Page 11 | Heads should stop teachers allowing children to identify as cats, says No 10

IwantToRetire · 2023-06-20T16:12:04+00:00

^The spokesman said that teachers should not teach “contested opinions as facts” and called for headteachers to intervene in extreme cases.^ ^“It would not be right to comment on the actions of a specific individual or a specific school without knowing the full details, but we understand why these reports will be concerning for parents,” the spokesman said.^ ^“In broad terms, teachers have a responsibility to encourage their students to engage respectfully with those they disagree with.^ ^“They should also not be teaching contested opinions as fact, shutting down valid discussions and debates.^ ^“It’s important parents and carers are reassured that children aren’t being influenced by personal views of those teaching them. Any example that strays from this would be wrong and we would expect headteachers to act.”^ [[https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/06/20/rye-college-children-neo-pronouns-cats-moons-rishi-sunak https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/06/20/rye-college-children-neo-pronouns-cats-moons-rishi-sunak/]] Unlike the headline the article makes it clear that a "spokesman" (how old fashioned and sexist shouldn't that be spokesperson?!) has said this so Sunak may or may not have a public opinion about this ... But the Telegraph seems to be keen to keep the issue of self identifying on their front pages. When I first heard about children doing this I thought (hoped) that it was younger children making fun of the trans generation, but seems not. NB article is behind a paywall but can be read at [[https://archive.ph https://archive.ph]] by entering the Telegraph URL above into the box. (The cat in picture below looks very cross. Probably feels the same way GC women feel - outraged at the notion that some young human could in any way know or speak with experience based knowledge about being a cat!)

TheBiologyStupid · 22/06/2023 01:03

SunnyEgg · 21/06/2023 12:12

And each video or image that alerts people to what’s going on helps.

It takes it out of secrecy and shines a light right on it.

The girls’ recording is very helpful. So many try to down play it.

Yes, even if the cat aspect wasn't there, those girls were being ordered by a teacher to believe in gender ideology nonsense and lectured about intersex and how the sex binary doesn't exist.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/06/2023 00:58

It was always going to descend into utter absurdity and I believe we have further to go yet.

TheBiologyStupid · 22/06/2023 00:57

SunnyEgg · 21/06/2023 09:43

It’s brilliant that two 13 year old girls have caused males , TRAs and gender ideology believers to panic

So well done. It became about cat identifying. Showing how baseless it all is.

Simon Edge's next book is just writing itself...!

Original poster

IwantToRetire · 22/06/2023 00:48

Keir Starmer may not know the biological difference between a man and a woman but is able to see that biologically a child is not a cat.

Is this a positive step forward for the Labour Party or will there be a backlash from those who see all of this as a coded attack on trans self identifying?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/06/21/keir-starmer-children-self-identifying-as-cats/

Keir Starmer: ‘Clearly ridiculous’ for children to self-identify as cats

Labour leader thinks ‘children should be told to identify as children’ as he wades into growing row

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/06/21/keir-starmer-children-self-identifying-as-cats

OP posts:

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/06/2023 00:41

She shouldn't be in school, because cats don't go to school. She can stay home with her parents and sit on the sideboard or something.

CheeseTouch · 22/06/2023 00:35

If this girl really wants to live as a cat, then like a cat, she’s not entitled to an education or to wear clothing. No pizza and chips or any human food, only cat meat served on the floor twice daily, only water to drink. No loo, just a tray to pee and poo in. 😂 Lets see how long the delusion lasts.

LuluBlakey1 · 22/06/2023 00:26

literalviolence · 21/06/2023 23:57

Your suggestion does rely on 'living as they opposite sex' actually meaning something though and it only can with reference to stereotypes whichever should be dismantling not reinforcing.

Show quote history

I'm not sure if you have missed a word out or something or perhaps I am tired- but I can't quite make sense of your reply.

TheBiologyStupid · 22/06/2023 00:21

GrabbyGabby · 20/06/2023 17:42

I am really wary of this bollocks and whether it is happening anywhere other than anime chat rooms.

Going to want to see some hard evidencr e on whether this phenomenon is real in schools, not some my friends grandsons mate type stories.

Focus on this batshittery could so easily backfire.

There's an audio recording made by the girls in class linked to have n this report: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12209919/Full-audio-Student-rejected-classmates-claim-shes-CAT-scolded-teacher.html

Student who rejected classmate's claim that she's a CAT is criticised

The 13-year-old pupil said she was made to stay after the class at Rye College in East Sussex by the teacher, who can be heard in a secret recording calling her view that gender is binary 'very sad'.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12209919/Full-audio-Student-rejected-classmates-claim-shes-CAT-scolded-teacher.html

Original poster

IwantToRetire · 22/06/2023 00:07

I think the vast majority would agree with it.

They probably would, but suggesting this would have stopped it is really niave.

