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Original poster

Some thoughts on trans, the media and society

410 replies

Nefelibata33 · 01/08/2021 01:21

Hello everyone, I'm starting a new thread, cos I posted this message on a thread about Dr Helen Webberley, but people said they didn't want to discuss it, cos the thread was specifically about Dr Webberley. So I thought I would post my message for everyone to see, in a new thread. I think it's worth reading, I would like to discuss things with people. If you want to say something, please do. I will talk to anyone. Abuse me if you want, but I'd prefer if you didn't. I couldn't give a sh*t tbh. Sending love xxx. Here's my original message below

Hi everyone.

Just a post to say something. Firstly, if you are really concerned about big pharma, check that the NHS is in league with big pharma, and they dish out drugs like they're smarties. I have no idea what state you may be in, but you may have experience of this. I find it totally scary that so many people are getting hooked on drugs, cos a doctor prescribed it. This really isn't ok. As an example, a few years ago, they changed the blood sugar reading for which you can be described as diabetic. So more people could be diagnosed as diabetic, and more people could be given diabetic meds, and hey... a GP gets a bonus every time they diagnose someone as diabetic. I think the NHS is great, the nurses who are ready to sacrifice their own lives to help others, like Florence Nightingale. Like my Grandma. Like one of my cousins. But the ones who sit in offices and dish out drugs, they are a real problem.

Why am I saying this? Because doctors will dish out every drug going, even when they have horrendous side effects, make people actually feel worse than they were to begin with. Do we hear anything about this in the media? No. It doesn't sell papers. Any sort of backlash against big pharma? No. Because the media are onside with the mega rich pharmaceutical company directors getting richer and the poor getting poorer, not that the media would say that. Is there a type of drug doctors aren't allowed to dish out? Yes, oestrogen or testosterone.

This is the only thing no doctor can prescribe. There are plenty of countries around the world that take a different approach to trans people, and it's not so difficult to get hormones. With no disasters taking place. Keira Bell got a lot of attention. One person that made a mistake, amongst the thousands of trans kids who are happy as they are. One person. The media made a big deal of it.

Would it be wrong if I said that the media in this country have an axe to grind against any minority group? The Sun carried out a massive racist hate campaign against Raheem Sterling a few years ago. Britain's most prominent black footballer, it wasn't racist at all. You saw the racist abuse thing after England didn't win the Euros. It's absolutely shameful that so many people think it's OK to send someone death threats, JUST BECAUSE THEIR SKIN IS A DIFFERENT COLOUR. Encouraged by the Sun. The tabloids are the cancer of this country, our society would be much better without them I think, but we're stuck with them. They killed Princess Diana. A woman who was in the prime of her life, so happy, and bang... killed by the tabloids. There was a massive outpouring of emotion, but did it stop anyone from buying the tabloids? No. Nobody learns. I've read on this site, all this woke this woke that. Prince Harry has been accused of being woke. Cos he married a mixed race woman, and he doesn't want her to end up like his Mum. Think about it. Not "woke", a loving human being.

I don't get the woke thing. It's just a word that has been invented to describe someone who cares for social justice, and is right on. Can someone please explain to me why that's so bad? I really don't get it. Why are kind people a problem? Could it be, that there are just a lot of people who aren't very kind?

Back onto the media, they are totally corrupt, lying bullshtters. GB News is really struggling, so to boost ratings, they decided to attack the Trans community. To boost ratings! I guess that's more entertaining for the sort of people who watch it. I am now going to say something. I don't care who you are, but just realise this. Trans people are being treated just like gays were 20 or 30 years ago. The media do this to sell papers, and make money. Rupert Murdoch is Australian, he's an immigrant, but his papers bang on about immigration. Fcking hypocrite. The demonisation of Trans people is just part of a large scale war by the right wing/neo nazi movement. Are any of you reading this wondering now? It's part of a nazi thing. Caring for children is one thing, but demonising a group of people who just happened to be so unlucky that they were born in the wrong body is another. Have a heart, people. No transgender person wants to hurt you, or your children. They are not dangerous to anyone, the women's toilets, shelters, changing rooms in clothes shops... This is the truth. You don't get the truth in the papers. The papers don't have anyone's best interest at heart, they are just trying to make money.

I've said what I needed to say. I came on Mumsnet cos I'd heard of it, and I wanted to see how people think. I've received quite a bit of abuse off people, quite nasty, and some questions about my level of intelligence. Don't worry, I'm intelligent, and I won't stoop to the level of insulting someone else for being different, or having different opinions.

I am a feminist. There, I said it. I would die to protect a woman. So how come so many so called feminists are against Trans women? Do you actually believe a Trans woman is going to rape you in the toilets? NEWS! Trans women don't hurt or kill women, MEN DO. Trans women are not men. No Trans woman wants to hurt you. It's just the sort of fcked up shtbag men that want to hurt you.

