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Women's rights general conversations

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Kucingsparkles · 06/12/2022 15:14

This is an experimental thread, all input much appreciated!

There is so much excellent information and so many active discussions on FWR that I wondered if it would be useful to have a thread to sort of "cross-fertilise" between them - airing little thoughts or vignettes that wouldn't themselves merit their own thread, to highlight other posts/threads of particular interest or to point to notable developments on fast-moving threads so that casual observers know where to look.

(For example, "the X thread has meandered onto a fascinating discussion of Y" or "Poster P's amazing analysis on thread Z might have relevance to the scenario in thread W" or even "Random bloke asked me to smile while I was choosing onions, grr"- that sort of thing).

Right, bring on the flames or flowers! <cowers>

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Original poster
Kucingsparkles · 15/12/2022 09:08

such dull, entitled pricks?

This morning DH gleefully showed me his Twitter feed (usually a peaceful haven of really geeky science stuff) - an acquaintance from his uni days was having his arse handed to him.

It was about the latest charming Righteous cancellation of another screening of Adult Human Female in Scotland; this uni friend had jumped in with the hot take of "I'm a Nice Guy and this fuss has only just come to my attention, so I don't really know much about it, but here's my input anyway... Why oh why can't everyone just Be Kind... and Ladies, perhaps if you were less strident... So really everyone could have avoided the fuss if they just watched it quietly online!"

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bignosebignose · 15/12/2022 09:03

He was so close to getting there if he'd just let her talk. Near the end when she said she probably wouldn't be worried about him personally being in an adjacent changing room he said something like "so how can you tell which men are safe and which aren't" and essentially didn't give her the chance to think for a second and say "that's the point."

angelico53 · 15/12/2022 08:55

How are the influential voices in this benighted country such dull, entitled pricks?

angelico53 · 15/12/2022 08:53

He (JOB) is a vicious, privileged bastard.

CyanCyan · 14/12/2022 23:36

Just found the original LBC exchange between JoB and KJK

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/12/2022 23:04

JoB has a team of people who make sure he gets callers he can tear apart. I have seen a few examples of people who slipped through that were more than able to argue their case, he just insults them and cuts them off when this happens. He is not one of the good guys, he is part of a system giving people the illusion of open debate.

He did this to Kellie Jay Keen - she has a video about it.

CyanCyan · 14/12/2022 22:26

"Yeah but you're scared of pronouns. Think about that, you call other people snowflakes but you are Scared. Of. Pronouns.”

This could equally be applied to ‘non-binary’ people.

duc748 · 14/12/2022 22:04

Wow! Couldn't believe what I was reading there. What a fuck-up. How have we slept-walked into this? At least, some good people are on the case.

BinturongsSmellOfPopcorn · 14/12/2022 21:29

From that thread, I suggest this is a particularly important one to not only read but act on. Check your NHS record lists your sex.

twitter.com/HairyLeggdHarpy/status/1062360988702466048?

BinturongsSmellOfPopcorn · 14/12/2022 20:28

Ah - I was coming to post the Equality Act thread, but I see DameMaude beat me to it. Very interesting how arguments and positions have shifted.

IReallyLikeCrows · 14/12/2022 18:33

I agree with him on a lot of things but he dug in against Jeremy Corbyn to a huge extent based on spurious media bullshit so he can do one frankly.

Dotellhimpike · 14/12/2022 17:15

JoB has a team of people who make sure he gets callers he can tear apart. I have seen a few examples of people who slipped through that were more than able to argue their case, he just insults them and cuts them off when this happens. He is not one of the good guys, he is part of a system giving people the illusion of open debate.

Original poster
Kucingsparkles · 14/12/2022 17:07

@DameMaud That's a really interesting thread, I found the link to Vulvamort's Twitter thread particularly illuminating.

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LoobyDop · 14/12/2022 16:58

Kucingsparkles · 14/12/2022 11:05

I increasingly think of JOB as the personification of the Old Place (sorry thecrack) - we share a view on so many things, and he's funny and witty. And then suddenly you see behind the mask and realise that he's also smug, angry, intolerant, deliberately ignorant and completely incurious (and actually a bit afraid of hearing wrongthink) about anybody who doesn't completely fit into his Good People category of indivisible Good Beliefs. In the end, he's as thought-terminatingly pseudoreligious about his Righteous Position, as anybody on the "other side" is about theirs.

