I have been told something quite disturbing about a friend of mine and how she treats her child, WWYD?

[MadreInglese]

I have a friend, let's call her Anne, who I have increasingly struggled to enjoy spending time with recently, I couldn't really put my finger on why but I think it's mostly due to her obsessive misery and the way she treats her DD (we met through our DDs).

She seems to be more and more in the children-should-be-seen-and-not-heard camp, her DD is lavished with anything material she asks for, but seems to be given no attention or affection. 'Anne' seems frantically busy all the time, always dashing off somewhere and stressing about where she needs to be next and the poor DD is just dragged around and expected to entertain herself. The sad thing is that her DD is becoming quite unlikeable as she gets older as she's growing more whiney and my DD doesn't really want to see her any more as she says she's annoying and spoilt and makes up stories . Anne has admitted that she and her DD have "screaming rows for hours" at home, but takes no responsibility and blames it all on her DD. At 10yo I think she is far to young to be totally held responsible .

I've tried to reach out to Anne but she seems on a self-destruct martyr mission and will not accept any offers of help or advice or downtime. Her main line is usually "well you're ok, you have a man" as if that is the one solution to all problems. To be honest it's hard to pin Anne down for an available time slot to see her for a chat so as she gets busier I've seen her less and less often.

The other day I was with another friend 'Clare' and were chatting about how facebook reveals all the links between friends and mutual friends and she then said that reminded her of something important she needed to tell me. Clare's friend 'Ruth' (who I have met once or twice) used to be very close friends with Anne and somehow through facebook info Ruth realised we all knew each other. Apparently Ruth and Anne fell out when Anne's DD was about 6 because of the way Anne treated her DD. Ruth says she witnessed Anne screaming at her DD, locking her in her bedroom and locking her in an understairs cupboard and that Anne had admitted kicking her DD during an argument . Ruth said she was close to calling social services.

I don't know Ruth at all really but I trust Clare totally and she is very close to Ruth (and why would someone lie?)

If it is true do I tell Anne what I've heard? If it's not true or embelished do I tell her that these things are being said about her?

I'm no bloody perfect smug earth mother and was on my own with DD for a time, I know it can be hard and stressful (my DD can be testing at the best of times!) but how Anne is with her DD (what I've seen) makes me feel uncomfortable and I'm sorry to say I'm not finding it hard to believe she could behave like Ruth said when pushed but I really try not to form opinions of people based on hearsay. Perhaps is is true but is now a thing of the past. Perhaps it's not true at all. Perhaps it's true and she hasn't changed....

WWYD? Anything or nothing?

I would try and support her a little more, even if you find it hard, she sounds like she needs a hand, not persecution

I would mention to her about what Ruth has said but be aware of it, if she mentions screaming at her daughter to you I would encourage her into doing enjoyable things with her dd

Ask her does she want her dd remembering her as a screaming mummy who locked her in a cupboard

Hard - part of me thinks that you really do not have a clue what actually happens and you should therefore leave well alone. However, another part of me is saying that that is how vulnerable children fall through the gaps.

I think on balance, I would have a quiet word and tell her that she should know that several people have expressed concerns about the way she parents her dd. You don't want to interfere and are not making judgements, but thought she should know that these things were being said. Also sympathise with how hard it must be for her and offer help.

If someone did this to me, I would react 1 or 2 ways - explode and have nothing further to do with them ever again or break down in tears and reveal everything. I can't decide which is more liley, but you would need to be prepared for both.

I know OWO, I have tried and tried

tried gently offering advice but she just drops the "you don't know how hard it is" line all the time

tried the "I know how you feel my DD can be difficult too, what can we do about it, let's find a solution together" approach but got the same response

tried offering to have her DD and give them both a break or for the four of us to have some girly time but their calendar is booked up ridiculously and there is rarely time to arrange anything

tried touchy-feeling hugs and letting her know I'm here for her but she is 'Fine'

tried descending on her at her house with wine for a chat but she's "off out early the next day so can't drink and needs an early night"

If I do get a time slot to see her it's usually no more than a hour, there just isn't the time to talk properly

it's like she wants to be in a permanent miserable puddle and will not be helped out of it

can i ask, is ann a younger mum? She sounds very immature. (Disclaimer: Obv not all young mums are immature)

What is the misery? IS it life stuff or is she just one of those joyless freaks, who are always moaning?