If anyone wants to comment on anything I wrote, feel free. Make it intelligent, no gratuitous abuse please X

OP posts:
Original poster
Nefelibata33 · 01/08/2021 12:24

I didn't ignore the links.

I feel really disgusted, having looked at all of it. We're not all like that, believe me. These are just examples of the worst kind of behaviour possible.

Every group of people has good and bad elements. I guess there are plenty of women who are nasty. There are loads of men who are nasty.

I don't know what to say. Just because there are bad people in a group, it doesn't make everyone bad. But I had never read these stories. I feel really sad, reading all that. Devastated.

We are not all like that. I have nothing but love for other people, and so many people like me are basically decent people. There are shtty people and not shtty people. In every walk of life.

We're not all bad. I'm sorry, a few isolated cases don't make a whole group of people bad.

OP posts:
rabbitwoman · 01/08/2021 12:12

I think that's the point, @candylebonbon

It is gaslighting. Constantly telling you the sky is green when you are LOOKING at a blue sky, but with so much conviction you are starting to believe it.

Deliriumoftheendless · 01/08/2021 12:10

I agree chickenyhead no one has been abusive but I also know how some posters like to suppress valuable information that contradicts their arguments.

CandyLeBonBon · 01/08/2021 12:08

I mean people posting stuff about trans women raping and murdering women and children. PLEASE! When has that ever happened?

This has to be a wind-up, surely no one can be this obtuse in reality?

Chickenyhead · 01/08/2021 12:06

@Deliriumoftheendless

You set up a thread about medical ethics after trying to wedge a derail into the Webberly thread.

You then derail your own thread by veering off into a denial that transwomen ever harm women. (Incidentally, if that is true why are trans sex offenders in prison? Or is this a massive miscarriage of justice? Please square that one.)

I expect you will be getting Mumsnet to delete this thread soon enough as the evidence here is not what you want to hear.

Well I hope they don't. Nobody has been abusive and the OP has hardly revealed anything about themselves.
rabbitwoman · 01/08/2021 12:06

What is going on here is very indicative of conversations I have had up and down twitter on this subject.

An example, I was speaking to one twitterer about how I felt the trans agenda was homophobic and basically, gay conversion therapy (I paraphrase)

  • there is plenty of evidence that homophobic parents are 'transing away the gay' in their children; ashamed of having a lesbian daughter, they would rather have a transgender son
  • that's crap! That's right wing propaganda Daily Mail hate speech and never happens! Prove it!!
  • are you familiar with the Tavistock case? The witness statements from several ex clinicians mention homophobia...
  • yes, I have read ALL the Tavistock evidence and didn't see that anywhere!
  • okay, well here is a link to Dr David bell's interview on news night where he specifically states it. Its only 8 min long if you are pressed for time....
  • yes, watched it. Didn't see him say that anywhere!!
  • at about 5.17 he specifically states that clinicians came to him worried about homophobic parents wanting to put their gay children through conversion therapy
  • no he doesn't! He doesn't say that! And he's a washed up hack who has been discredited for being a teansphobe and you are a Nazi!!! - block-

Don't really know why we bother.....

Chickenyhead · 01/08/2021 12:05

www.google.com/amp/s/metro.co.uk/2019/03/16/transgender-woman-18-sexually-assaulted-girl-10-morrisons-toilet-8914577/amp/

Another

Shall I continue indefinitely?

Will it make any difference to you?

Deliriumoftheendless · 01/08/2021 12:01

You set up a thread about medical ethics after trying to wedge a derail into the Webberly thread.

You then derail your own thread by veering off into a denial that transwomen ever harm women. (Incidentally, if that is true why are trans sex offenders in prison? Or is this a massive miscarriage of justice? Please square that one.)

I expect you will be getting Mumsnet to delete this thread soon enough as the evidence here is not what you want to hear.

TheMarzipanDildo · 01/08/2021 11:59

I’m a bit concerned that my comment could have come across as harsh to someone suffering with crippling gender dysphoria. If that’s the case OP, I hope that you are getting all the help you need to look after your mental health.

RoseisMadder · 01/08/2021 11:54

OP, I’ve read all your responses and I overwhelmingly believe that you’ve been told (possibly by the activists mentioned) how horrible, mean, toxic us GC ladies are. You’ve come here with this preconceived notion, expecting hate. You’ve received the opposite and now you’re disappointed.
I don’t believe you ever intended to have a discussion, answer questions or read the replies. You wanted to be able to say ‘You were right, look at all these hateful replies’
I don’t hate anyone, men or transwomen. I feel incredibly sad that society (men) won’t accept gender non conforming men.
It sounds like you’ve had some terrible experiences. I hope you’ve got the support you need

Deliriumoftheendless · 01/08/2021 11:53

@Nefelibata33

You are not posting in good faith

Your continual denial that transwomen could hurt women flies in the face of evidence from the MoJ.

