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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Womb transplants for trans women are a human right, says surgeon

766 replies

QuietContraryMary · 08/02/2019 22:14

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/transgender-women-should-entitled-womb-13972102

"Because once the medical community accept this as a treatment for cis-women with uterine infertility, such as congenital absence of a womb, then it would be illegal to deny a trans-female who has completed her transition.

"The most important step is the harvesting from the donor as great care is required to avoid damage to the arteries and veins supplying the uterus.
Trans females have a much narrower pelvis than cis-women of the same height, but there would still be room for them to carry a child.

“Supplemental hormones could be taken to replicate the changes that occur in the body when a woman is pregnant.

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WeRiseUp · 19/02/2019 14:02

Apologies for keep bumping the thread- it's preying on my mind. But as others have said this is all about pushing the Overton window towards normalising a sicko psychopathic transhumanist fantasy of dissassembling and reassembling humans like lego.

In Fae's article it is also pushing another taboo- about incest - into the acceptable frame isn't it? The idea of a mother's sex organs being planted into her son. It is Frizl in reverse.

Furthermore I think it is utterly calculating. The Ed Gein element of AGP is in desperate need of a re-brand. Gone are the days it is only radical lesbian feminists objecting, so guilting and shaming lesbians about cock-avoidance is no longer enough by itself.

Now that mums have started to join in and the movement us growing, the narrative needs tweaking. So now instead of us mums seeing AGPs as sick men wanting to climb inside or skins, open us up and take our wombs and wear our breasts, we should see them as our own sons, our own children, desperate to be mums themselves one day, just like us - what mother wouldn't want to give her own beloved child the ultimate gift - motherhood?

The only problem is Fae is utterly clueless about female psychology and the psychology of motherhood and the reality of how difficult and dangerous giving birth can be. Fae doesnt realise that males' fantasies about being pregnant and giving birth themselves are a fucking insult to every woman who has ever done it. It just gives us the creeps.

hipsterfun · 19/02/2019 13:45

I should’ve been a 6 foot, stick thin supermodel with perfect teeth and a million quid in the bank.

Boo hoo at the unfairness of life.

WeRiseUp · 19/02/2019 11:58

That Fae article is so perverse and disgusting. Could you get any more Norman Bates than wanting to have your own mother's ovaries and uterus (would it include the cervix and vagina?) cut out and implanted into a surgical cavity in your abdomen and to give birth to your own siblings through it? Most people reach for a bag to be sick in, not a tissue to dab happy bitter-sweet tears on hearing a sick Dr Frankenstein meets Frizl meets Alfred Hitchock horrorshow narrative like that.

WeRiseUp · 19/02/2019 10:29

What are trans rights

Well since 'trans' is generally used to mean 'not, but claim to be', then trans rights must be 'not rights, but claim to be rights'.

reallyanotherone · 19/02/2019 10:21

So, after a cs there is a risk of uterine rupture. A significant risk.

Women are advised to wait a year (?) at least before getting pregnant again to reduce this risk.

But they are going to implant a uterus into a hostile environment, pump it full of drugs to impair the immune system, increasing the risk of infection, then implant an embryo after 6 months.

I had cs because the risk to mine/baby’s health with a vaginal birth was too great. I wonder if i’d insisted on a vaginal birth because the experience was important to my feelings as a woman, they’d have repected my “rights”, or questioned my capacity to make decisions in my own best interests and those of the baby?

It’s insanity. I wonder when transwomen and their babies actually start dying will they decide that the “experience” of pregnancy and birth is not as important as they thought...

OtepotiLilliane42 · 19/02/2019 07:35

Oh for the love of Mike! I have just read that drivelling nonsense by Jane Fae about how much she wished she could have experienced birth. You'd have been welcome to my first time experience Jane - 36 hours of labour, then an attempt at a forceps delivery, and when that failed an emergency caesar.

I want to hit something.

ALittleBitofVitriol · 18/02/2019 23:56

I would be deleted if I said what I really thought about the sort of pathetic man who thinks women idealise about 1. Being prom queens and 2. Dating movie stars...
We. Are. Not. Caricatures. From. Your. Fave. Teen. Movie. Ffs.

I would also be deleted if I expressed my anger at entitled assholes appropriating motherhood. That one gives me the proper Mad on the Internet. Especially one who has seen his female partner become a mother to his child, yet still can only see his reflection in the narcissist's mirror...

Smotheroffive · 18/02/2019 23:26

Yes, would be a womb implant if there are ever any going spare after all the women that need them get their transplants.

Like that's ever going to happen frankly, I do see that what's happening is their apparent 'rights' being the only ones that are actually important.

Oldermum156 · 18/02/2019 23:01

"really really wanting it" has always been the only reason given for why trans"women" get their "rights". Since they are men, this has always been enough reason for those "rights" to be extended to them.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 18/02/2019 18:02

”Nobody has a right to reproduce. Nobody has a right to anyone else's body parts either before or after they die. I don't see how you think this is a trans rights issue when nobody else has the right to womb transplants either.”

100% correct, @Bittermints - people die waiting for organ transplants, so it beggars belief that these trans activists think it is their ‘right’ to have a womb transplant. They don’t give a shiny shite about people who need livers or kidneys, lungs or hearts - as long as their right to feel female is upheld.

