Can we talk about moral purity?

They are completely ignoring how this stuff impacts the most vulnerable kids in my community, especially the girls. It's broken my heart quite frankly and I can't go back to youth work because of this

Girls' work has mostly played second-fiddle to 'youth work' which has made boys front and centre though (IMHO). I guess I just see this as girls being screwed over again.

The named person's act was discussed a while back during a child protection training session I attended. It was still the planning stage at that time. It was explained to us as a way to make sure there was a way to make sure different agencies involved in children's lives (ie schools, health care workers, social services etc) were coordinated in dealing with any child protection issues that may arise. Having a named person responsible as a main contact should mean that nothing gets missed and people will know who to report concerns to.

It turns out to be much more than that.
Seems like another example of 'it's all for the good. Trust us- nothing untoward here'

Just googled the Named Person's Act. Seems very chilling to me. Big brother state in the making.

Funny enough chatty I saw that article. I am from that area originally and a Facebook friend from there (who's loosly involved with the Deptford project ) sent it to me after seeing I had shared GC stuff.

Bluetits that reminds me of this thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3203804-The-Deptford-People-Project-and-the-impact-of-self-ID-and-transactivism-on-working-class-women

Totally agree deepwatersolo.
I live in a very deprived area and am often involved in community education. The youth work management in particular are largely middle class and have totally bought into the identity politics crap.
They are completely ignoring how this stuff impacts the most vulnerable kids in my community, especially the girls. It's broken my heart quite frankly and I can't go back to youth work because of this.

UpstartCrow I agree the establishment tries to force identity politics down our throat. They know, otherwise they‘ll lose. The result is that the economically most strained communities are sold out by the ‚woke people‘ on the Left. (And the Right, but that is basically the Right‘s Job Description). The left has abandoned its base for identity topics like the TRA Agenda and anything else that doesn’t interfere with neoliberal exploitation. This gave us Trump, this gave us Brexit. And similar sh*t across Europe. The Left elite generally avoids talking class like vampires fear the sunlight. It is quite ridiculous, actually.

My best friend is a Tory county councillor, I've baby sat whilst she has been campaigning or going to meetings.

I would never vote Tory, however my friend puts an amazing amount of time and energy into her local community, regardless of her political affiliations, and I think this is often forgotten. I support her because of this and of course because she is my friend.

My DH jokingly calls it "aiding and abetting" a Tory!!

Cross post -sorry!

Damn, the programme is now unavailable. Might be on Netflix or something though -I only have free telly!

Thanks x-post

Thanks Bluetits looks great. I don’t think it’s on IPlayer any more but I will have a look on YouTube or somewhere. Love a good documentary.
www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0916ghq/episodes/guide

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0916ghz
There we are!

The idea that if a person has one 'wrong' viewpoint then the whole person must be shunned, is stupid. Throwing the baby out with the bathwater. It is good to be cautious in politics and to look carefully at your own actions and motivations. But you can't just write people off based on them not agreeing with you on everything. Like Julie Bindel----people hate her in entirety as the Devil due to her views on trans people. But she's helped more women in her life than most people every will.

Dammit -can't seem to make that work on my phone. It on the bbc website, Jamie Bartlett's 'secrets of silicon valley '

chattylion this was the documentary I think. Well worth watching if you have the time. Hope this clicky link works!
[https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0916ghz]

Yes. The prevalence of the extreme accusation is ridiculous. If you disagree with something it's put down to 'hate' at the very least. After that it escalates to 'bigot' and all the way up to defcon one and the deployment of 'Nazi'.

If we indulge the culture wars narrative, aren't we ourselves just being complicit in the polarisation of politics, which is what's got us where we are today

In a nutshell yes.

This was recognised by the founders of America and why they believed in freedom of speech. The realisation comes from realisation of the waste of blood shed.

A belief that you are always right in your ideology comes from arrogance. Tyranny springs from arrogance.

You learn more from talking to others who you might not usually agree with. Having your views challenged helps you to refrain and improve what you belief and how good your arguments are.

Sometimes you will have an epiphany and completely change your mind about a subject too. This is healthy.

Thinking is healthy.

We have forgotten this.

I think the lack of nuance is really bothering me. If i say to some of my “woke” family members that I have a problem with the GRA it has to be because I have to be a bigot not because I have any genuine concerns. It must all be a front for my bigotry.

This has become increasingly apparent in political discussion generally. If you a Tory it’s because you are evil, if you support labour you are stupid. The conversation seems to just stop there. Once someone is able to label someone else as a terrible person in an ad homien attack it’s fine to ignore everything else they say. If you can stigmatise and isolate people who mildly disagree with you you don’t have to have a debate at all, you’ve won by default.

Its why I hate this whole trend of shouting “no debate” it turns into I won’t talk to or listen to certain people, its authoritarian. Everything should be up for debate.

I think we make a lot of assumptions when we know someone has a 'label', or if they hold a certain view on something. The first example that comes to mind is Peter Hitchens. I see him regularly lambasted as an arch brexiteer Tory, which he is neither, he's a really interesting independent thinker on the conservative end of the spectrum. I don't agree with every conclusion he comes to, but I hugely respect the courage it takes to not just adopt all positions under a certain label.

There are those on the left who I feel the same way about. I have so many people make assumptions about me based on what they think I believe - you see it ALL the time on here - "Oh, you're a 'RadFem', you're anti-trans, you hate men, blah blah blah." It's the opposite of intelligent communication.

Is 'hate' your perception of peoples exasperation and anger?

I swithered about loathe, despise, or hold her in contempt. My point stands- the only time she is mentioned is when something derogatory is being said about her.


There are few things more fundamental to the human race than being male or female and being able to state factually exactly what that means.

If we cannot get that straight then arguing over things like tax policy seems pointless, especially for women.

I have to hold up my hands regarding Stella Creasy. I don't hate her but I am massively disappointed. That said, at least she's picked a side and she may genuinely believe TWAW, who am I to say she doesn't. It's the MPs who won't even go near the topic who annoy me more. That includes Hariet Harman, who is never normally this coy on women's issues and who at 68, is unlikely to be worried about deselection.

You're right that it shouldn't override the other good work they've done but I'm afraid the silence leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Is 'hate' your perception of peoples exasperation and anger?

Many on here hate Stellla Creasy yet she is doing good work on abortion rights with cross party support from Andrea Leadsom and Tory grandee Sir Peter Bottomley.