I home educate my DC AMA

[PsycheEros]

They are 8 and 6. The 6 year old has never been to school, the 8 year old was pulled out in reception. Fire away!

I didn’t say those in the HE population do, I was talking about the population as a whole....

Well the government and organisations within the EHE community do use homeschooling...

You referenced the government and organisations with the EHE community to prove it was not a correct term, then said that didn't matter when it was addressed by myself and another poster. Make your mind up.

Home school is an incorrect and misleadingly inaccurate term. It gives the impression that children are going to school at home. They're not. That would be strange. They're getting an education at home.

If the government really is using that term (I'd be surprised) they were having a particularly incompetent day.

You referenced the government and organisations with the EHE community to prove it was not a correct term, then said that didn't matter when it was addressed by myself and another poster. Make your mind up.

No I didn’t. I don’t see the HE population being the same thing as the HE community. By population I meant the families actually EHE, by community I meant organisations such as online schools that are also involved in EHE. I did not say the government were part of the EHE community at all, you you re-read the bit you have quoted you will see that.

If the government really is using that term (I'd be surprised) they were having a particularly incompetent day.

They are, read the link.

I responded to the OP’s post about language so my response about language was hardly unsolicited.

@PsycheEros Apologies, I didn’t mean to derail your thread. My first post was purely in reply to your post because some, not you as posted you don’t mind, in the HE community take offence, try to police others’ language and, quite frankly, sometimes bite people’s heads off about it when it isn’t surprising some in the general population use the term since the government and online schools used by some home educators use it.

Fair enough, perhaps don't police whether home educators want to protect the correct terms and promote accuracy going forward? You wouldn't want people to think we're all trying to do school at home when there is a better term we can use, surely.

As I said I was responding to the OP’s post about language. It wasn’t unsolicited. It wasn’t me policing anything, I was mentioning why I don’t think it is surprising some in the general population (for avoidance of doubt that is everyone living in the UK) use the term homeschooling.

Honestly, could you give it a rest? We get that you’re super passionate about being allowed to use the term ‘homeschool’ and not feeling ‘police’s’ but it’s tedious and derailing

@PsycheEros I think you’ve answered a lot of quite sneery (or derailing) posts very well and your sons sound like they’re having a great experience. I would have loved to have been homeschooled!

how do you manage the marking/feedback/correction side of things? Or keeping them on track if they don’t want to do something (or want to do one thing excessively?)
Do you find switching between parent mode and teacher mode tricky?

My original post was in response to the OP’s post about language, that wasn’t unsolicited or derailing.

My other posts about it have been in reply to people tagging/quoting me, which as I have apologised to the OP seem to have derailed the thread but that wasn’t my intention with my original post as I said. I have the right to reply when people ask me questions/say I have said something I haven’t/misrepresent my post. If you/others don’t want to discuss it no-one is forcing you to reply and then I wouldn’t need to reply to you/others to answer the questions asked/correct misrepresentations/saying things I haven’t.

Oh good! Another massive post.

just stop!

I literally don’t care.
please just stop. We aren’t here to focus on you.

We aren’t here to focus on you.

I never said we were.

The truth is that they tend to be OK doing most things because we have cultivated this routine and they know that mornings are for "learning" time. So yes they may not love spelling and grammar or what have you but they know they do it every morning for 15 minutes and so it just gets done. I also - and appreciate many home edders won't like this - tell them that it's their choice, they do it at home with me or they do it at school. There are certain things that for me are non negotiable. Other than those things they really have pretty unlimited time to explore their own interests.

As for switching between parent and teacher mode, I don't have this really- I'm just their mum, it doesn't feel like I'm their teacher.

I am now going to bed, as I caught up on a load of work between 9 and 11, and then had to prep tomorrow's home ed. But I will answer any more questions tomorrow when I get 5 minutes!

@PsycheEros I admire your patience in answering these comments! Some responses have indeed been sneering and dismissive.

I have written about this before in other threads, but I truly believe the vast majority of parents would get a shock at the state of the average school today. I’ve worked at many different schools over the years, some excellent, some awful, and many average. Behaviour has become so shockingly bad that the amount of learning loss is shameful. For those questioning if you can do 3 hours at home for the equivalent of 7 hours at school, I have absolutely no doubt that you can. Bullying is a constant issue and many children don’t talk about what is going on with their parents.

Im a teacher, so I passionately believe in the power of schools to educate the next generation. However, I’m also realistic, and realise that schools in their current state don’t meet the needs of many many students. I have many friends in the USA that homeschool, and I was really sceptical at first. However, their kids are some of the most well-adjusted, well-read, well-behaved and motivated kids I’ve ever seen. I’ve done a total 180 on my views on homeschooling.

