Don't question puberty blockers.

www.change.org/p/rt-hon-matt-hancock-mp-inquiry-into-alleged-pressure-by-trans-lobbyists-on-tavistock-clinic-s-treatment-protocols

A new petition

Humans
I've been in a few discussions with friends and others about this very issue
Who on earth would have an interest in a child like sterile person. I know what conclusion I reached and it's not a good one.

I’m going to be blunt here. Given that they don’t go through puberty and don’t mentally go through the steps needed to mature. Are they technically still children but will go on to do adult things with adult people? Doesn’t sit right with me.

Cancer is an illness. Is being transgender an illness now?

They can’t seem to decide what being trans is..

So as an example, Jazz Jennings is an 18 year old prepubertal male with medication-induced breast growth. And will remain that way for the rest of their life.

No, they don’t go through the “right” puberty. They get effects of the medications on other parts of the body - hair growth from testosterone in females, enlargement of the usually unaffected breast tissue in males, as examples - but they don’t ever go through any form of puberty.

Question for the scientists on here. The line told is always that puberty blockers are there to prevent children going through the wrong puberty. If a child then goes on to take cross sex hormones do they go through the right puberty? Can that happen? Cross sex hormones are synthetic, so trick the body into developing in a different way than their DNA would if left alone. Puberty is also more than body development, but also has a big impact on brain maturity. Does that still happen or does not going through natural puberty have knock on effects on the brain?
What happens if someone stops with the cross sex hormones? Puberty strikes again?

I’m still waiting for someone to explain to me how a child who has been on puberty blockers, then cross sex hormones, then had their prepubertal testes removed and prepubertal penis surgically altered is supposed to have an orgasm.

In America:

Conversation

The Kelsey Coalition
@CoalitionKelsey
Newly uncovered evidence reveals that this 5-year NIH medical experiment on children is even worse than we thought. In 2017, the age of administering cross-sex hormones was lowered from 13 to 8. Why would any MD inject an 8-year old girl with testosterone? (link: docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/3f4f51_a929d049f7fb46c7a72c4c86ba43869a.pdf )

I remember being a teen and struggling with very severe depression and suicidality which eventually led to being hospitalised with Bipolar (in my twenties). The GP argued that I was not of an age to make an informed decision about the side effects of medication that hadn’t been tested in children. I believe that 17ish years on much more is known about SSRIs safe to use in adolescence but they only tend to be used as a last resort.

What happened? Why are puberty blockers so different?

Of course the pros and cons of drugs needs to be discussed!
The only reason you wouldn't want to do that is when you don't give a stuff about the negative effects and you are only focused on your own self-interests.

When my mum was pregnant with an elder sibling, she was prescribed Thalidomide for morning sickness. Dad read early newspaper reports raising concerns about the drug and potential side effects. He took these to the GP to discuss it with him. On being shown said reports, the GP rose up in fury and shouted ‘How dare you question my authority!’ before Dad was shown the door.

Councillor Murray, we do have public discussions over all sorts of drugs and their effects. Without them, my sibling may have been another child born with severe birth defects. We most certainly SHOULD be having them over puberty blockers.

THreads re Cllr Gregor Murray's outbursts/resignation last year:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3316098-Childrens-Convenor-Elected-Councillor-calls-women-cunts-on-Twitter-rants

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3332582-Trans-councillor-leaves-roles-after-threats-to-life

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3332132-Childrens-Convenor-Gregor-Murray-resigns

Wasn’t there quite a lot of discussion around one of the SSRI’s causing suicidality in young people? I think it was Seroxat, although it had a different name in the US.

Also thalidomide, diestilbestrol (so? I mean DES), there must be others - there are plenty of examples of where drugs have caused tragic side effects. I mean, even the early contraceptive pill had unacceptable side effects and the hormonal doses had to be lowered.

Cancer now?

Well if there was a shiny new cure for anything that actually did so much damage that even Panorama got some research done to show how dangerous and non-researched a pile of bollocks the cure is and then put it on the telly for all to see you might find that cure suddenly wasn't so shiny after all.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3517453-Panorama-25-Feb-20-30hrs-Trans-Kids-Why-Medicine-Matters-Thread-title-edited-by-MNHQ

blogs.bmj.com/bmjebmspotlight/2019/02/25/gender-affirming-hormone-in-children-and-adolescents-evidence-review/
The current evidence base does not support informed decision making and safe practice.

As for being careful who we link to, what utter rot! What matters is the truth will out surely? The importance is the emphasis on who agrees the protection of women and children is worth discussing not whether a total opinion comparison and analysis renders everyone clone like on every subject!

Quick reminder though - the American College of Paediatricians is a right wing pressure group (for all its fancy name) and not to be confused with the reputable professional body (which is the American Association or something along those lines).
Yes, they're a tiny (500 members) pressure group. They're against affirmation for trans teenagers, but that's only because they're anti-everything that isn't hetrosexual and 'normal'. Thus, they're against gay marriage and adoption and advocate conversion therapy for gay teens.
The entirely unintended congruence with one plank of American RW groups is the reason why being GC here is so often interpreted as being right-wing and entirely hostile to trans people - as this article shows. So we should be very careful who we quite and what we link to.

OhHolyJesus
Roaccutane was developed for skin cancer but then found to be v effective in treating acne. It can also in rare cases trigger severe depression and has been linked to suicides.
So yes, there has been a lot of debate about that particular treatment for acne, as there is about lots of drugs - why should puberty blockers be any different?

EverythingBowl said.

Quick reminder though - the American College of Paediatricians is a right wing pressure group (for all its fancy name) and not to be confused with the reputable professional body (which is the American Association or something along those lines).

Every time I question puberty blockers in front of my TRA spouse he starts twitching visibly and whining about how he could be so beautiful if he had been given them starting at age 12 and they are totally reversible and its a human rights violation to not give them to 12 year olds who question their gender because irreversible beards growing in twitches uncontrollably until I shut up

Cancer is an illness. Is being transgender an illness now?

“We wouldn’t have a public discussion over the pros and cons of a new cancer drug, or a new cream for acne.

Wuh?

Exactly Hereford1! Roaccutane was debated!

Use of Puberty Blockers is ‘Institutionalized Child Abuse’

(President of the American College of Pediatricians)

www.faithwire.com/2017/12/14/american-college-of-pediatricians-president-sounds-off-says-use-of-puberty-blockers-is-institutionalized-child-abuse/

Psychological, I mean!

‘potentially irreversible bodily changes caused by the hormonal treatment’

British Psychology Society

www.bps.org.uk/news-and-policy/systematic-review-puberty-suppressing-drugs-do-not-alleviate-gender-dysphoria