Trans Voices For Appeal Complain About Together For Yes Campaign

Irish Times:
"This belongs to the women of Ireland"

TRAs:
"Oh no it doesn't!"

Sad thing is they're not doing it for fun, they really really mean it.

Article which gives some insight into the perspectives of some who identify as trans men:
theestablishment.co/why-we-must-stop-calling-menstruation-a-womens-issue-a9c58c677f7c

Transmen and transwomen are on a complete collision course, aren't they?

Transmen want to erase the word women. Because it is triggering and hurtful and literal violence. The word men is the end goal for them, it is the key word that validates them. That's how they define themselves after all - as men.

Transwomen want to erase the word men. Because it is triggering and hurtful and literal violence. The word women is the end goal for them, it is the key word that validates them. That's how they define themselves after all - as women.

So you've got one group trying to erase the word women and sanctify the word men while the other group trying to erase the word men and sanctify the word women.

We live in interesting times.

The Irish Times view on the referendum: This belongs to the women of Ireland
No single moment better captures the revolution in Irish attitudes over 40 years

A hundred years after one generation of Irish women won their battle for the right to vote, another generation has used the ballot box to deliver a thunderbolt that will echo for years to come.

www.irishtimes.com/opinion/editorial/the-irish-times-view-on-the-referendum-this-belongs-to-the-women-of-ireland-1.3510518

TRAs: transwomen are women
Feminists: no they are not because being a woman is about biology not feelings or identity and this definition would exclude many born women who don't feel feminine
TRAs: - you're being transphobic - i'm blocking you
Feminists: Repeal of the 8th is a victory for women
TRAs: this is transphobic, many of the people affected are not women as they don't feel feminine

first comment - legislation should refer to people not women!

twitter.com/SimonHarrisTD/status/1001452077602738176

If it's inconvenient for it to be genuine then it must not be genuine, is the only theory I can come up with re Supermatch's insistence that the account wasn't legit.

Didn't say it was a good theory. Especially given the lunatic who runs the Edinburgh version of action for trans health.

A couple of well known Irish TRAs follow it so I don't think it's a parody.

Did smg come back with why they thought it wasn't 'real'? I think it must be, I'm blocked too, no interaction with them but I follow quite a few feminists so I don't think it's a parody.

I wonder how much of the hate speech and transphobia referenced is for example online such as Twitter.

recent threads re those people recently banned for transphobic hate speech:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/a3260432-The-Shame-of-Twitter?msgid=78200804#78200804
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3259395-best-of-twitter
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3258983-Miranda-Yardley-permanently-banned-from-Twitter

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3259650-Lesbian-gets-banned-from-LGBTQ-messaged-board-for-trying-to-talk-about-the-lesbophobia-in-trans-activism

Also see open letter in support of the Bristol Student signed by academics which describes WPUK as transphobic:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3259500-Trans-Student-Faces-Expulsion-from-Univeristy-of-Bristol

Last time I looked they were whining about "TERFs in their mentions" so I'd guess never.

That's a start. Now when are they going to apologize to women?

I just checked the TransVoicesForRepeal Twitter account. The tweets are now set to protected.

I suspect that they didn't get the fawning reaction that they hoped for.

I had a look last night and they had apologised for appropriating intersex conditions in their letter. I'm guessing someone in the intersex community complained loudly.

I am also blocked from the Twitter account Terfing even though I have never interacted with them... nor do I post anything on twitter actually.

I presume this is because I follow a number of GC feminists and organisations on there.

Yes, of course, Nauticant.

As with R0wan's post, I'm also not sure about how exactly there is simultaneously high levels of acceptance and also huge hostility towards transpeople.

I certainly need at least a couple of months at the Re-education Centre.

Lazy thinking Popchyk. According to the New Mathematics, zero and infinity are two sides of the same coin.

Who are the Labour party to speak for all British women? Owen can fuck right off with that assumption.

I've also noticed recently that the British survey on social attitudes which was previously often quoted to demonstrate the high levels of acceptance of trans women sharing women's spaces (eg public toilets) seems to have been surpassed by a survey highlighting transphobia and hate crime. I believe this is a recent Stonewall survey.

It's referenced in this recent Independent article which associates the issues with the hard right as other commentators have also done:
www.indy100.com/article/how-the-far-right-is-attacking-the-lives-of-the-transgender-community-and-what-we-can-do-to-stop-it-8369021?amp&__twitter_impression=true

Wait, thought trans people were the most discriminated against group ever.

And now it's almost zero?

Rather swift U-turn there.

It's interesting to compare the way equality legislation is working for pregnant women and new mothers, and for trans people.

Whittle says: Since 2010, the Equality Act has been a huge success, and has greatly improved job security and access to housing, goods and services for trans people. We have seen the number of claims of employment discrimination, or discrimination when accessing goods, services, housing and facilities drop to almost zero

Link to article discussing funding comparisons:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3260270-Michael-Biggs-Oxford-Sociology-dept-The-Open-Society-Foundations-the-transgender-movement-incl-comparison-with-funding-for-women

And yes, this is not a time to even consider concessions, this is a time to hold the line. Look to the parts of the US that used to have more abortion access than they have now for proof of how quickly rights can be lost.

Agree Pencils. Doesn't matter what is conceded, more will be demanded until women's rights are erased.

It's just selfishness and narcissism. Any legislation designed to protect women can be applied to trans men easily enough when it's clearly about being female. Switch things around and remove the connection between "pregnancy" and "female", though, and it's inevitable that that will be used by the people who already discriminate against women every chance they get.

I'm pretty much at the "grow the fuck up, not everything is about pandering to your ego" stage with female TRAs. Nope, sorry, growing a scraggly little beard doesn't remove you from the category "female", which also means that policies designed to benefit women also benefit you, at least if you don't manage to sabotage them in moment of throwing toys out of the pram narcissistic rage.

This is no time to be doing anything that even risks watering down women's protection from pregnancy and maternity discrimination.

A Women and Equalities Committee report from 2016 found that Shockingly, pregnant women and mothers report more discrimination and poor treatment at work now than they did a decade ago.

The report found that the number of women forced out of work has almost doubled in that period.