Active discussions

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Prof Jo Phoenix vs The OU - Employment Tribunal Thread 3

993 replies

ickky · 11/10/2023 10:41

Started on 2nd October at Watford Employment Tribunal (Radius House, 51 Clarendon Rd, Watford WD17 1HP 01923 281750)

You may attend in person or remote viewing has been quite limited but you can request log in details from

Email [email protected]

Header should read

URGENT CURRENT CASE - Public Access Request - J Phoenix - The Open University - 3322700/2021

Ask for access link and pin and please give your name and address in the email as they check when you connect to the tribunal.

Abbreviations

JP - Jo Phoenix, Claimant (C)
OU - The Open University, Respondent (R)
J - Regional Employment Judge Young
P - Panel or panel member
BC - Ben Cooper KC, Counsel for C
JM - Jane Mulcahy KC, Counsel for R

OU Departments & Networks:

HWSRA - Health & Wellbeing Strategic Research Area
FASS - Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences
SPC - Dept of Social Policy & Criminology
KMi - Knowledge Media Institute
GCRN - Gender Critical Research Network

OU witnesses

PB - Dr Paraskevi Boukli, Former Senior Lecturer Criminology, Deputy Head SPC 2021-22
IF - Prof Ian Fribbance Dean of FASS
DD - Dr Deborah Drake, Senior Lecturer Criminology, Head of SPC 2018-21
LD - Dr Leigh Downes, Senior Lecturer in Criminology (in SPC), Academic Lead for EDI FASS 2019-21
CT - Catherine Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
LW - Louise Westmarland, Prof of Criminology, Co-Deputy Head SPC, 2018-21, Current Head SPC
MW - Prof Marcia Wilson, Dean EDI, 2020-23
CM - Caragh Molloy, Group People Director 2019-23
JD - John Domingue, Prof of Computing Science, Director KMi, 2015-22
PK - Peter Keogh, Professor Health & Society, Member RSSH
CW - Dr Christopher Williams, Senior Lecturer History
SD - Shaun Daley, Head OU’s Resourcing Hub. Head Strategic Resources, Co-Chair OU’s LGBT+ Staff Network
HBC - Helen Bowes-Catton, Lecturer Social Research Methods
NS - Nicola Snarey, Assoc Lecturer Eng Language
NatS - Natalie Starkey, Outreach & Public Engagement Officer Sch Physical Sciences, 2019-22
CT - Cath Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
SJ - Samantha Jacobson, Employee Relations Case Manager
RH - Richard Holliman, Prof Engaged Research, Head School Environment, Earth & Ecosystem Sciences, 2019-22. Member of Investigation Panel investigating the C’s grievance

Witness for JP:

SE - Sarah Earle, Professor Modern History Uni of Oxford, Founding member GCRN

Tribunal Tweets - https://twitter.com/tribunaltweets

TT coverage so far https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/professor-jo-phoenix-v-the-open-university

Thread 1 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4905118-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-2nd-october-whispers-ben-cooper?page=1

Thread 2
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4913946-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-2?page=1

Prof Jo Phoenix vs The OU - Employment Tribunal Thread 2 | Mumsnet

Abbreviations JP - Jo Phoenix, Claimant (C) OU - The Open University, Respondent (R) J - Regional Employment Judge Young P - Panel or panel memb...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4913946-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-2?page=1

OP posts:
Thread gallery
21
JoIsBraverThanIAm · 12/10/2023 12:12

What documents do witnesses get given, and when, pertaining to the case? After she left the OU, she wouldn't (or shouldn't!) have had access to the grievance any more, unless or until she was given a copy in connection with the tribunal.

pronounsbundlebundle · 12/10/2023 12:10

Well at least the witness took the declaration about telling the truth seriously.

Whereas others as we know consider 'truth' to be entirely made up subjective.

maltravers · 12/10/2023 12:10

AmaryllisNightAndDay · 12/10/2023 12:01

Not reading it when it is going to court AND you are a witness is just mind blowing.