LuggsaysNotaWomen · 18/02/2019 16:21

It’s a trans human agenda and no good will come of it.

CoachBombay · 18/02/2019 16:18

If my brother turned round one day and said from now on I'm going to be known as Margaret, and I want your uterus Coach to have a baby. I'd tell him to fuck off 😂

I don't understand how as a society we have got to the point where having children has become some sort of pseudo human right! It's really not, and nobody has the right to experiment on a unborn child for some giant science experiment.

Ereshkigal · 18/02/2019 16:15

Oh... crying..?

Yes, yes of course.

We're on the same wavelength there Bowl!

Ribosomes · 18/02/2019 16:08

The most likely match would be a sibling, ie a sister.

Which I think raises some potential ethical issues. Or at the very least, some difficult decisions.

Datun · 18/02/2019 15:39

misscockerspaniel

As far as I know, Jane Fae has had the full op. No sperm.

But yes, a lot of pressure is being brought to freeze the eggs and sperm of trans children. I'm not quite sure how you do that, given puberty blockers.

But nonetheless, there is pressure.

None of which i suppprt.

Datun · 18/02/2019 15:35

Knicknackpaddyflak

Flowers

These people don't have the guts to be a woman.

misscockerspaniel · 18/02/2019 15:34

Datun Sorry, but you are wrong about "another man's sperm".

According to this report (below):"Six months after the surgery and the womb has healed, a donated egg would be fertilised with the transgender woman's own sperm and the embryo emplanted".

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6710751/Transgender-women-birth-time-thanks-pioneering-womb-transplants.html

Knicknackpaddyflak · 18/02/2019 15:34

Jane wallowing in the usual self indulgence I see.

Yes, I'll come off the transplant list the day some idiot medic is prepared to use bits of my body to torture a fetus for the emotional wishes of a male. Call me whatever names you like for it. Crack on.

You're sobbing into your tea because you weren't born with a uterus? Get a grip for pete's sake. I lost three kids who died inside me because my uterus failed to regulate hormones properly, so your mawkish imaginings of grief around 'if only I'd been born a different sex' seem a bit silly really.

R0wantrees · 18/02/2019 15:30

Seems much transactivism is now being focussed on the status of 'mother'

Telegraph article interviewing the transgender actor in the new Baptiste series:
'Baptiste star Talisa Garcia: 'I don't expect everyone to accept me as a woman'
My story is huge… but it’s not sad,” says Talisa Garcia, the Chilean-born English actress who plays Kim Vogel in Baptiste, the BBC’s new six-part crime drama spin-off of The Missing. Following a twist at the end of tonight’s episode in which French detective Julien Baptiste, played by Tcheky Karyo, discovers that Vogel was born male, Garcia has chosen to reveal for the first time that she, too, has had gender reassignment surgery, when she was 18.

“For me, it has always been a secret. I was a bit embarrassed, I suppose, of not being a ‘normal’ woman,” she admits, making air quotes with her hands. (continues)

concludes:
"Garcia also forthright in her belief that, in recent years, transgender rights activists may have done more harm to the cause than good. “This is where we get into the really hard bit,” she says. “Nowadays, we have to be very careful with what we say and what’s politically correct”. Although she won’t elaborate much further, she does say that transgender toilets are “the worst thing that could ever happen”.

“When will it stop?” she says. “We need to drop the labels. There are so many labels, people don’t know what’s what any more.”

While she thinks her appearance in Baptiste will help move the needle of public opinion on the issue of transgender, she hopes her next big role will be motherhood: she would love to start a family “if the right person comes along”. She knows she can’t have children of her own, but, having been adopted herself, doesn’t mind.

Until then, Garcia is keen to play a parent on screen. “When you cast a transgender woman who happens to be a mother, people will start looking at it for what it is: normal.”

www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/talisa-garcia-like-character-baptiste-transgender/?li_source=LI&li_medium=li-recommendation-widget

Bowlofbabelfish · 18/02/2019 15:30

why not donate it to someone else who really wants it?

Because it’s:

Not possible to implant a functional womb into a male
Illegal to implant a womb into a male
Illegal to implant an embryo into a male
Illegal to experiment on foetuses like this.

‘Really really wanting it’ shouldn’t override medical ethics. Or reality

Bittermints · 18/02/2019 15:30

Nobody has a right to reproduce. Nobody has a right to anyone else's body parts either before or after they die. I don't see how you think this is a trans rights issue when nobody else has the right to womb transplants either.

Datun · 18/02/2019 15:29

Males aren't a race, they're a sex, Daisy.

I do not generalising about men. I'm generalising about men with AGP. Many transwomen have AGP. It's simply a fact.

Fortunately there are laws to prevent people from doing what they like, even with people who consent.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 18/02/2019 15:29

As long as both parties are happy, I think it's fine

you think it's fine to experiment on live fetuses?

I fear your definition of fine and mine may be quite different daisyscott

any other horrific abuses of science that you'd like to define as 'fine'?

CosmicCanary · 18/02/2019 15:28

it's about what trans rights and what are not.

What are trans rights?