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BACP Gender,Sexual, and Relationship Diversity by Dr Meg-John Barker

252 replies

R0wantrees · 17/08/2018 22:56

Good Practice Guide, British Association for Counselling and Psychotherapy
(extract)
2.6 Gender identity: woman
Definitions
"Whether trans or cisgender, intersex or not, many people identify as
women. However, what this means varies a great deal depending on their other intersecting attributes. It is important not to assume, for example, that being a woman necessarily involves being able to bear children, or having XX sex chromosomes, or breasts. Being a woman in a British cultural context often means adhering to social norms of femininity, such as being nurturing, caring, social, emotional, vulnerable, and concerned with appearance.
However, of course, not all women adhere to all these things. For example some neurodiverse women (on the autistic/aspergic/ADHD spectrums) may struggle to express emotions, or with social situations. In some northern working-class contexts femininity is associated with strength and aggression. As always an intersectional understanding is vital and we need to be mindful that what is culturally regarded as the epitome of femininity is white, middle class, youthful, non-disabled, heterosexual, cisgender, and thin. This strongly shapes all women’s experiences of womanhood.
Common concerns
While gender may not always be relevant to a woman’s presenting issues, mental health struggles are often gendered. Women have such high rates of body image issues that this has been labelled ‘normative discontent’.
It has been related to both narrow ideals of feminine beauty, and the
contradictory pressures on women today to conform to stereotypical
femininity and to be independent and successful. Food and body
can represent one potential area of control in an uncontrollable and
contradictory world. Women are more likely than men to be diagnosed with depression, anxiety, and many other emotional disorders. This has been linked to the way women’s identities are often bound up with other people, for example, rates of depression often peak for mothers when children leave home. Therapy with women may well involve exploring their relationships with others, and with being desirable, pleasing and/or approved of" (continues)

My understanding is that the majority of counsellors in the UK are BACP accredited. There is a great deal in this document to consider.

The author is the partner of Edward Lord who identifies as non-binary see recent threads:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3323475-Surprise-The-Masons-now-welcome-Transwomen-but-not-women
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3317922-City-of-London-Corporation-consultation-is-out-this-covers-Hampstead-Ponds
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3316098-Childrens-Convenor-Elected-Councillor-calls-women-cunts-on-Twitter-rants

BACP Gender,Sexual, and Relationship Diversity by Dr Meg-John Barker
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BertrandRussell · 01/09/2018 09:39

Another thing to remember is that information was really limited at the time. Word of mouth, actual physical meetings and leaflets were all there was. That's why trade union and student activism was so vibrant and vital-because they were the only groups really who were in a position to share information. It really was another world.

LemonJello · 01/09/2018 09:37

Scheoedinger- Shock that tweet deserves a thread of its own.

IAmLurkacus · 01/09/2018 09:30

No, that does make sense. I totally get teenagers getting drawn into this, but adults ? Confused

I’ve drawn parallels with PIE for a long time, but I’m not old enough to remember them, just read about them on here.

So there must be lessons from How PIE was stopped to be applied here?

BertrandRussell · 01/09/2018 09:24

I'm trying to remember. To be honest, I think I just grew up a bit and started using my brain rather than being carried along. It's important to remember how incredibly exciting and subversive the idea of "minority rights" was. And PIE presented as a perfect example- the rights of children and rhe rights of a minority sexuality in the same campaign. Sorry, I'm rambling. Hope I'm making some sense.

IAmLurkacus · 01/09/2018 08:54

Bertrand how and why did you eventually realise you were wrong about PIE?

BertrandRussell · 01/09/2018 08:51

I think many of us were on a continuum. We started on Women’s Lib. Then the fight for gay rights became a thing, which many of us rushed to support. We were right to do that of course, but it can’t be denied that there was a deep vein of misogyny there. Lesbians were sidelined and women were the foot soldiers of the movement. PIE really just seemed like the next step along the road to sexual liberation. When I got flamed on here a while ago for trying to explain Harriet Harman’s position I seriously wondered whether I was completely misremembering. But the current situation mirrors it so closely, I now think not.