It sounds as though she is struggling and has been for a long time and is taking it out on her poor daughter.

You are in a very difficult situation, as nobodty reacts well to even implied criticism of thier parenting skills.

Do you know any of her family? Does she HAVE family nearby who might be able to help a bit?

Really I would speak to NSPCC and ask their advice. It sounds like their relationship is a very vicious negative cycle, something like parenting classes could really help.

My only other though is to speak to her dds head in confidence. I wouldn't speak to Anne direct otherwise the whole thing could ignite in your face and nothing actually get done to help the dd and Anne.

, Anne could actually be very depressed/unhappy/unresolved issues and she is taking them out/repeating behavioural patterns she has experienced as a child

some good advice here, thanks

I wonder if I need to put aside whether the stories are true or not and just concentrate on Anne being made aware that these things have been said and reinforcing that help is available to her

but how do you blurt that out over a 40 min coffee break?

Hmmm NSPCC good idea

Can you speak to them anon and just get advice? I don't really feel I want to 'report' anyone here

can you write to her?

Yes - I wouldn't worry about whether they are true or not but just make here aware that people are concerned about her parenting and for the welfare of her dd. Then duck and run away!

I think you can't, I think she is busy to avoid the huge issues, I think you need to speak to NSPCC for advice and follow their lead - if you flag it up to the school it gives them the opportunity to support the dd and hopefully Anne too.

She isn't going to take kindly to you telling her what a crap Mum she is being.

Oh this is a very tricky one - I'm not sure I could say anything directly to her about what are in effect rumours. I would be maybe tempted to get the DD over to play without Anne so that you can give her a break but also give Annes DD another adult that she can talk to if she needs to.

Very difficult all round and you have my sympathies - as others have said - you have only heard other peoples account of what may have happened - but like Goosey said doing nothing is how vulnerable children slip through

Yes NSPCC I believe will give you advice without you having to name IYSWIM

it is v. tricky and I agree calling the NSPCC is a good idea. They have more experience than any of us (assuming no-one on this thread works in child protection) in sorting the wheat from the chaff. This could well be a mother and child desperately in need of some intervention.

yes she is avoiding things, total ostrich syndrome, and I don't imagine she will take too kindly to me being honest with her

but I do think she can't see the wood for the trees and is genuinely clueless as to how her behaviour is affecting her DD

her parents don't live very near but both support her, and she has a wide circle of friends but tbh I don't think she spends any length of quality time with anyone as everything is so rushed and busy

even prior to the Ruth revelatiions I did worry that she may crack one day, not neccessarily physically hurting her DD, but more like saying something awful

I really really struggled with parenting my eldest I wish there had been more help/intervetion. I have got there in the end.

Please ring NSPCC and see what they suggest. If you went on to report to SS then it is up to them to support her if she needs it, it's not your responsibility to try and resolve it but it is your responsibility to protect her dd.

Don't mean to be harsh and SS seems extreme but it sounds like the dds emotional needs are not being met at all.

Yes you can ring the NSPCC for advice without giving your details or the details of the family you are concerned about. I did it and found it very helpful.

The misery is mostly self-inflicted IYSWIM

She will agreed to helping out with an afterschool club and then moan about having to do it

She will change jobs becuase she hated and moaned about her old one, then she will hate and moan about her new one

She will join an evening class and then moan about how she doesn't have time to do the homework

She will sign her DD up to a gym class and then moan about the time that it takes up each week and what a pita it is to get there and to park

(you get the picture?)

but she is not always joyless I don't think

she has admitted that she doesn't enjoy spending time with her DD so she doesn't want to arrange anything for them to do together, but she seemed genuinely surprised at my reaction to that

She sounds very depressed and probably has been for such a long time she doesn't realise. I had that kind of joyless depression for decades, life is so good since it was dealt with.

You're probably right CarGirl

I don't know how anyone would get through her armour though

Perhaps having SS turn up on her doorstep will, they can (I believe) insist that she see a dr, attend parenting classes etc