Redvers v NHS Sussex Integrated Care Board & Mr Adam Doyle Thread 2

Just caught up.

So the judge said “It would be very helpful if you could between you agree the definition of 'gender critical belief' to make sure we are all agreed on that. “

That definition is something we would all like to see.

Plus
*BW: I can confirm that the medical-integrity will be accepted by us as a protected belief. And the C's gender-critical belief - yes we understand that the phrase does not mean the same to everyone.
CM: The concession on medical protected belief is welcome, but I will still need to set out the case, because J you will need to rule on it all the same.
J: Yes I see. *

So the Respindemts have conceded a) SR is not and never has been transphobic b) her belief in EBM is WORIADS.

If the judge includes that EBM is WORIADS in her judgement that would be fantastic. I know it’s an ET so not case law but for all future NHS claimants and respondents it sets a bar to prove it’s not.

CM did really well with this case, particularly given all the people who were at the key THIB meeting but subsequently left so were not witnesses or interviewed as part of the Grievance.

For those who we're listening in, I'm sure the J said something at the end like 'coming into this I think I was naive to think I could give an immediate oral judgement in this case'. And then the 2 barristers laughter in agreement.

Can anyone confirm?

I concur. John Pilger is the sole reason I don't have A level English lit and it's been 35 years and I am still not close to forgiving him.

Just adding my vote of thanks to the C+Pers, and to Tribunal Tweets for their sterling work. And to all of you for the humour in what could be the pit of despair at what rubbish has been going on in our institutions.

Crossing everything that the horrors exposed in this tribunal will be reported in the MSM and that this, plus the new green shoots of sanity in NHS and Civil Service guidance mean that we’re making actual, definitive progress.

Oh, and a stiff whisky for Dr Redvers. I don’t know if she ever browses around MN but all the thanks and best wishes I can offer go to you, for doing your actual job in the face of significant idiocy and adversity. You have acted just as I would hope we (doctors) all would with substantial SG concerns but, too often, this has proven to not be the case, and clearly you have suffered hugely for it. Have a very restful weekend.

This ET seems to be going far more to schedule than many of them do. Possibly due to a more restricted number of witnesses? Is that something that a judge can influence?

CM finished with the last witness and said, thank you Judge that ended on a whimper rather than a bang, I think if he could have rolled his eyes and shook his head he would have

The judge asked good questions, asking if they can have an agreed interpretation of what Gender Critical means and if they cant, to give the reasons they disagree

That will be interesting on Wednesday

Thank you TT and the copy and pasters, its been quite the week

NW did freelance work for the BBC, not ITV. Same organisation that employed Jonathan Willoughby.

By the way, John Pilger was a tosser.

Eyebrows couldn't be any higher, here.

Thank you all for the cut and paste and commentary, you are terrific wims and I am super grateful.

Forgot my manners: and thanks to Tribunal Tweets <hangs head in shame>. We’re reading and absorbing even if we’re not commenting often.

cases like this are a reminder to conduct anything around employment grievances & disciplinaries as if you were going to have to reveal every email, minutes and teams chat to an ET and have to defend it 😳

They never saw a tribunal in their futures at all did they. So righteous were they about the side they'd chosen, that they seem to have actively gone out of their way to shaft SR.

From unreliable Nick Wallis

nickwallis.substack.com/p/did-nhs-chief-medical-officer-suppress?

Judge asked very good questions.

I was astonished by the evidence from the g/x appeal decision maker and I think she (J) was too. Process failures all over the place; time, first i/x was LB, insufficient disclosure, no interviews with THIB members, the rabid TRA external contractor foaming at the mouth to investigate SH again. None of that was 're-investigating'. Her role was to contrast a well run g/x with what actually occurred. That's not what she did.

And the meeting itself.

Wow.

🤞

The judge seemed to get what was going on, and understood the issues, but as we know that can mean fuck all in the judgement

Thanks to the cut and pasters and the commenters.

Another seemingly slam dunk for the complainant but we’ve been here before.

It is feeling like there is a seismic shift in the landscape going on but, again, I’ve thought this before. What brave women there are out there, who keep raising their heads above the parapet 👏 👏 👏.

Today afternoon :

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/2111079721572393160.html

TT substack:
https://substack.com/home/post/p-218906910

Thanks everyone for your input and commentary today 💐

Bold of Fred to talk about men stealing things from women.

redactions redactions unredacted redactions.

And we are done for today.

Back on Wednesday.

Not to mention unintentionally funny AND libellous- now that whole combination takes some doing - and India calls Nick weird?

On to diary disclosure

On to various legal cases grainger, higgs....

This from India W and Freda W on X……they are vile and surely defaming Nick Wallis?

India Willoughby • @IndiaWilloughby • 16h
X
Nick Wallis was a freelancer at ITV News and genuinely a TERRIBLE journalist (I promise you, that's not the trans side of things speaking).
Very weird person. Not good enough for a staff job. Since the Edinburgh Funder retweeted something of his, he's convinced himself he's suddenly John Pilger. Love-bombed by haters. Attention he could never have dreamed of. Now - head gone. Like all gender criticals, an oddbod.

Freda Wallace • @Thetidethatturn • 16h

Did you work with him? I have some information about the original horizon post office scandal and he stole most of his content from a lady who would work quite hard on it already.

It's so utterly, utterly disrespectful and contemptuous of employees who are just trying to do their jobs.