AMA with Dr Chris van Tulleken, expert on Ultra-Processed Food and award-winning broadcaster

[NicolaDMumsnet]

Hi everyone,

We’re pleased to announce that award-winning broadcaster, author and practicing NHS doctor Chris van Tulleken will be doing an AMA this evening. Following his BBC One documentary ‘What Are We Feeding Our Kids?’ and the chart-topping podcast ‘A Thorough Examination – Addicted to Food’, Chris has become the UK’s go-to expert on Ultra-Processed Food (UPF). In his most recent book ‘Ultra-Processed People’ Chris marshals the latest evidence to reveal what UPF is really doing to our bodies and the planet.

Ultra-Processed People
‘Drawing on his own experiment of eating an 80% UPF diet for one month, Chris explores the invention of UPF and its impact on our health and weight – from altering metabolism and appetite, to an increased risk of serious health problems like cardiovascular disease and dementia. He shows that almost all our staple foods are ultra- processed – bread, cereal, biscuits, desserts, dairy products and condiments; explains why exercise and willpower cannot prevent obesity and ill health due to UPF; and provides solutions for individuals, policy makers and the food industry.’

Please post your questions below. Chris will be answering questions this evening.

As always, please remember our guidelines - one question per user, follow-ups only if there’s time and most questions have been answered, and please keep it civil.

Thanks,
MNHQ

if you’re in the supermarket with my dc who are 13 and 11 and obviously love UPF with a grand passion, what food rule do you impose to get them away from the absolute worst of it?

ps thanks for ruining Pringles for me.

Is there a simple way to identify ultra-processed foods? I've seen it suggested that anything with more than five ingredients should be seen as a UPF, but that would rule out a lot of wholegrain cereals with added vitamins and minerals. Also, is it all about ingredients, or is the manufacturing/processing method just as important? That's very difficult to spot as a consumer.

Thanks for drawing attention to this. I don't understand how the British diet has become so much worse than our European neighbours', especially for children.

What are your thoughts on home made breads with ground flour. Is there a way to have the staples we've become used to with them bring ultra processed? What about refined sugar in home made baking?

Hi Chris

Thanks so much for the book & podcasts etc. so interesting.

I've just spent time in the U.K. with my teens at various theme parks. I found it pretty impossible to eat healthily. I'm vegetarian so maybe more restricted. One day I got a jacket potato but nothing better available.

If I was going from home I'd have packed a lunch no problem.

My question then is this:

How do you manage to avoid UPF when you're away from home - especially with children

Thankyou.

I saw in an interview you said that you don't eat upfs anymore. How strict about this are you? For example, do you still use stock cubes? We have a very low upf diet but I'm struggling to replace stock cubes so curious what your solution has been. Also, tinned yeast has emulsifiers so does this make homemade bread a upf and a pointless making? We do have sourdough but it's not as quick to make.

Many thanks for writing this book. It was amazing, eye opening and disgusting!

Some people have been worrying about baby formula being UPF.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4811506-upf-damage-and-baby-formula
My take is that it is a fantastic thing to be able to change cows milk to something that nourishes babies. A lot of science has gone into it.

However, some of that science has been rather misused to make UPF. That glorious blend of fat and carbs is rather addictive and in nature not found in many other places than baby milk.

How much do manufacturers try to reproduce the breast milk profile, in foods for non infants?
Can you also reassure new mums that formula is good and nothing to worry about.

I am coeliac, do you have advice on shop bought gluten free bread?
Has to be shop bought as I have produced a nice line in gluten free bricks when bread making at home.
I also use gluten free flour for cakes and pastry, what do you think of home made cakes using butter, eggs and natural ingredients but also using gf flour.

Hi Chris. I’m reading your book at the moment and really enjoying it. It’s fascinating, makes a lot of sense and feels very important. Possibly by the time I finish it it will have answered my question, but just in case it doesn’t:

Yesterday I cooked a big pan of extremely delicious Cullen Skink for dinner: fresh vegetables, smoked haddock, cream, served with home made whole meal bread. The only UPF element was a single stock cube (between 12 portions of soup). Is there any reason why I need to worry about the single stock cube, given that it works out at half a gram per serving?

Come to think of it, the yeast in the home made bread will also have had emulsifiers - do I need to try and replace that? Or is it a case of, the vast majority of the meal is fresh or traditionally processed food, it’s not worth getting in a stew about things in tiny amounts?

I’m also very intolerant to gluten and yeast, too. I do some home baking, but seem to recall from your book that Xanthan gum is a no-no. How do we get round it?
Or suggestions for home made GF bread?

I agree, trying to lead a normal GF life without the ingestion of manufactured GF products seems almost impossible.

Hi Dr Chris

Thanks for coming on. From your research how much do you think ultra processing (ie those added ingredients you talk about that wouldn’t be found in your kitchen) affects health outcomes directly and how much do you think it is the other elements of the foods that tend to be UPF ie high sugar, fat, cheap meats etc. Is there any research comparing different types of UPF?

I’m a personal trainer predominantly for female runners who are not athletes but who are training to get faster / go longer. I don’t recommend it for all but find lots of the women I work with have good gains in terms of strength and reduction in injuries when they use protein shakes and the like. These are undoubtedly UPF but the women using them are active, fit and a healthy weight.

Linked to that now I’ve seen you raise the idea that exercise doesn’t affect weight and we shouldn’t be eating more if we exercise. Again I find that’s really not the case with the women I support and worry about RED-S particularly amongst active women who tend to be more wary when I say you need to eat more as it is.

