Scrubs and Sexism

DontCallMeFrothyDragon, I agree with your entire post. What stands out to me in regards to the sexism is [for example] how Kelso would demean Elliott by stating that as a female doctor, she wouldn't be interested in internal medicine, but that once her internship was up she was most likely to go into Family Medicine, Pediatrics or OB/GYN.

She confronted Kelso by stating that she was offended and he was like, "Oh, are you going to cry?" She could have easily said, "That's sexist," but after she ran out on the pregnant patient in the clinic by stating "Babies aren't my thing," she could have easily stated, "I'll find you an expert." When I bring my son to the ER, there's one doctor who does all pediatrics, so they always say to me, "We need to find the pediatric doctor." There's adult medicine and pediatrics, but that never gets touched on.

I get that it's supposed to be a fun show, and I enjoy Braff and Faison's joyous portrayal of the characters, but it's difficult to ignore the sexism when it isn't called out.

OP here. Namechanged ages ago to reflect my geekiness which I am proud of. Anyway, DH had an interesting idea about Dr. Cox calling JD girls' names. He suggested that Dr. Cox does this because JD himself is quite sexist and uncomfortable with his own self so it is all a windup on Dr. Cox's part.

I luuuuurve Scrubs.

Aha, thought there was. Must get round to watching it again some point soon. Would be interesting to see how male writers/producers portray the female mind.

Likewise, I like a lot of films and programmes which are arguably misogynistic, BUT justify this by saying it's a feminist work shop

I still love Friends, though. Though some of the jokes are pretty now and not funny. The fat Monica thing particularly bugged me in one episode the other day.

Thanks, Bertie!

DCMFD, there was a Her Story, but I can't remember the content.

Watched the first episode yesterday. It struck me the fact it's told from a male POV. I know they do the His Story (where they have Turk and/Or Cox narrate) but I can't remember off the top of my head, did they ever have a Her Story?

Was quite interesting to see that Carla refused to let Elliot use her sexuality against her.

Also, noticed Elliot had to point out to at least one patient that she was a doctor, not a nurse (just because she was a women).

Darling old Perry also used Carla's "rack" to determine whether a patient was a GOMER or not...

Wasn't Jordan's position in the hospital higher than Cox and Kelso's? I was trying to work out if that counted.

Not as long as I remembered (but possibly getting confused with another similar thread?) www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/1209195-Ways-the-TV-series-Friends-was-anti-feminist

Hi, BertieBotts. Have you got a link to the Friends thread, by any chance?

I think it's quite a good exercise to examine TV shows, books, films, etc for instances of casual sexism. I feel it's quite a good "feminism lite" exercise, it's an easy introduction, it highlights just how accepted most sexism is, it's unlikely to offend anyone (as they are fictional characters), it's not a massively serious issue with huge emotional impact, and generally you can find so many examples. There was a thread about sexism in Friends which nearly reached the post limit!

The show is both misogynistic and misandric.

Yes, JD is mocked and given girls' names by Cox, but in a later series Denise is mocked for being masculine. Yes, if we chose to look at it as 'glass half empty', then we could say that both are misogynistic (because Denise is expected to conform to female norms and JD is perceived to be laughable for being effeminate), but we could, on the other hand, say that both are misandric (because JD is expected by Cox to conform to male norms and Denise is perceived to be laughable for being masculine).

I also agree with whoever said that women are portrayed as having the upper hand/being more sensible.

Stereotypical male traits such as refusing to admit fault or being aggressive/obsessed with sex are parodied, probably more than women being portrayed as image-obsessed or over invested in a relationship, for example.

Jordan may be portrayed as being angry and pregnant, but Cox is portrayed as getting drunk and shouting at the telly on a regular basis and Todd is portrayed as a sex-obsessed neanderthal.

If we wanted to, we could argue that the janitor portrays men (or even caretakers) as being devious and unkind. Similar arguments could be made for Paul the Nurse and being controlling. If we were to look at all male characters in the show as a portrayal of men in general, it would make men look TERRIBLE! The same could be said for women, but I'm not Elliot or Carla or Jordan. I'm DHS.

When Carla bosses Turk around, I feel that he is being equally ridiculed for 'doing as he is told' as she is for being bossy.

So yes, it is sexist on both sides (and medically rather inaccurate), but I rather enjoy it.

looking at the reference to the big bang theory (yes smurfette principle) the ditzy blonde is the only normal character in the show, all of the males have issues, even now when we have 4 female characters, they are all strong characters where as most of the male characters are still developing into mature people.

Also the male charcters need Penny, whereas Penny does not need the males.

Doesn't elliot dump Paul for being controlling?

Thanks for clearing up the bit about Carla.

