Punishment

[bbombshell]

So dropped the kids at school this morning and at 9.05 the office rang to say that DS (8) has punched a girl (6/7) in the arm leaving a mark. He was given a red card and given a time out.

I went in at lunch to speak to his teacher who reassured me that he had apologised and once he had settled back into class that he had been his usual well behaved self.

After school I have spoken (well tried to) him about the incident and basically he has still not given a explanation for why he lashed out!

I have told him that due to his actions he is facing a severe punishment but I am at a loss as to what I should do!

WWYD?

I'm still absolutely mortified!

I would try and find out what's really going on...
If he's normally well behaved and this is out of character there's something obviusly very wrong.
Maybe it's returning to school?

The school dealt with it. You then spoke to him and backed up the school's stance. There is no need to punish him twice.

I definitely feel that the return to school has sparked something, although he is usually well behaved he does have bouts of real anger, usually he takes himself out of the situation and calms himself down.

I really don't think a time out or a chat is punishment this time. Under normal circumstances I would have agreed but his inability to explain or show remorse means he doesn't regret his actions.

On the contrary - I'd say that he's totally embarrassed by what he's done and that's why he won't explain. If you're not happy to draw a line under this then I would suggest getting him to write a little card to the girl to say sorry.

Ah, this brings back memories of similar problems with my 3 DSs. Yeah I'd say he was embarrassed but also, maybe, a bit baffled or annoyed. He's what, 8? When my DSs were that age, we had to have a series of conversations about why boys can't hit girls. They experienced this, initially, as 'unfair' and 'stupid'. Some girls took advantage, they knew the teachers reacted much more seriously to a boy hitting a girl than the other way round, so they'd wind the boys up.

And, of course, between themselves, at that age, boys sort out all sorts of minor disputes and teasing with a punch. "Oh, he was being an idiot so I gave him a dead arm." And they don't snitch - as they would see it - about the punching, so girls who do are completely persona non grata! It's quite a moral tangle, and I tackled it from the angle of 'when you're a man, hitting women is completely out of order, any bloke who hits a woman is seen as a total arsehole, by both men and women, now why d'you think that is?' Followed by discussions of relative physical strength, notions of 'the weaker sex' etc etc.

Because they really couldn't see why they shouldn't be able to punch some strapping girl who was winding them up, who had - sometimes - punched them first. And the only response is, 'because society has rules'. Not laws - after all, it's just as much an offence in law for a woman to assault a man - but expectations of decent behaviour. They didn't get it at first, but I asked them, have you ever seen your dad hitting your mum? And then a long list of other people's dads. And they begin to get the message that it ought to be beneath them as males to use their physical strength to overpower or intimidate females. The discussion ranges over outliers like 'What if there was a woman who was, like, really strong, and she was punching some weak little guy?' And the answer is, well maybe he would be justified in defending himself, but when have you ever heard of that happening?

Your DS sounds like a nice kid, so I'm guessing he's just struggling with these moral issues. All I'd say is, don't assume he knows or understands why you're mortified, have the discussions. And can you get his dad in on the act?

He is attached to something electronic...phone....games....withdraw it

What would I do? Firstly I would learn the difference between punishment and discipline.
Secondly I would give my son a break , the school have dealt with it.

Oneeyedbloke

I am not sure why you think that the gender of those involved has any bearing on this?

Child punches another child - regardless of genders - is likely to elicit a similar outcome as the OP in most schools.

I would say to him that I was really surprised at what he did because it's not like him, I'd tell him I was worried about what had provoked him into hitting someone and that he needs to tell me what happened. I would tell him that if he didn't tell me, I'd go into school on Monday and ask the little girl he hit what had happened.

Frankly, I'd put it down to kids being kids. A thump on the arm when I was at school would have warranted a 'pack that in' and that's it. I think everyone is getting a bit ott about kids learning to rub along together and occasionally pushing, shoving & 'dead arming'.

WaffleWiffle I'm not sure the OP sees it in an entirely ungendered way. She said she was 'absolutely mortified'. I guess she'll correct me if I'm wrong, but I reckon she wouldn't feel quite so awful if her DS had punched another boy.

But in any case, gender does come into it, doesn't it? However much we might wish for a level playing field, we live in an unequal society where adult males can and do physically threaten females. The average adult male is physically stronger and is culturally more inclined to regard violence and the threat of violence as an acceptable way to win arguments. I'm not trying to be deterministic, just trying to recognise the reality.

And schoolboys, ime, live in an even more gendered world. We may want our children to regard each other as perfect equals but, to an 8-year-old boy, girls are pretty much an alien species - and I'm willing to bet 8-year-old girls view boys the same way.

I'm not sure you're right about schools taking the same view of arm-punching regardless of gender. If that had happened at my DSs' primary school, half the boys would have been on permanent time out. Again, they might wish to adopt an equal policy but the actuality of boys' playground play often defeats such idealism. I'm not saying they're all punching each other all the time, or leaving bruises. But I'd say 8 is the age at which boys become aware, often uncomfortably so, of the differences between themselves and girls.

So all I'm saying is, I think parents of boys need to help them learn to relate reasonably with girls, and not regard them as entirely 'other', which makes it easier to treat them with disdain & suspicion. And, maybe, punch them.