TimeLady · 01/09/2018 08:44

A BBC report: How did the pro-paedophile group PIE exist openly for 10 years?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-26352378

Journalist Christian Wolmar remembers their tactics. "They didn't emphasise that this was 50-year-old men wanting to have sex with five-year-olds. They presented it as the sexual liberation of children, that children should have the right to sex," he says.

It's an ideology that seems chilling now. But PIE managed to gain support from some professional bodies and progressive groups. It received invitations from student unions, won sympathetic media coverage and found academics willing to push its message.

EntropicTupperwareDrawer · 01/09/2018 08:38

Quite so - for those of us old enough to remember the arguments, this all sounds very familiar. And given that Edward Lord is giving shout outs to Ken Plummer, I don't think we're far wrong in seeing from which playbook the current situation has come.

BertrandRussell · 01/09/2018 08:34

I can remember defending PIE to my mother. The discourse was very similar to the TRA/TERF. stuff today. I do hope I apologized.

Stickerladiesoftheworldunite · 01/09/2018 08:32

Why can't anyone see the whole attempted theft of womanhood from right under our noses?

Organisations are being played and Lord and co. are trying to pull the strings.

TimeLady · 01/09/2018 08:25

I was in my twenties then, but it went completely under my radar. I guess those types haven't gone away.

BertrandRussell · 01/09/2018 08:22

I am old enough to remember how many liberal people were sucked into the PIE vortex.

EntropicTupperwareDrawer · 01/09/2018 08:17

Oh my goodness Shock

It's brazen what Edward Lord is up to. Brazen.

howonearthdidwegethere · 01/09/2018 08:14

My God. I hope a journalist is onto this.

TimeLady · 01/09/2018 08:06

I wonder who else was in PIE. I'm almost too scared to google it.

TimeLady · 01/09/2018 08:02

Wow, Schrodingers, at that tweet. Just Shock

IAmLurkacus · 01/09/2018 07:59

I feel sick

ShrodingersSturdyPyjamas · 01/09/2018 07:48

I don't think these two need any explanation. Just a reminder that Edward Lord is:
a - the partner of the person that wrote this guidance
b - running consultation on removing barriers to men accessing women's spaces in the City of London and all the facilities that it provides.

BACP Gender,Sexual, and Relationship Diversity by Dr Meg-John Barker
BACP Gender,Sexual, and Relationship Diversity by Dr Meg-John Barker
carceralfeminist · 30/08/2018 18:52

They've apparently removed the Northern reference now!

twitter.com/EvaPoen/status/1035174643991240707

WTFagain · 30/08/2018 15:08

'Sexual' - WTAF? The idea that women are asexual is digging up some really rotten 19thC ideologies; it's truly a new low. And the 'northern' thing? Good grief.

I do kind of get that these people are trying to 'critique' gender in their own way, but arse-backward, and without recognition of history or the work of anyone who covered this turf beforehand - and smarter.

If we all identify as trans, they'd have to go find something else to do. And maybe politicians in power would start listening to us. Why can't a woman identify as a trans woman? According to this 'guide', I am at least 50% man, anyway, so it would make sense.

I mean, seriously - why not? With self-ID, no medical or hormonal intervention is needed, anyway.

theaveragewife · 30/08/2018 15:03

I’m trans polycounty and polycountry. I am from the midlands but identify as a Londoner because I like fortnum mason biscuits and the queen, however I’m a bit aggy so therefore some days I’m northern. Currently I’m Californian because I love the sun and apparently Californian girls wear daisy dukes and bikinis on top.

if you mis-region me on a big pant biscuit day I’ll obviously threaten to kill you, possibly assault you but I will also be the victim. Bigots.

R0wantrees · 30/08/2018 15:03

genuine typo! Smile

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PyeWackets · 30/08/2018 14:53

I read that as an IronicSmilee

R0wantrees · 30/08/2018 14:23

oops, smiley face was a typo!

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