I actually think often of homeschooling my own two DC. I have my DS in a good school right now, but if anything changed, I would really consider it. It’s just a matter of income, as we really need my salary right now. I think this would be an issue for a lot of families. Schools act as childcare, which is awkward to say but it’s the truth. Just look at how people scramble (myself included) on strike days.

Have a good Tuesday with your DC and thanks for your openness OP.

How do you get around the lack of infrastructure and resources; I'm thinking in particular science labs, tech workshops? I know there is some science which can be taught at home but preparing for GCSE or certainly if a young person wanted to progress to A Level, then it would be a serious disadvantage to not have day to day access to the right resources.

Also, do you ever worry that your children see your own work life as 'lesser,' as it's squeezed around the home ed? Most careers and professions simply would not be compatible with supervising children all day. How do you square the fact that your children are having an experience which they'll be unlikely to replicate if they go into a career rather than a part time job? Of course they may not necessarily want to do home ed with their own kids, I guess this is more of a theoretical question!

The assumption a lot of people have on the topic of home ed is that it's something people only do if their children are struggling with school, rather than a proactive choice. I suspect this perhaps comes from the fact that for many parents, it's not an option without considerable sacrifice, because it would mean one parent giving up or significantly reducing their work, or finding a 'fit around' job which is likely to be lower status. I suspect one of our 3 children would have liked to be home educated, he was never hugely keen on school but it would have meant either dh or I giving up our careers. Our other 2 children loved everything about school. Of course if the less keen ds had really not been coping, we'd have had to rethink.

There are increasingly groups which provide access to the resources you mention - my eldest used to a science club in a university lab for example. If and when they decide to do a qualification requiring this, we will seek out the appropriate resources.

No, I don't worry about this to be honest. For one thing, flexible and part time working is fast becoming the norm (certainly in my industry it is- as I've already said, I've worked with CEOs who are part time and job share). By the time my boys are adults I would be shocked for instance if the 4 day week wasn't becoming standard across the board. For another thing, I watched my mum flog herself half to death in a non flexible job she pretty much hated (she had no choice) and I always said to myself no way did I want that for myself or my kids. Even pre home ed I said, based on my own experiences, if I can (understand it isn't possible for many), I want to be there when my kids come back from school. I find it pretty backwards to have it insinuated I work in a lesser job because I am part-time - I am highly qualified and I earn decent money for the hours. My kids see me work just as they see their father work. And they see their parents have rich, full lives outside of work.

A lot of people do say "well most people couldn't afford to home ed". I don't disagree with that. I wish more people who wanted to could afford to do it. We can afford to do it, and we love it, so we do. That's really all there is to it for us.

I have no questions but I admire you op.

To clarify, I wasn't saying your job is 'lesser', I was asking whether it's a concern that your children might perceive it in that way, as it has to fit around your role of teaching and supervising them all day.

I completely agree btw that flexible working is becoming more the norm, but the fact is, most high level careers can't be squeezed into a few hours in the evenings or weekends. That's just a fact and is always likely to be the case. And of course working remotely doesn't negate the need for childcare at all, so even someone able to wfh full time wouldn't be able to home ed. It's not a criticism, it's just a fact. It's great that you're able to work with CEOs in a job that you can do in a few hours in the evenings but that's not real life for most people! The reality is that most jobs which can be squeezed into a few evening hours are fairly low status.

Also, do you ever worry that your children see your own work life as 'lesser,' as it's squeezed around the home ed? Most careers and professions simply would not be compatible with supervising children all day. How do you square the fact that your children are having an experience which they'll be unlikely to replicate if they go into a career rather than a part time job? Of course they may not necessarily want to do home ed with their own kids, I guess this is more of a theoretical question!

Isn't this what most parents do though? Maybe it depends on your social circle or where you live, but most ordinary working class parents squeeze work around their children. Parents work opposite shifts etc. The only difference is most people with school age children eventually get a clear 5 hours in the day during term times.
Every family i know, HE or schooled, has parents doing opposite shifts, working flexibly from home, working school hours only, relying on a few hours childcare from grandparents, occasionally taking kids to work with them and so on.

@alyceflowers I think you're right, it depends on social circles. Dh and I always used nursery, and then wrap around childcare once the children were in school, because we both work in roles where we can't just squeeze work around other things, and we don't have family nearby to do informal childminding. Same with most of our colleagues and social circle. But yes, I think as you say, it's very dependent on social circles and types of work

Honestly, even if I didn't have kids, I wouldn't want a job that didn't offer flexibility. I love the fact I can do my job whenever and wherever I want to.