It’s like MRAs who insist women lie about rape despite the (pitifully low) convictions.

And before you get sad, outraged and defensive either a) look at the info women are posting or b) drop the “this NEVER happens” lie.

Again, anyone lurking- can you see how lies are presented rather than accepting the reality of what is going on? Time and time again.

TheMarzipanDildo · 01/08/2021 11:52

“I always try to put myself in someone else's shoes, when I talk to them. Put yourself in my shoes. You're all female, how would you like it if you'd been born with male genitalia? You wouldn't be very happy would you?”

If I was born with male genitalia, I’d be a man, and probably perfectly happy about it. I, like most the women on here, have no internal sense of gender. In that situation, I’d have had no experience of being a women, so how would I know what it would feel like to be one?

As it is, I have no experience of being a man, or black, or Spanish, or going to a private school, or being an immigrant, so how can I pontificate with any certainty about what it feels like to be/do any of those things?

If you are a trans women OP, you have experience of being a man and being a trans women. You do not know what it feels like to be a woman. You presumably have experience of feeling very uncomfortable in your male body, but this does not mean that you are a woman.

GromblesofGrimbledon · 01/08/2021 11:51

This thread is so shambolic.

I opened it at 5am this morning, couldn't make head nor tail of the OP's writing style, and left. Felt like I'd tumbled through the looking-glass and it was just far too early for a mad-hatter's tea party.

I've just come back on to see if I can make any sense of it.

... nope. Kudos to those trying. It seems fruitless.

As for this: There have been some comments, like, trans women are just like men.

Transwomen are not like men. They are men. Out of courtesy, if I meet a man who wishes they were a woman and who I think deserves respect (and I decide who deserves that respect and who doesn't), I call them a "transwoman". But they are biologically men and don't magically stop being men because they say so.

KohlaParasanda · 01/08/2021 11:49

OP, you sound as if you aren't in a very good place right now. I'd be worried about you if you were my son or if you turned up at my workplace and said the things you're saying on here. Do you have anyone in real life who can support you in accessing some help?

WhereYouLeftIt · 01/08/2021 11:48

I'm not sure if this is a wind-up, drunk posting, an inadequate attempt to be a TRA, or some pub is missing its bore.

Bizarre posting from the OP.

Thelnebriati · 01/08/2021 11:48

@Nefelibata33 Stop despairing, read the answers you have got and actually engage with them instead of treating this like an abstract game.

Its not a game to us. We are real people.

Helleofabore · 01/08/2021 11:45

I mean people posting stuff about trans women raping and murdering women and children. PLEASE! When has that ever happened?

You are now posting complete nonsense. If we posted the links you still would not look at them. We have shown you evidence and you have ignored it. I realise it is hard to take it in but please do read the links, read the evidence.

Waitwhat23 · 01/08/2021 11:41

The posters on here post evidence, links, research, personal accounts and well reasoned, thoughtfully considered discussion to explain why women are fighting for their sex based rights and what we get in return is a stream of hyperbole.

I mean people posting stuff about trans women raping and murdering women and children. PLEASE! When has that ever happened?

It has happened. Posters on here have evidenced specific examples. You can't just hand wave them away because it doesn't suit your narrative.

As a pp said, we are not non player characters in your life. We are people with our own views and opinions. We are not here to validate you.

Chickenyhead · 01/08/2021 11:40

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3348290-It-will-never-happen-resource-thread

A thread for you to ignore

Helleofabore · 01/08/2021 11:40

Datun

It is indeed boring if it doesn’t fit into a soundbite.

Unfortunately, if you have outsourced your thinking to self identified ‘thought leaders’ of a movement, you cannot see that the foundations for your ill informed arguments are so easily dislodged.

And you then compound this by repeating the ‘disagreement is hate and all those disagreeing are ‘hating on’ you’ lie that you have been told over and over by people you have been led to believe care about you rather than just getting ‘likes’ and securing their space as a media star.

titchy · 01/08/2021 11:39

. I mean people posting stuff about trans women raping and murdering women and children. PLEASE! When has that ever happened?

People have posted lots of links and examples of these very things. Spend some time reading them.

Bet you won't though, cos PLEASE! When has that ever happened?

MilesJuppIsMyBitch · 01/08/2021 11:39

And what do you mean 'all women are fantastic'? We're not a homogeneous group.

We have our share of angels and arseholes. We're human.

Chickenyhead · 01/08/2021 11:38

Have you read anything on this thread?

Anything at all?

There is an entire thread on her about transwomen violence to women and children. Even on this very thread someone posted the Karen White link.

I no longer believe that you are innocently confused. You are deliberately ignoring us and insisting we all focus on you.

Me, me, me, me, me....

No!

Go, live your life happily, do as you please. But stop bullying biological women and trampling their rights.