WRT Elliot and Paul, they did ultimately finish because of something else, but the initial shock Elliot portrayed was in response to him being in a lower position, and that's something that stuck with me. She needed to work through her embarrassment at that. It did address it, yes, but the thing that always sticks in my mind when someone mentions Paul from Scrubs is "Oh yeah, that's the one Elliot felt uncomfortable dating because he was a nurse" not "Oh, that's the one Elliot broke up with because of her commitment issues"... Or whatever the reason was.

Crossposted, lol.

Frothy - the carla training one, doesn't she make that exact point to him in the episode? That she's not a nurse because she needs him to help her, but because she loves it and is good at it.

That's how I remember it going anyway.

"Carla had been stuck in the position of "nurse" for nine years. It wasn't until Turk came along that she was able to enrol on a training course so she could administer medicines, and give her more authority in the hospital. Because us women need men to finance us if we are going to improve"

Actually Carla gave him a bollicking for thinking just that and pointed out that she hadn't remained a nurse for 9 years simply because no man had pointed out to her that she could gain further qualifications, that she had done so because she liked her job.

"Remember when Elliot was dating Paul, the male nurse? She was uncomfortable with the relationship initially because she felt she couldn't date a man in a lower position than her. Thus reinforcing the belief that the man should be in at least an equal position to the woman, preferably superior. "

Surely this is addressing this issue and dealing with it rather than reinforcing it? Been a while since I've seen the earlier series but how did the relationship end? did they break up due to the different positions or did she accept him and later break up for another reason?

You may!

Thanks, Comrade

Might do an episode by episode analysis one day...

Great post Frothy.

OK, lets see.

Remember when Elliot was dating Paul, the male nurse? She was uncomfortable with the relationship initially because she felt she couldn't date a man in a lower position than her. Thus reinforcing the belief that the man should be in at least an equal position to the woman, preferably superior.

Elliot's portrayal switched between a little girl, lost, who needed protecting from the big, scary world, and being someone who didn't pay much attention to whose feelings she was trampling over.

Carla had been stuck in the position of "nurse" for nine years. It wasn't until Turk came along that she was able to enrol on a training course so she could administer medicines, and give her more authority in the hospital. Because us women need men to finance us if we are going to improve...

Kim lied about having miscarried or aborted JD's baby. Seeing as us women are cold and callous like that.

In the episode where Kelso demands Elliot removes her make up and starts acting proffessional, the janitor tells Kelso that he enjoys seeing Elliot like that (make up, etc...). Seeing as, y'know, she's not there to do anything important like save lives... Just provide eye candy for the male members of staff.

Cox frequently belittles JD by calling him girls names. Because, y'know. That's the worst insult you can give a man. Compare him to a female.

And the Janitor's wedding episode has been pointed out.

All of the characters (except The Todd) were consistently in relationships, reaffirming the idea that you can only be truly happy when in love, and singledom makes you miserable and lonely, etc...

A few things the show did get right, though.

Most of the regular female characters were portrayed as strong, independent women.

Elliot was shown as being JD's equal through most of the series. They even got promoted at the same time, if I remember correctly, with Elliot getting the majority of the power?

I also felt "Cookie Pants" was quite an important episode. Elliot was willing to let JD see her in her "cookie pants" and sans make up (I think), something she felt was unattractive, and he said something along the lines of how she looked even more beautiful than ever... Not hunting the episode out this time of night, but I'll double check...

We also saw quite a bit of Cox, JD and Turk caring for their DC, while their wives/partners carried on their careers. This, to me, reaffirmed the message that children were equal responsibility between two responsible parents, and promoted the idea of men caring for DC as being a good thing.

I may have to rewatch the box set, in my cookie pants, with a tub of Ben and Jerry's. All in the name of research, y'know?

Nikki
Thank you so much for (a) resurrecting this thread and (b) your thoughtful contribution.

Honestly, this is thread is, in itself, so ironic.

One of my pet peeves is when people are arrogant about something they have no idea about. Arrogant ignorance.

Scrubs, which is just one of hundreds of other television shows, movies, commercials, etc., that always, ALWAYS makes the man out to be the one at fault.

You all sit here and talk about misogony...if anything, almost all of Scrubs' episodes have some kind of misandrist-based plot or side-stories.

Now, being a long-time Scrubs fan, I've watched the series start to finish. And while I can agree with a good portion of what you are all saying, I just refuse to go along with this entire Feminist-driven accusation that Scrubs has some kind of underlying sexist theme.

A lot of what I've read on this thread is that women are always being portrayed as sex icons on the show, if they're not just stripping down on the spot. As far as the character of Todd goes, yes, you are all 100% correct.

But look at Carla, Jordan, even Elliot at times. They are all portrayed as these intelligent, burdened women because they have to deal with their so much less intelligent husbands, if not just the men in the hospital in general.

Feminists today are so very, very ignorant. And arrogant about it, too. Yes, misogony exists is just about everything on television. And you all just can't wait to pounce on the person responsible - as long as it's a man, it seems. And yet, you're all silent when this kind of blatant misandry is broadcast. why?