The trans agenda took hold within the establishment because through queer networking many TRAs got into positons of influence or on committees. And by the time any of us realised how far it had gone, probably the consultation on the GRA, it was too late.

Most of the media (who have the most influence) and decision makers had swalled the Stonewall agenda.

And when some tried to raise concerns, as we are now well aware, the backlash and bullying started.

And added to this is the underlying misogyny in society that says women's righta are never as important as anyone elses.

The TRA agenda was heavily amplified by the MRA agenda that were only too happy to tell women they could expect to be listened to.

And as with so many other things social contagion is hard to stop.

The idea that a few sensible women saying this is straight forward and will give everyone what they need, and the male dominated population would go of course is just not plausible.

If it was that simple how come in terms of the public as a whole, are at best on the be kind agenda. Because women are as always expected to give way to others.

And as said upthread, what had once been about a few people with genuine gender dysphoria had been hijacked by a politics who prioritised winning at any costs. ie the agenda if to make sure that women publicly bow down to their needs being superior to everyone else's, especially women.

OP posts:

literalviolence · 21/06/2023 23:57

LuluBlakey1 · 21/06/2023 18:29

My view has always been that the stance on trans by society should have been .
Most people are born as men or women. You can not change what sex you are.
A small number of people feel they should have been the opposite sex to the one they were born as. Some take medications or even have operations so they look more like that sex. They choose to dress as that sex and live as that sex. However, they are still genetically the sex they were born with.
We are a tolerant society and we allow people to live in whatever way they choose as long as it causes no harm to others.We should treat everyone with respect.
There are provisions for everyone in society- toilets for men, toilets for women and toilets that anyone can choose to use.Changing rooms the same.
However, some places/activities remain single sex and everyone has to respect that.

What's wrong with that as a stance?

Your suggestion does rely on 'living as they opposite sex' actually meaning something though and it only can with reference to stereotypes whichever should be dismantling not reinforcing.

OldGardinia · 21/06/2023 23:51

Is it just me or is this whole story basically The Emperor's New Clothes?

A whole load of adults afraid to say what's true and a couple of teenage girls come along and say "you're not a cat, mate!"

noblegiraffe · 21/06/2023 23:42

LuluBlakey1 · 21/06/2023 22:40

Yes, but perhaps because society went along with the ridiculousness because we were almost afraid to stop it and stand up to them.I can not understand why we have not simply promoted what I am suggesting was sensible- I think the vast majority would agree with it.

Show quote history

Isn't that the view that the teacher was saying? Biological sex and gender are different, you can identify differently to your biological sex and people shouldn't be called weird or crazy?

CurseYouPerryThePlatypus · 21/06/2023 23:31

The more people this peaks the better.

LuluBlakey1 · 21/06/2023 22:40

dcbc1234 · 21/06/2023 22:00

That would never be enough for the TRAs as it doesn't directly affirm their delusion or allow the thrill of co-opting others into their AGP fantasies.

Show quote history

Yes, but perhaps because society went along with the ridiculousness because we were almost afraid to stop it and stand up to them.I can not understand why we have not simply promoted what I am suggesting was sensible- I think the vast majority would agree with it.

LuluBlakey1 · 21/06/2023 22:37

LadyWithLapdog · 21/06/2023 21:20

@LuluBlakey1 in some places that’s not what happens, though. Unisex changing rooms in places like Hollisters, unisex toilets like MCR university, to name just 2 I came across in the past few days (yes, I don’t go out a lot and I didn’t know about this stuff). I understand where it’s not possible, like aeroplanes, and people manage perfectly well, but it’s not something I want otherwise. My DD didn’t see anything amiss with this 😒

Yes, I know but had we adopted this straightforward approach from the start instead of allowing ourselves (I mean society in general rather than you or me) to be bullied into going along with all this stuff we wouldn't be in this mess.

ScrollingLeaves · 21/06/2023 22:16

SmurfetteSalad · Today 21:20
Exactly from me too.

dcbc1234 · 21/06/2023 22:00

LuluBlakey1 · 21/06/2023 18:29

My view has always been that the stance on trans by society should have been .
Most people are born as men or women. You can not change what sex you are.
A small number of people feel they should have been the opposite sex to the one they were born as. Some take medications or even have operations so they look more like that sex. They choose to dress as that sex and live as that sex. However, they are still genetically the sex they were born with.
We are a tolerant society and we allow people to live in whatever way they choose as long as it causes no harm to others.We should treat everyone with respect.
There are provisions for everyone in society- toilets for men, toilets for women and toilets that anyone can choose to use.Changing rooms the same.
However, some places/activities remain single sex and everyone has to respect that.

What's wrong with that as a stance?

That would never be enough for the TRAs as it doesn't directly affirm their delusion or allow the thrill of co-opting others into their AGP fantasies.