As a former short-term home educator, in a similar style to yours, I was just wondering whether you have ever been concerned about the long term education - or perhaps even the welfare - of any of the children you have met within the HE community who may follow a very different educational philosophy / approach?

I also wondered whether, if as I understand it your eldest tended at least in school to be a quieter rule follower, how they have found larger HE groups? My HEd child found these really quite challenging - having found larger groups operating ‘within school rules’ overwhelming, those with a largish number of HE families from a wide range of schooling and unschooling philosophies were even harder. Or do you select groups to some extent?

I hope I don’t come across as rude! My children’s school had a random inset day and I took them to an activity centre. There was a group of home educated children approx 20 of mixed ages. There seemed to be a common theme of precocious children. A lot of ‘Darling, stop eating your croissant whilst you’re on the climbing wall!’ (Child ignored mum) ‘Oh x is such a character, a real free spirit’ etc. ‘X please share the equipment with your sister’ child ignores, parent leaves it. This was with multiple children. Is this something you recognise? I got a sense that they were letting their children express themselves, whereas in a school they’d be pulled up for this and expected to behave.

There can be a lot of unfairness in schools (child who is badly behaved getting rewarded, well behaved children with nothing, same children getting picked for things etc) and I think if I home schooled I’d struggle to get that sense of life is unfair, toughen up into them! How do you address that? Meeting with other similarly minded parents and children is surely not exposing them to a wide range of people that they have to learn to get on with.

I was there for 2 hours in the viewing part and so observed for quite a while (was watching my own two but hard to miss this group).

During lockdown the thing my DC struggled most with was learning alone. No one next to them to compare notes with, or get inspiration from- eg my DS hates anything where he has to pick up a pencil but if he sees his peers still working then it motivates him to have more patience and keep going. My DD likes to discuss ideas and talk things through when she's stuck, which she found hard with me because obviously I knew the actual answer.

Both are competitive and will try harder at things like times tables because they want to do well within their class.

How do you replicate/compensate for that at home? Or do they just not need it and that's part of what makes home ed work for you guys? Or do they cope with this better anyway if it's built in from the start? I can't imagine motivating mine day in and day out without the encouragement, solidarity and companionship of their peers.

In answer to your first question, yes, I have - I do know of some home ed families whose children genuinely play minecraft or the like each day, 10 year olds who can't read (no SEN) and so on. So yes I do worry about those children. But I know many who are much more unstructured than we are whose kids do loads of your traditional "educational" activities, I guess they're just a bit more ad hoc.

In answer to your second question, as a family we don't tend to gel well with the ideological unschoolers (i.e. the ones who think that's what the approach should be for all children) but by an large we get on fine with the others. I suppose it's just like school, isn't it, your kids are always going to mix with other families who don't necessarily have the same approach you do. I certainly found that when my eldest was at school (and when both were at nursery). Our closest friends are those whose educational approach is similar, so when we do playdates at home it's usually with those children. I have found my eldest has really gained confidence in the larger groups, however, even with quite boisterous children.

Whilst you shouldn't judge the entire home ed community on this one particular group you saw, I would say that it is fair enough to say the kind of parent you mention is probably over-represented in the community. I have certainly seen a lot of it, and my DC definitely have stricter boundaries than some other children they interact with. But, again, this was true of school and nursery. When we last went to a museum there was a group of school children running riot with no teachers in sight, and, given the majority of children in the UK attend school, it stands to reason that most "badly behaved" children you come across in daily life will likely be schooled, not home educated.

As to the unfairness question, I don't know if I would agree with you that getting picked on and toughening up is an essential part of life that everyone has to go through. That's part of the reason we home educate. I had people be horrible to me at school and I can't say that it did me any good whatsoever - in fact, the reverse is true. I would also disagree that they don't meet with a wide range of people - they do. They don't just meet up with other home educated children from similar backgrounds, they have schooled friends as well. My eldest met his best friend (who goes to school) at Beavers. I also kind of reject the notion that all schools are a diverse melting pot of different kids from different backgrounds - they certainly aren't in my area because our local school is very white middle class.

I don't think I can answer this question very helpfully because the honest truth is that we haven't noticed this to be an issue at all.

Both are competitive and will try harder at things like times tables because they want to do well within their class.

This, personally, I don't get at all. I don't like competition to be better than others as a motivating factor. I would prefer my children were motivated to learn and improve simply because learning is joyful. I think we have that at the moment, and I'm not sure we would if they were in school.