By that stage you might be better off not reading it. You can't really argue that it wasn't your job to have read it, if you then read it just before the case goes to court.

I agree with this.

Ameanstreakamilewide · 12/10/2023 12:07

chilling19 · 12/10/2023 12:03

Well, there we go. Even Ben was shocked.

I bet he couldn't believe his luck that she came right out and said it like that.

When he said 'Never?!' - she must have realised that she'd done a wrong 'un?? She can't be that clueless, surely?

Sisterpita · 12/10/2023 12:07

Hopefully I will be let in at 12:15

RocketPanda · 12/10/2023 12:05

No debate. What's that, a grievance full of sense and reality? Nope no, no debate.

LarkLane · 12/10/2023 12:04

pronounsbundlebundle · 12/10/2023 12:03

Mind blown. This seems slam dunk for Jo now.

All the decisions made were based on people not reading / listening to things that were central to Jo's grievance!! So just on hearsay and personal opinion!

In a nutshell!

chilling19 · 12/10/2023 12:03

Well, there we go. Even Ben was shocked.

Melissamelisante · 12/10/2023 12:03

It does sound enthralling. Crossing my fingers that I'll get let in after the break. So annoyed to have missed the exchange.

MrsDoylesCake · 12/10/2023 12:03

How much time could she have taken on this if she didn’t even bother reading the bloody grievance?

Bet she read the TRA complaints

Mmmnotsure · 12/10/2023 12:03

Love it that Ben uses 'practicable'.

Ameanstreakamilewide · 12/10/2023 12:03

CriticalCondition · 12/10/2023 12:00

CM - balancing rights
Bingo

Clearly - some rights are more right than others.

TRA rights are the Royal Flush of rights.

pronounsbundlebundle · 12/10/2023 12:03

Mind blown. This seems slam dunk for Jo now.

All the decisions made were based on people not reading / listening to things that were central to Jo's grievance!! So just on hearsay and personal opinion!

JoIsBraverThanIAm · 12/10/2023 12:02

This part was so gripping that the judge forgot they were supposed to have a break!

pronounsbundlebundle · 12/10/2023 12:01

If I was Westminster(?) Uni I might be having a long hard look at whether she's the right person for her job there..... or at the very least rewriting her contract to specify that reading contentious grievances is part of the job..... (if not in there already).

Original poster
ickky · 12/10/2023 12:01

Break now until 12.15

OP posts:
AmaryllisNightAndDay · 12/10/2023 12:01

Not reading it when it is going to court AND you are a witness is just mind blowing.

By that stage you might be better off not reading it. You can't really argue that it wasn't your job to have read it, if you then read it just before the case goes to court.

Sisterpita · 12/10/2023 12:00

popebishop · 12/10/2023 11:48

I must be a little dim because someone will need to explain to me why the OU chose the person who has never read the grievance as a witness? A witness to how hard it is to read a grievance if you're busy?

Because they were on the working group and senior HR and so a decision maker/adviser etc.

pronounsbundlebundle · 12/10/2023 12:00

How can you balance harms if you haven't read the grievance? You can't.

CriticalCondition · 12/10/2023 12:00

CM - balancing rights
Bingo

chilling19 · 12/10/2023 11:58

Also, if a case is heading to a tribunal surely an organisation would do a thorough review of the case just to make sure there is not another way forward?

Chrysanthemum5 · 12/10/2023 11:58

And we have the usual 'a great deal of time was taken' - always complaining that doing their actual job and looking after staff takes their precious time

CriticalCondition · 12/10/2023 11:58

I think Ben likes that phrase too. He's used it again. The way this is going I expect it to appear in the judgment. 😁

MyLadyDisdainlsYetLiving · 12/10/2023 11:58

“I was following processes.”

would love to point out that as head of HR one of her jobs would be to consider whether the processes were fit for purpose.

CriticalCondition · 12/10/2023 11:56

Mmmnotsure · 12/10/2023 11:55

Perhaps the 'late start due to traffic' was CM refusing to get out of her car in the car park, not wanting to have to go through this lot in front of Ben.

😂