LadyWithLapdog · 21/06/2023 21:21

PS I agree otherwise @LuluBlakey1

LadyWithLapdog · 21/06/2023 21:20

@LuluBlakey1 in some places that’s not what happens, though. Unisex changing rooms in places like Hollisters, unisex toilets like MCR university, to name just 2 I came across in the past few days (yes, I don’t go out a lot and I didn’t know about this stuff). I understand where it’s not possible, like aeroplanes, and people manage perfectly well, but it’s not something I want otherwise. My DD didn’t see anything amiss with this 😒

SmurfetteSalad · 21/06/2023 21:20

LuluBlakey1 · 21/06/2023 18:29

My view has always been that the stance on trans by society should have been .
Most people are born as men or women. You can not change what sex you are.
A small number of people feel they should have been the opposite sex to the one they were born as. Some take medications or even have operations so they look more like that sex. They choose to dress as that sex and live as that sex. However, they are still genetically the sex they were born with.
We are a tolerant society and we allow people to live in whatever way they choose as long as it causes no harm to others.We should treat everyone with respect.
There are provisions for everyone in society- toilets for men, toilets for women and toilets that anyone can choose to use.Changing rooms the same.
However, some places/activities remain single sex and everyone has to respect that.

What's wrong with that as a stance?

Exactly!

LuluBlakey1 · 21/06/2023 18:29

My view has always been that the stance on trans by society should have been .
Most people are born as men or women. You can not change what sex you are.
A small number of people feel they should have been the opposite sex to the one they were born as. Some take medications or even have operations so they look more like that sex. They choose to dress as that sex and live as that sex. However, they are still genetically the sex they were born with.
We are a tolerant society and we allow people to live in whatever way they choose as long as it causes no harm to others.We should treat everyone with respect.
There are provisions for everyone in society- toilets for men, toilets for women and toilets that anyone can choose to use.Changing rooms the same.
However, some places/activities remain single sex and everyone has to respect that.

What's wrong with that as a stance?

LadyWithLapdog · 21/06/2023 16:59

I’ve read the Westminster debate from 12 June. There were a couple of inflammatory remarks, but overall very good points (including from a few Labour women, BTW what’s Lab/Co-op?). I don’t understand, however, what the outcome was. It just said agreed at the end, but agreed with what?

MrsOvertonsWindow · 21/06/2023 15:28

LadyWithLapdog · 21/06/2023 14:22

@RedToothBrush I agree, we shouldn’t be in this situation. I’m reading through the debate on 12 June; it’s good.

Sorry if I misunderstood you earlier. As Red says - we shouldn't be in this situation and the education unions are massively responsible for adopting a trans activist approach to the extent that teachers know there's no support for any adult raising safeguarding, the rights of girls to privacy from boys or even the mental vulnerability of children believing a fantasy. So they've remained quiet while vulnerable children have escalated to the extent some claim to be a different species - and nobody puts a boundary in place and says no.

Starmer & Davey openly state that some women have a penis - Davey very recently. It maybe that the Lib Dem's funding from a drug company has influenced him to tell untruths or it maybe that his thinking is severely lacking. I'm no longer interested.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4812368-ed-davey-of-the-lib-dems-women-can-quite-clearly-have-a-penis

Ed Davey of the Lib Dems - Women can 'quite clearly' have a penis | Mumsnet

[[https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/women-quite-clearly-can-have-penis-ed-davey-says https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/women-quite-clearly-can-have-penis-ed-davey-s...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4812368-ed-davey-of-the-lib-dems-women-can-quite-clearly-have-a-penis

RedToothBrush · 21/06/2023 14:25

SunnyEgg · 21/06/2023 14:21

I understand why it takes hold, here and elsewhere. A top priority has become inclusivity

It’s only now when we see proof of where it’s going with men in female prisons, or teachers reacting as this one did does it really get mass pushback

Yes there were some savvy women on mn highlighting this, and have been for years so all gratitude but it takes those clear shocks to change the conversation dramatically

We should never have had to have these conversations because the women working in various fields and with certain experiences shouldnt be outside spheres of influence and power.

This is where we all feel down. Lack of representation in terms of socioeconomic experience - instead we have a dominance of people from educated backgrounds without hands on experience in these positions without alternative routes to progression.

The feminist argument and background holds up here for a reason.

dcbc1234 · 21/06/2023 14:23

RedToothBrush · 21/06/2023 14:13

Remember the opposition is supposed to hold power to account.

What's particularly unusual on this subject is the extent to which the government has been left to hold power to account in various sections of our society.

It SHOULD be in control of this, but it's not. That power has to come from other sources and be supported. It doesn't come from nowhere.

And this absolutely is not coming from grassroots.

You always have to ask why it was this way around.

Yes it comforts me slightly to think that as everywhere, it is the top down union leaders who have imposed pro 'gender identity ideology' policies on their members.
How ridiculous that a Trade Union will now refuse to defend a fully paid up member accused of transphobia...Unions may as well not exist.