BBC responds to backlash to article about lesbians being pressured into sex by some trans women

And there's always at least one rule that applies, isn't there. This time it's number 10.

10. The worst thing about male violence is that it makes men look bad.

But like some men are
Some people born male are sex predators. Men, transwomen and non binary male born people are just as likely and just as unlikely to be sex offenders as any person of the male sex.

I'm not interested in discussing "cotton ceiling" here

Too bad. That's what the thread is about.

The cotton ceiling refers to the gusset in the knickers of women. It's a play on the term glass ceiling. Something to be broken through.

A workshop was given to transwomen to help them deal the cotton ceiling. It was part of the title.

Cotton ceiling. Women's knickers. A thin cotton barrier between the outside world and their genitalia.

Some women, lesbians, have reported being coerced into sex by transwomen in direct violation of not only their sexual orientation, but their sexual boundaries and consent.

Yet more TRAs are trying to discredit these accounts, by any means possible, whilst never once appearing to criticise the concept of the cotton ceiling.

(Just reiterating the point of the thread).

This is the thread for discussing the bbc article about the cotton ceiling.

No, this thread is about the BBC's response to the backlash of that article.

The (2nd & current) thread for discussing the BBC article about the cotton ceiling is right here

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4386058-BBC-cotton-ceiling-thread-number-2

None of us, or the article, are IMPLYING that tw are rapists. We are SAYING that SOME transwomen are rapists. And that we believe the lesbians RAPE VICTIMS in the article.

Some transwomen are rapists. Some men are rapists. No implication, it’s fact.

Margarita and co in general:

"You can't believe anything you read online, and the BBC are charlatans who are quoting liars spreading misinformation."

Also Margarita and co in general:

"We've found an example of one woman online who is said to be insanely rambling about death threats and other incoherent things - so it's definitely true and representative of you and everything you want, you Mumsnet monsters."

At least I'm not the one throwing around the word "rape" like some others on this thread trying to imply transwomen are "rapists".

Have you listened to yourself?

Even the title of the article said SOME in the big letters!

If we are talking about rapists in general, do we need to preface it as NAMALT? Or does having a title stating 'some' and discussing that some in the article cover that?

Stop reading the twitter disseminations by people building their following, as you usually do, and engage your capacity to read and analyse the article for yourself.

Some lesbians are raped by male people who identify as women. Their rapes are aggravated by the threat from these male people that they will shame them within their community. Why is this not newsworthy in your opinion Margarita?

"If that's how you read it, perhaps that reflects your subconscious transphobia"

At least I'm not the one throwing around the word "rape" like some others on this thread trying to imply transwomen are "rapists".

The article doesn’t ‘imply’ anything. I says SOME tw are predators.

Or are you calling the lesbians interviewed about this liars @MargaritaPie? Are you claiming rape victims are lying now?

Lilly Cade wasn’t one of the victims interviewed btw, she was interviewed about where the term COTTON CEILING came from.

Some transwomen are sex predators.

"Do you mean that maybe pornography and working in the pornography industry is detrimental to mental health, and attitudes towards others"

The reasons why she is of unsound mind aren't for us to judge, but it looks like you are possibly agreeing that Cade is possibly unstable and may need some sort of mental health help to ensure she doesn't pose any risk of harm to anyone?

It’s almost like some people don’t read the titles of threads they post on.

I’ll just nip over to a thread about bf and start whinging about cf neighbours.

It’s like ‘hi how are you today’ and @MargaritaPie response is ‘two sugars and milk’

I'm not interested in discussing "cotton ceiling" here, I'm more concerned with the fact Cade is a sex predator and her views on transwomen.

Go make your own thread then. You have before so we know that you can do it. I am sure anyone interested will go across.

Do you see though what you are doing right now on this thread? Or can you not admit that you are attempting to, deliberately or indirectly, discredit the original article?

"This is the thread for discussing the bbc article about the cotton ceiling"

I thought the BBC article was about implying that transwomen are sex predators?

Say it aint so!

Let's recap. In a piece published on October 26th, a journalist recounted the origins of a phrase that was going to be new to many readers.

Are you saying that the journalist should have been able to see into the future, have been able to see how LC would react to the backlash against the article after publication in November and have cleaned her from etymological history in advance?

extract

The term "cotton ceiling" is sometimes used when discussing these issues, but it is controversial.

It stems from"glass ceiling", which refers to an invisible barrier preventing women from climbing to the top of the career ladder. Cotton is a reference to women's underwear, with the phrase intended to represent the difficulty some trans women feel they face when seeking relationships or sex. "Breaking the cotton ceiling" means being able to have sex with a woman.

The term is first thought to have been used in 2012 by a trans porn actress going by the name of Drew DeVeaux. She no longer works in the industry and I have not been able to contact her. However, I spoke to a former porn performer and director who believes she inspired DeVeaux to use it.

This is the thread for discussing the bbc article about the cotton ceiling.

Anyone would think you don’t like being faced with the rapey term COTTON CEILING.

I'm not interested in discussing "cotton ceiling" here, I'm more concerned with the fact Cade is a sex predator and her views on transwomen. In particular the recent article she wrote on her website which is a bit concerning. It reminds me of the sort of extreme thing a disturbed incel would write before going off and committing something bad.

If the journalist hadn’t explained where the term cotton ceiling originated from then she would have been discredited for that too.

The amount of deflection on this thread is staggering

People are, at long last, beginning to see the all the outlets for fury against women that this ideology attracts. As Helen Joyce said when she was interviewed. It's a misogyny magnet.

And, up until now, a lot of it has managed to be disguised. But now, when people are actually trying to discredit rape victims, the cat is out of the bag, and running around in ever decreasing circles.

Attacking these women is saying what? They should be raped? It doesn't matter that they were raped?

As Jane Clare Jones says, this is "the biggest patriarchal unmasking you could imagine".

Yep. And the faster they bring it on, the better.

The article discussing Cade in relation to the term 'cotton ceiling' and how it came about. The author is up front about who coined it.

The term is first thought to have been used in 2012 by a trans porn actress going by the name of Drew DeVeaux. She no longer works in the industry and I have not been able to contact her is what the author wrote and then did get comment from Lily Cade.

So, I repeat, what is the reason for discrediting these women's stories based on the article mentioning Lily Cade in conjunction with how the term cotton ceiling came about?

If you are attempting to discredit the author or the article on this basis, do you see how that works to silence any more women coming forward with their stories? Or is that the point of the exercise.

Not one person has supported any deed or any thing that Lily Cade has said or done on this thread to my knowledge. Except to have said that if she had indeed been one of the 'informants' then why should she not be listened to as a victim? Or is it only the pure people that should have there stories listened to?

That has been the discussion around Cade's involvement.

Please tell us pie what your aim is in posting this link?