially employed on 1 year contracts). Equally, you may just decide it is not the sort of school you want to teach in and vote with your feet.

Or, you may try and get nowhere but not feel able to share this with a parent as it's seen as unprofessional. Lots of teachers will raise issues internally while presenting a united front to staff and parents.

I know some schools do things differently and still get good results, but the fear is there for a reason.

I do think parents have a lot more power on a national and school scale to get things changed than teachers- start by voting with your feet and putting your children in schools where you agree with how the curriculum is run (if you can). A falling roll will soon make heads sit up and take notice. Or speak to the head, or become a parent governor, or raise it with your MP etc.

But ultimately the class teacher will probably have little power to change things.

Or, you may try and get nowhere but not feel able to share this with a parent as it's seen as unprofessional. Lots of teachers will raise issues internally while presenting a united front to staff and parents.
Isn't that the story of teaching?
i haven't had a chat with a parent this week who hit the nail on the head about a colleague

Teachers can’t change the system. Not classroom teachers because they have to meet the targets set by their head teachers in response to those they are instructed to meet by Ofsted and go pvernment. If they don’t meet the targets, they may not have a job next term.

If you’ve seen the current BBC2 programme ‘Schools’, you’ll see what happens when a school is in special measures. It isn’t a pretty sight and it isn’t unusual. The government has decided that all children must meet certain targets and woe betide any school that doesn’t. There’s no room for individuality, for taking a question from a child and running with it, for just being for a bit. That’s how it is now and daydreaming just doesn’t fit into the school day I’m afraid. It wasn’t always like that, but that was then. It’s why so many teachers are leaving.

Yes, Lady, I wasn't suggesting that everyone else in other professions speaks up - just that teachers aren't a special case. It does take courage to speak up, and I think there is a lack of courage for the reasons you mention.

Teachers absolutely can change the system. I agree that changing things takes a lot of will, but it's disingenuous to claim that it's not possible or that teachers are powerless. I agree that parents have a lot of power too.

Foxy, I think schools in special measures are a different kettle of fish - they pretty much do have to do what they're told or face hostile takeover! But the schools I'm talking about are rated Good - they've just "settled" for giving the kids a brilliant and exciting education instead of chasing that Ofsted Outstanding.

moredoll we are in our third year of play based learning so it's still early days. The current year three children are the first children to have had only play based learning so far and some of them are finding it difficult now they have to sit at tables most of the day. The year three teachers are finding it difficult too! It will be interesting to see where they are at the end of year six.

And to those who say that teachers can speak up - that is definitely not true in my experience. Teachers that don't agree with SLT often get managed out.

Yourownpersonaljesus

Thanks. I hope they learn to sit still and enjoy learning more. You would expect them to better at thinking creatively across the curriculum, so it will be interesting to see if that happens.

You need to go to the teacher and explain how your child feels - it doesn't matter who's fault it is - the system is broken but the teacher can take a different approach.

Absolutely agree, we chose an Ofsted Good school that was further away over an Outstanding one that was so regimented. It had negatively marked workbooks in Reception. Madness! I hope the teachers up the school do as good a job as the Early Years are doing now at having fun!

I am encouraged at my school to do as much of my teaching outdoors as is possible. This is the case from nursery 2 year olds to primary 7 12 year olds. We are encouraged to see concrete materials not as a step on the way to recording calculations or as a sign that a child needs support but as part of thinking, talking, making, drawing, explaining. Higher order thinking skills are the goal not page after page of ‘sums’ with ticks, codes, pretty coloured pen work. Verbal feedback and self and peer assessment are of far more use as are transferable skills.

I am surprised that nobody in power has made the link between the way we teach young children and teenagers, and the rise in poor mental health.

I left primary teaching partly because I felt that how I was being expected to teach was mildly abusive for some children (not all). I am now a specialist teacher working with secondary aged children -it is slightly better, but I am shocked by the sheer number of children I meet with anxiety related disorders. I don’t feel it is rocket science to see that putting a huge amount of pressure on children from an early age is going to increase anxiety.

Our school IS actively chasing Ofsted outstanding (we could only get a Good off our recent inspection because it was a short one, so they're coming back this year to do a full inspection with a view to seeing if they can give us the outstanding grade) - but still manages to do a lot of really inventive teaching with the kids. Totally outing here but there's one week in the year where the classes all pick a country to learn about, they get boarding passes and bring in their luggage to "fly" to the country in question going via the school hall turned into an airport with the teaching staff dressed as airline staff - lots of mathematical learning in measuring and weighing the luggage and the like, then loads of themed learning goes on (we had kids learning about painting the Sistine Chapel ceiling by trying to do paintings lying under tables with the paper stuck underneath it to feel how hard it was... things like that go on) and it is bloody superb to see. Loads and loads of work in the forest schools area, lots of using the local woods and nature reserve around the school to do outdoor learning - it's fantastic just how much they manage to keep the buzz going about the place.

Yes the staff are privately fucked off about how ridiculous the curriculum's become - but they do their best to keep it fun and engaging for the kids.

