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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Due to see MP about GRA/women's rights. Any advice?

81 replies

Stickerladiesoftheworldunite · 15/08/2018 10:29

I'm due to see my female MP soon. I intend to focus on the GRA consultation and my concerns about enabling any male who self ids as a woman into women's spaces.

I also want to add my concerns about my son's school being a Stonewall.Champion school and my wider concerns around young people and this trend, about what's being taught in local schools regarding sex and gender.

I'm trying to stick to those points and relate national concerns to the MP's constiuency.

I need to be ready for any typical counter arguments and responses.

I've played devil's advocate below and would like some succinct water tight answers (and evidence) to support my answers. I do have answers, but they may not be as eloquant as some on here.

What do I actually want my MP to do about my concerns? What can they do?

What about the small number transsexuals who have had full surgery? Shouldn't they be able to use wcs?

Why can't we simply share facilities? Why take away from trans rights? (I recall somebody wrote a good analogy of a small cake being divided up.- saying women's cake wasn't that big to begin with after we fought for single sex spaces).

Do I 'object' to trans men using men's toilets?

And any other salient points I should mention.

Thanks

OP posts:
New posts on this thread. Refresh page
pinchpoint · 04/10/2018 13:20

Good idea Rowantrees. I had just messaged DH to pick up a copy on the way home Smile

R0wantrees · 04/10/2018 13:14

Also in The Spectator: Don’t tell the parents: the official guidance to teachers of ‘trans children’
As in so many progressive ­schooling fads before it, children are the experts and ­teachers are just there to facilitate
Madeleine Kearns
concludes:
What’s worrying is that anyone who challenges the new teaching on trans issues can find themselves in trouble. So when Victoria Atkins, the Minister for Women, admitted to being ‘a little cautious’ about teenage sex-changes, she was accused of bigotry. And Dr Kenneth Zucker, perhaps the leading authority on gender dysphoria in children, was recently ousted from his clinic in Toronto after being accused of ‘transphobia’ and supporting ‘conversion therapy’ because his 40 years’ experience and research had led him to the conclusion that affirming a child’s perceived gender can be counterproductive.

Many of these transgenderism training programmes are publicly funded. Last year, LGBT Youth Scotland received more than £1 million in grants, including £350,000 from the Scottish government, £160,000 from local authorities (all but one SNP-controlled), and £75,000 from Education Scotland. Mermaids UK, meanwhile, was granted £35,000 from the Department for Education and £128,000 from Children in Need.

Something is off here. Teachers are being asked to put ideology before evidence and to exclude parents from serious welfare decisions about their own children. Parents are often not allowed to take part in the discussion. Children are being asked to make important decisions about their gender, which is a surprisingly adult notion for many to grasp. What’s clear is that the issue of gender dysphoria in children is one of tremendous complexity, both medical and moral. To suggest otherwise — to children or teachers — is a dangerous mistake."

www.spectator.co.uk/2018/10/dont-tell-the-parents-official-guidance-to-teachers-of-trans-children/

R0wantrees · 04/10/2018 12:05

Take the Spectator!
or a copy of its lead article, it covers a great deal and asks really important questions of politicians.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3384307-James-Kirkup-Spectator-lead-article-Trans-rights-have-gone-wrong-The-new-gender-orthodoxy-allows-no-room-for-dissent

pinchpoint · 04/10/2018 12:00

Hello all,

Would anyone please share their MP Briefing one-sider with me?? As in bung the text in a PM?

I don't post much but have been busy changing minds face-to-face, at book group, dinner parties, in the playground and at the school gates Grin

I'm going in to see my MP tomorrow, at short notice, and trying to get my ducks in a row. So far I've condensed my concerns to a pithy five-sider Hmm

R0wantrees · 08/09/2018 11:24

recent articles:
Janice Turner Times:
'Trans rapists are a danger in women’s jails'
(extract)
he prison authorities knew a great deal about Karen White. That under her birth name Stephen Wood she’d served 18 months for gross indecency against a child; that she was on remand for three rapes also committed as a man; that, although she wore dresses and make-up, she’d retained male genitalia. Yet still they put her in a women’s jail.

I’d love to meet those who signed off this decision. What would they say to the four women who, within days of her transfer to New Hall prison in West Yorkshire, White had sexually assaulted? Confining a rapist in a women’s prison, among vulnerable inmates including rape victims, is like locking a fox in a henhouse. Yet they merely followed government guidelines “that prisoners should generally be housed in the estate that matches their expressed gender”.

On Thursday, after White admitted the three rapes and two of the prison assaults — one in which “her [sic] penis was sticking out of the top of her trousers” — the Ministry of Justice apologised, saying it failed to take into account her offending history. But her crimes were right there on file. Rather, the case illustrates a principle now hard-baked into schools, prisons and across the public sector: that women’s physical safety is less important than “gender expression”.

“It never happens,” women were told when they worried that losing sex-segregated private spaces might allow attacks by predatory men. Yet, as FoI requests by The Sunday Times last week showed, 90 per cent of sexual assaults in leisure centres are committed in gender-neutral changing rooms and only a tenth in single-sex facilities. It happens." (continues with 'it never happens' examples)
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/trans-rapists-are-a-danger-in-women-s-jails-5vhgh57pt?shareToken=a5c5b379f8c0f6ccd446176a676344e6

James Kirkup Spectator:
'Why was a transgender rapist put in a women’s prison?'
(extract)
"Quite how did the Prison Service come to decide that it was a good idea to house the rapist Karen White in a jail full of women? Prison policy says prisoners should generally be housed in the estate that matches their expressed gender, subject to a review by a Transgender Case Board following rules drawn up after a review partly run by an organisation called Gendered Intelligence, one of a handful of small trans rights groups that enjoy an interesting level of access and influence in Whitehall.