That’s exactly how I feel about him. The way he shouted KJK down when she called in completely put me off him, and was actually a catalyst for me rethinking not my views, but my approach to Brexit. Belittling people, tripping them up, shouting over them- doesn’t work, it just makes them double down and stop listening, and if that’s all you’ve got in your arsenal, maybe it’s time to stop fighting.

DameMaud · 14/12/2022 16:58

Linking this thread here for any newbies from the 'other place' who might not see it (depending on how you notice threads/Might get lost in the volume) or weren't here when some of this came up before.
Very relevant right now and think you'll find it very interesting.
www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4697658-equality-act-2010-original-evidence-and-debate

IcakethereforeIam · 14/12/2022 15:27

Completely unprovoked, YouTube decided I might want to watch this, it was uploaded 16 years ago

Apparently, he's a 'gymnastic clown'. The commentators having fun with pronouns at the start. When artifacts of saner times pop up, I.....well, I may never see my eyebrows again.

Part of me thinks he's funny and talented, part of me thinks he's taking the piss but I think that's because of 'womanface' and men colonising women's sport, and part of me is just...would this happen now, would the audience laugh, would he be arrested? Not because it might offend women but because it might offend men.

duc748 · 14/12/2022 14:30

And thecrack's link, an interesting and thoughtful piece too.

duc748 · 14/12/2022 14:21

I am with Kuc on her appraisal of JOB. I always think of him as, I mostly agree, but...
There's a smug incuriousity there. The parallel is apt.

Thecrackineverything · 14/12/2022 14:14

Yes, absolutely - Thought that was interesting, too.

Original poster
Kucingsparkles · 14/12/2022 13:13

Thecrackineverything · 14/12/2022 12:11

I enjoyed this piece, about how everyone is 'pushing a concept'. It's got an American slant, but is translatable.

Course, it means as a feminist I also need to interrogate my own prejudices.

www.thefp.com/p/real-life-does-not-fit-the-narrative?utm_source=substack&publication_id=260347&post_id=90218674&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true

Thanks for the link, it was very interesting reading and reminds me of the importance of reflecting on my own assumptions.

These lines kind of stood out to me (in the context of what we've been saying on this thread):

Not only are these narratives untrue, they’re also uninspired and formulaic. They feel engineered with a takeaway in mind, assembled from a kit—with a moral, a villain, and a hero.

It is almost as though the purpose of the stories we are told is to obscure reality, not to reveal it.

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Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/12/2022 12:57

I increasingly think of JOB as the personification of the Old Place (sorry thecrack) - we share a view on so many things, and he's funny and witty. And then suddenly you see behind the mask and realise that he's also smug, angry, intolerant, deliberately ignorant and completely incurious (and actually a bit afraid of hearing wrongthink) about anybody who doesn't completely fit into his Good People category of indivisible Good Beliefs. In the end, he's as thought-terminatingly pseudoreligious about his Righteous Position, as anybody on the "other side" is about theirs.

Good call. I have a particular person in mind from when I used to post there.

Thecrackineverything · 14/12/2022 12:11

I enjoyed this piece, about how everyone is 'pushing a concept'. It's got an American slant, but is translatable.

Course, it means as a feminist I also need to interrogate my own prejudices.

www.thefp.com/p/real-life-does-not-fit-the-narrative?utm_source=substack&publication_id=260347&post_id=90218674&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true

DeanVolecapeAKAelderberry · 14/12/2022 12:11

and then you get a micro Twitter thread like this from a few weeks ago

twitter.com/jembloomfield/status/1596548473352253441

some chaps do get it

DeanVolecapeAKAelderberry · 14/12/2022 12:07

English public schools have a lot to answer for, and it trickles down from the JOBs who went to poshest places and infects lots of the other men too, because of that insidious class system.

Original poster
Kucingsparkles · 14/12/2022 11:07

Nice share @Britinme - I get CCP's Invisible Women newsletter too, and often forward them to my DDs so we can get a rousing feminist conversation going. (One of them chose to write about "Does sexism still exist?" for her English project this term - short answer YES).

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