Compared to another local school who had the year 1 kids put through weeks and weeks of mock phonics screening tests to make sure their results were nice.

And like I said on another thread recently - huge huge puddle on a slight dipped part of the playground... had the foundation stage kids out sailing boats they'd designed and built across the middle of it as an impromptu learning opportunity!

I home ed my eldest two children for some of their primary years so it was very informal learning and didn’t follow the national curriculum. They got good GCSE results despite missing some of the ‘unmissable’ stuff at primary and are a lot more independent thinking than some kids their ages.

My younger two have been through the school system and are a lot more jaded with learning the the older two had been at the same ages. My youngest is in Y5 and her teacher is good this year - they are out on trips more often and learn times tables through dancing and song etc and she’s picking it all up far quicker than she ever has. They also make more models and things in the classroom, paint scenes from books they study and things like that. The mix of activities is definitely useful to learning. All the kids love this teacher.

It's terrible how our education system takes all the joy out of learning.
I have a bee in my bonnet about kids stopping reading for pleasure round about the age of 11/12 and I lay most of the blame for it on secondary education. How ironic.
My DCs secondary school has reduced science to rote learning of GCSE facts with the odd experiment thrown in. They have managed to turn both of my boys off science in under a term.
Schools (exams/ the education system) turn learning into a bore and a chore.

am surprised that nobody in power has made the link between the way we teach young children and teenagers, and the rise in poor mental health.

It’s because we’ve abandoned evidence based policy making for pretty much every area because politicians do not like listening to experts and prefer to run with their own half baked ideas instead.

The current education system in Britain is a disaster - head off a few years and look at the stats for older children with mental health problems - it is a disgrace.

The system is politically-dictated and we are reaping the legacy of Gove's back-of-the-envelope, if-it-was-good-enough-for me power trip.

Some schools do manage to find wriggle room within the state diktats, and often the smaller the school the better able they are to do this. I am governor at a small primary school and we have managed to make the curriculum human-scale with small classes, lots of TAs and a loving atmosphere. The experience of each individual precious child is top of the list, even above the stats that so exercise those in power.

The OP is entirely correct that this sort of pressure is totally unnecessary, as witnessed by those other countries where children would only just be in "proper" school at this child's age.

So....what can you do?

• set an atmosphere at home that says that none of this matters in the long run - that they should do their best and their happiness is what matters most. When my DDs were taking exams I just said you will either pass or fail, and in either event the world will still be turning and we will still love you. Incidentally they all have higher qualifications and did very well, so do not think you will be blighting their life chances by taking a laid-back attitude. Please bear in mind that most of what they do at primary school will be repeated in the first couple of years of secondary, so it is all pointless anyway.
• talk to the teacher - he/she will agree with you and tell you that her actions are dictated from above - she is just the puppet in the situation. But make it very clear that you do not want your son pushed in any way; that him being happy is your priority. The teacher will have OfSted etc. breathing down her neck as well as (unbelievably) some parents who want their child hot-housed and given lots of homework. She needs to know that this is not who you are.
• write a letter to say that you do not want him to have homework - that he is stressed enough by school and, as a responsible parent, you need to protect him from this spilling over into his home life. I know parents who have done this - it has not held their children back in any way.
• ask about flexi-schooling - some schools will agree to this.
• look for a different school - for example, the Steiner system places a huge emphasis on children being children and that childhood is something precious to be protected from over-academic pressure. Children can go there for just the primary stage, and they are under no disadvantage when they move on to a state secondary if you so choose at that stage. Although the secondary level of the local Steiner school has just achieved the top results at GCSE in the area, evidencing the fact that pushing children early is entirely unnecessary.
• home-schooling is an option and there is a lot of support out there if you search around. Education Otherwise is a good place to start.
• it is a simple fact that some children thrive in the school milieu, but others do not - just as some adults fit in with one career, but not another. It is just who he is, and your aim must be to try and help the school to adapt to him, rather than allowing the system to upset his happiness. It is not an easy task, but I know that as a mother you will want to do all you can to remedy this. I have good reason to know that a family is only as happy as its unhappiest member - one of my DDs found school an absolute misery and I was tearing my hair out watching this. One thrived in school; another thought it was dead boring but just got on with it (what a waste of her childhood!) - they are all different.

I do know how hard this is for you, and I hope very much that you will find a way through this for your little boy.

protest

I don't have advice, just wanted to say I really feel for your son as I was a daydreamer at school and got told off for it all the time - that was 30 years ago! While I know it must be frustrating for teachers, what people don't realise is that it isn't a choice! You don't think 'I'm going to daydream now because I'd rather do this than listen', it just happens, particularly when you are stressed or overwhelmed. Kids are not just little robots to be filled with information.

I'm not stupid or lazy, but I do switch off easily even now, it's just how my brain is wired. It happens most of all in long meetings (2 hours plus), which I find really tiring. To a 6 year old in a school with very little play, every day must feel like a long meeting.

rabbitmat - many thanks for that interesting link.

Science: Daydreaming Can Significantly Boost Your Creativity and Ability to Problem-Solve It's not all bad!