Would love to hear your thoughts as a few women I’m supporting have read your book and queried this. Thanks 🙏

Hi Chris, I eat a very healthy diet and then I supplement that with unhealthy foods because I have no willpower. So for example today for lunch I had hummus with sourdough rye, a bunch of raw vegetables, some valdesz kimchi and a clementine. But then I ate a giant chocolate chip cookie from the local bakery. So - how much am I undermining myself, and is it better to eat a cookie from the artisan bakery than a kitkat or something from the shop next door? And do you have any advice on how to improve willpower please?

@Iamnotanugget

Herbamare is useful as a stock cube replacement.

As someone overweight and looking to lose weight, I have found most of the diet industry foods to belong to UPF. What do you advise for those looking to lose weight?

I don't have a question, just wanted to say that I really enjoyed your book. I'd previously read Tim Spectre, Andrew Jenkins and Jesse Inchauspe. Your theme made everything manageably simple - the whole family has bought into the idea, and are all helping to cook as they realise the work that goes in to avoiding upf.
2 months in and i definitely feel better, have lost half a stone, and have a healthier appetite. One effect that I've noticed recently is that the rosacea that had been getting worse for the past 4 years has disappeared. I'm watching with interest to see if this is a permanent change, if so, it's a solid indicator of the inflammation that UPF were causing me.

And I really enjoyed your episode of Who Do You Think You Are ?

What would you suggest for dealing with children who are fussy and resist healthier options such as wholemeal bread and more than one or two vegetables?

What is your suggestion for a meal for a hungry Coeliac who has already had rice or potatoes multiple times in a week?

Do you share the cooking equally with Dinah and do you think that a diet low in UPF can be achieved without increasing the burden on women to cook?

Like @DomesticatedZombies I can't eat gluten so xanthum gum is actually in my kitchen cupboard! Most main meals we cook from scratch from raw ingredients but I can't imagine trying to replace shop brought bread!

I am the same and have the same problem.
I have really cut down on UPF in my own diet, I realised I was eating far too much of it, putting on weight and not feeling great, but I still do sometimes have biscuits, or use a GF pizza base, pasta etc.

Hi Chris,

I’m half way through the audiobook version of your audiobook and really enjoying it despite being regularly revolted and horrified.

I’m interested in evidence that links the effects of UPF on the microbiome and how this influences systemic inflammation. Are there any studies out there that have looked at how UPF might be a factor in conditions such as chronic constipation/IBS, asthma and chronic neurological and rheumatological conditions.
Any specific ingredients out there that should be reduced or avoided altogether? Asking for myself but also my patients who frequently ask me what they should be or not be eating (Community matron).

Hi, thanks for the podcasts and book (much appreciated). I am vegan and thanks to your podcast I am moving away from meat substitutes to use far more peas, beans and legumes in our diet. Am I OK using tins of these things in home cooked meals or would I be better using dried beans etc and trying to remember to soak overnight etc.

Also, yeast. What do I do about yeast for home made bread? Surely all yeasts are by definition processed so which type is the least processed that I can buy?

Does vital wheat gluten qualify as UPF? It's one of the basic ingredients for making home made seitan if you use the quick method. Using the slow method is very slow and tedious (much washing of ordinary flour until you are left with just the wheat gluten).

I ordered your book from my local library last month and was 33rd in the queue. I think it's a hit!

Glad to have the issues of UPF raised.

We find it limiting in my household as my son has several IGE food allergies including dairy. His nutritionist wants us to offer soya yoghurt, plant based cheese, oat milk, fortified bread and cereal....all UPF. We give it to him so he's getting his calcium and other nutrients but I'd love to know of any potential alternatives/ swaps.

Hi Chris,

This might be a bit of a niche question, but...

My daughter is 15 years old and has complex health issues including an unsafe swallow. She was Ng fed until she was 17 months, and has been gastrostomy fed since. Apart from the first three months when I managed to express enough for her to have breast milk only via her tube, she has lived, I guess, on 100% UPF for almost 15 years, in the shape of medical formula.

You'll know that many children struggle to thrive on medical formula and that many see amazing results by switching to a blended diet of real food. However many also find that they are unsupported by NHS doctors and dietitians who have been very suspicious of blended diet.

This seems to be changing and we've tentatively started to discuss a change to blended diet with our dietitian. However because of her need for a low-volume, calorie dense diet (her current formula is 1.5kcsl/ml) I am not sure that we'll ever be able to provide all she needs that way.

What would you do in our situation? If we can't replace her formula completely with 'real' food is there one thing you'd want to be getting into her diet above others?

Great book.

I really noticed the care you took to avoid dehumanising or belittling language around obesity- something the medical profession aren't always brilliant at. I'd be very interested in your views on how the insights in your book can be communicated more widely without alienating those who might benefit from them, and in your views on how HCPs communicate re obesity in general. It's well established that trying to encourage people to lose weight by using shaming language often has the opposite effect but sadly this is taking some time to filter through.

Hi and thanks for doing this! I have a disability (MS) and I struggle to prepare meals as I suffer with overwhelming fatigue, pain and mobility problems. Currently my husband cooks for our family but he also works full-time so it would be helpful if there were options where I could prepare a family meal some days, for example anything in the microwave, no prep work, baking tray stuff. These are the sorts of things that fall in the UPF category so how do I choose better ready-made or ready prepared options?