BBC responds to backlash to article about lesbians being pressured into sex by some trans women

I hope I am not considered to have defended Cade?

I have said that I think she has mental health problems based on what she has written and that she needs help.

I have also said that I hope she is dealt with in accordance of the laws of the relevant country.

I further think she is damaged by the porn industry. I would like both porn and prostitution made illegal.

Margarite, You said you've witnessed extreme transphobia ... While displaying extreme lesbophobia. I SEE YOU.

Some Gender Criticals are too. Ms Lily Cade for instance.

I don't know if Lily Cade is 'a Gender Critical'. She is someone who refuses to have sex with male bodied people.

What she said in that blog post though is absolutely disgusting and vile. There is no defending it at all, and there have been a couple of comments on this thread that have skated pretty close to defending it (she is sick of the bullshit, it was taken out of context she is talking about personas). No. That is some funked up shit she has published.

However, I'm not sure is going to be the 'major journalistic scandal' that Owen Jones is currently rabidly claiming on Twitter - you can almost hear the frothing! The question remains about whether lesbians should be allowed to discuss being pressured into sex by some transwomen and whether or not its transphobic for a lesbian to exclude transwomen from her dating pool. Owen Jones and the rest of them still will never answer that simple question, despite the rest of the bullshit.

Plus I've also witnessed some extreme transphobia from people who don't appear to be porn or former-porn actors/actresses.

Yes and often from people, almost always male, who now declare themselves to be trans allies. Gives them a nice excuse to malign women now.

I've also witnessed some extreme transphobia from people who don't appear to be porn or former-porn actors/actresses

As your idea of 'extreme transphobia' is using the correct pronoun for somebody I'll need specific examples.

Plus I've also witnessed some extreme transphobia from people who don't appear to be porn or former-porn actors/actresses.

What has that got to do with this article and the BBC response to it?

No denies there is some horrific transphobia displayed. In fact, some supposed trans allies have been forgiven for some bloody awful past comment.

Still does make your intention to discredit the article any more righteous.

Plus I've also witnessed some extreme transphobia from people who don't appear to be porn or former-porn actors/actresses.

"The other has a compilation of the negative effects of porn. I think that probably plays a large role in Lilly Cade’s seemingly poor mental health"

"probably" is a bit speculative there.

There are a huge number- tonnes- of professional and amateur porn actors and actresses. They all don't write blogs calling for the genocide of a vulnerable minority group of people.

Males! Males are responsible for 98% of sex offences the UK. That does not mean that female cannot be sex offenders.

Really it is not that hard.

However, your continuing along this tack shows absolutely what your intention here is. Denying rape victims a voice because you have deemed one person mentioned in the article (and who is not a source of anything except for the way the name came into being) as being a predator.

And yes, I am quite sure there are many people who believe that sex is immutable are predators. Despite what YOU think, it is the prevailing understanding of scientific fact. Most of those have no idea that they could be ‘Gender Criticals’ as you so nicely put it.

It is time to own up to your own behaviour here. It isn’t righteous at all.

I have started two new threads .

1. Has research on how sex buyers seem to be more likely to commit rape and sexual violence. Did we have anyone here in favour of prostitution?

2. The other has a compilation of the negative effects of porn. I think that probably plays a large role in Lilly Cade’s seemingly poor mental health (I assume that anyone writing what she did is unwell).

Maybe the people keen to discuss Lilly could pop over to one of those threads?

I am quite interested in discussing BBCs response to the critic on their impartial article. I think they did the right thing. And, anecdotally, the critique of their article has made many more people read it. And think wtf. Why are rape victims being silenced.

It’s the double whammy of lesbians who are victims of tw speaking up brings. Not only does it now make a subset of men look bad. But it makes them look like men, also.

Well yes. Everyone knows about instructions, articles and websites for incels and pick up artists. It's a very male thing.

And now the 'cotton ceiling'. More of the same shit.

Despite how gross it is, almost everyone reading it will accept the premise, without question. Because same old, same old.

The hugely disproportionate desperation to shut it down might be news to some, though.

Almost certainly less than 100%
Absolutely Laetitia but unfortunately not 0%

Some Gender Criticals are too. Ms Lily Cade for instance

As a sex worker producing lesbian porn Ms Lily Cade objected to male people having penetrative sex with her. Not sure of her gender critical views other than her belief that no woman has a penis? It is also clear that she really doesn't like male people who identify as women and has said some awful stuff. However, Margarita , as a supporter of sex workers , do you not believe that this woman had the right to choose the sex acts in which she was willing to participate?

Gender critical women and women. Women commit less than 2% of all sex crimes.

Men (and tw) commit 98% of sex crimes.

That’s part of why there’s the accusations of transphobia and the threats and harassment.

If they can silence lesbians from coming forward in msm then no one hears about it, so they don’t look bad and get to keep pretending the transitioning makes them women.

It’s the double whammy of lesbians who are victims of tw speaking up brings. Not only does it now make a subset of men look bad. But it makes them look like men, also.

Can’t keep pretending anyone sees them as women then.

"But like some men are [sex predators]"

Some Gender Criticals are too. Ms Lily Cade for instance.

Isn’t it that the worst thing is women talking about it because it will make men look bad.

Yes, that's right actually. It could probably do with an edit. They don't give a shit if women are raped, as long as they don't talk about it.

It's the very fact that this has gone into an article by the BBC, that is producing the howls of outrage.

Everybody knows that lesbians are targeted. Not a day goes by without a mention of it on social media. Whole groups have been set up to counter it.

But now it's down there in black-and-white, and everyone else can see it. That's the problem.

I'm not interested in discussing "cotton ceiling" here

I guess that's too bad, because that's what the thread is about.

I don’t think that many men care it makes them look bad as long as we are silent.

[quote Journeyofthedragons]This is the thread for discussing the bbc article about the cotton ceiling.

No, this thread is about the BBC's response to the backlash of that article.

The (2nd & current) thread for discussing the BBC article about the cotton ceiling is right here

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4386058-BBC-cotton-ceiling-thread-number-2[/quote]
K. I’m sure you get what I meant.

Thread about awful shit males do to women and @MargaritaPie turns up and says I’m not discussing the awful shit males do to women, but one of the women did x y & z and you must all buy that’s worse.

I think that some transwomen have been convicted of rape. With their penises. In the U.K. you need a penis to rape.

I thought this thread was about TRAs so desperate to silence this that they attacked an impartial BBC article where everyone was invited to speak, including the cyclist and Dennis Riley who both have told lesbians that they should do penis.

But Lily Cade does seem quite disturbed and she probably needs help. I am not sure where she has posted her rant but it should be subject to the laws in that country.

I do believe that porn and prostitution messes people up. I have read two interesting reports recently, one showing how awful men became when they used porn, the other about the links between men using prostitutes and sexual assault. I will see if I can start a thread on that.