Such a board apparently did consider the appropriate place to house Karen White, a person with a penis who was accused of rape and had previously been jailed for child sex abuse. And that board decided that the best place for that person was a jail full of vulnerable women. “We apologise sincerely for the mistakes which were made in this case,” the Prison Service told the Telegraph about the case of the rapist Karen White. “While we work to manage all prisoners, including those who are transgender, sensitively and in line with the law, we are clear that the safety of all prisoners must be our absolute priority.”

What to make of all this? What sharp, snappy, clever new point to draw from this dreadful case? Honestly, I’m not sure I’ve got one. I’ve written tens of thousands of words about this subject this year, all with the same basic theme: this is an area of politics and policy where people in positions of power and responsibility are failing. Failing to apply basic critical thinking. Failing to scrutinise, failing to analyse. Failing to speak, to debate questions that need full and careful discussion. Failing to do their jobs. Failing to listen. Failing women. This case, this stupid, awful case is just another part of that failure." (continues)
blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/09/why-was-a-transgender-rapist-put-in-a-womens-prison/

Svalberg · 08/09/2018 10:09

@LongWeek You can go to the Central Lobby in the HoC to see your MP, but it's not guaranteed that they'll be free or there!

LongWeek · 08/09/2018 09:59

@workingitoutasigo you do not have the ‘right’ to see your MP. MPs don’t have to answer letters/emails/meet constituents. They’re bloody stupid if they don’t cos they’ll be unpopular and could risk losing their seat at election.
They should do these things, but if they don’t, there is no way to make them.
(My DH is an MP)

Many MPs are not really aware of the trans debate and the issues it raises. There is no legislation planned at the moment, so they’re just not thinking about it.

Keep contacting your MPs. They need to hear GC voices.

LondonPainter · 07/09/2018 12:06

I saw my MP this morning and he seemed sympathetic to the safeguarding issues, particularly as he'd seen the fallout when a local school brought in a self-ID policy with their changing rooms without informing parents Shock

The New Hall prison news is a perfect example of how making laws based on feelings is ridiculous so I opened with that and then extended the idea to changing rooms, refuges, Girlguiding, etc.

He is going to write to the ministers and get back to me. The more of us who talk to our MPs, the better ✊🏼

WorkingItOutAsIGo · 06/09/2018 14:03

Namechanged yes he does. I initially contacted them asking for an appt then after weeks received an email asking me to explain my request by email as he said he was terribly busy and could often handle things quicker by email. Have done so and then followed up twice or maybe three times more on my request and just had tumbleweed! Hence wondering whether to push it one last time or give up. If there is no right to see your MP then I would give up. But wouldn't vote for him again!

Awayfromitall · 06/09/2018 13:20

Bump

NameChangedAgain18 · 06/09/2018 13:01

Does your MP not hold surgeries Working? Have you tried ringing their constituency office?

WorkingItOutAsIGo · 06/09/2018 12:55

Can I ask a question? I have been writing to my MP for months and have had no reply and my requests for an appointment have been ignored. Am I allowed to insist I get a meeting with my MP or do I just have to accept he is not prepared to/too busy to engage on this topic?

LondonPainter · 06/09/2018 08:06

Really useful thread, thanks; I'm seeing my MP tomorrow. He's Conservative and I'll stress how unpopular the self ID policy is, particularly among their voters.

I'm going to take a Fair Play For Women leaflet and the Times article about unisex changing rooms. Will report back!

heresyandwitchcraft · 21/08/2018 20:45

Bumping back to first page for anyone who is going to be in a similar situation.
Well done Stickerladiesoftheworldunite!

( Honestly, all James Kirkup's writing on this subject is so excellent. For reference, here is his author page:
blogs.spectator.co.uk/author/james-kirkup/ )

boatyardblues · 20/08/2018 15:35

R0wan is MN’s FWR wikipedia.

boatyardblues · 20/08/2018 15:34

Well done OP. When you are writing to your MP it would be good to also include a copy of James Kirkup’s excellent Spectator article about politicians’ abject failure on the trans debate. He really nailed it. I have no doubt the mighty R0wan will be along with the link in two shakes of a lamb’s tail. Grin

Stickerladiesoftheworldunite · 20/08/2018 15:20

Thanks - your comments are uplifting too after seeing some of the sycophantic politicians on Twitter today.

That reminds me, I need to follow up my visit with a letter today. Think I'll.attach Janice and James' articles from the weekend.

OP posts:
howonearthdidwegethere · 20/08/2018 13:08

Well done! Face to face is the way to go. Most charitably, I imagine most MPs etc. haven't given it much thought. Most but not all. Maybe.

Grin
WarmWishes · 20/08/2018 12:58

Wow. This is the most positive thing I have read today.

HermioneWeasley · 20/08/2018 12:46

Well done!

Oldstyle · 20/08/2018 12:39

Fantastic OP. Flowers I'm building up to the MP meeting so this report back is so helpful.

SirVixofVixHall · 20/08/2018 12:00

Hurrah for you op.

WaddIelikeapenguin · 16/08/2018 18:19

Oh well done Star fantastic woman Star

Ereshkigal · 16/08/2018 18:17

You're brilliant, well done WineThanks