Laura Brand, would you stand by your man? Trigger rape.

We will never know for certain as he was never tried in court. I did have colleagues who worked in the same hospital and got to know him however.

That's actually a really interesting take

I get the feeling he handpicked her after assessing how easily manipulated she could be and how she could boost his image.

If he is convicted how long do we think it will be before he declares himself a woman?

Yes @Autumngirl5.

’a person accused of a crime is legally assumed to be innocent’

Legally is the operative word there. I am not involved in the case, and I assume no one posting here is. I am not a lawyer or the judge and I am not on the jury. I am not obliged to assume Brand is innocent.

Given your views, I assume you believe Jimmy Saville was innocent of the crimes he was accused of.

He is revolting, and after reading one woman's experience with him: he was prancing around semi-naked before raping her, and she described his body as "snake like" and he was very heavy when he was on top of her so she could not get him off. There were also pictures he made her take before he raped her, and he looks gross, with weird hairless body and mad look in his eyes.

So I kind of wonder what sort of woman would willingly make him her husband. I doubt she did not know what he is like. She is probably on the same page as him regarding sexual behaviour.

Imagine twisting words and concepts to what you would like to hear.
’Innocent until proven guilty" (known legally as the presumption of innocence) means that any person accused of a crime is legally assumed to be innocent unless the state or prosecution proves their guilt.’

I would describe their relationship as grooming. So I’m not convinced she’s capable of seeing him objectively.

Imagine reading the thread with its significant discussion of the concept of ‘innocent until proven guilty’ and then writing a post saying ‘Yeah but what about innocent until proven guilty?’

Re the discussion about Laura possibly having being coerced and controlled by him etc… I had forgotten until I read yesterday that when they first met, Laura was 18 and Brand was 31. The relationship was brief then but rekindled at a later date. I think it might be significant that those were their ages when they first met. I know that I was extremely naïve as an 18 year-old girl; perhaps Laura was too. That would certainly constitute a power imbalance in my eyes.

Scaring 20 year olds trying to get to the sink to wash their hands!

Basically came on to me. I was 20, in the girls loos by myself.

I said something like “erm, no thank you” and got out of there. What people maybe don’t notice is that he’s huge. Really tall, and although he looks slim he’s actually pretty well built.

And he’s got wild, Peter Sutcliff eyes

Absolutely. The structures that enable this behaviour need to be dismantled. One of the victims was a junior working with him who was coerced into sexual contact to placate him to please their bosses who wanted to keep “the talent” happy. The enablers should be held to account too.

It’s true. We see it in many footballers too. And in America so many of these college sport stars terrorising women.

More recently I’m seeing a lot of popular charismatic pastors, spiritual leaders and fitness influences exposed for bad behaviour.I suspect part of what lead to that is being corrupted by the elevated status and influence they wield in their communities. We need to stop putting these men on a pedestal.

Well if you’ve read the thread and understood the discussions I don’t see why you’re still bleating about innocent until proven.

I will quote one explanation above from @Tinydanceer : the innocent until proven innocent is a legal principle used in this process - it doesn’t apply outside of the court

So again - what do you mean by repeating this mantra? It seems very mindless at this point!

I have seen this man in a very dim light for a long time and listening to his own admissions of his lifestyle and his behaviour I do not believe he is of good character. The evidence presented thus far hasn’t helped with this either. I am being perfectly reasonable in coming to the conclusion that I think it’s highly likely he could be guilty of such a thing.

But it’s not like I’m clamouring for the trial to be abandoned and for him to be thrown in jail forever!

I disagree. I don’t see lynch mobs just general revulsion on hearing the testimonys.

There is definitely a problem in giving men power. It’s Savile effect all over again. I think giving men power and adoration is to be avoided they can’t deal with it. I see it at DDs school the boys on the rugby scholarships lord it and have become misogynistic monsters in a way the normal boys have not.

I have read the thread. There is a ‘lynch mob’ mentality’ around now which I find very worrying. Especially when it is celebrities involved.

I wouldn't judge my husband by the standards of the court, which are notoriously bad for convicting for rape. I'd judge my inner feeling whether they had done it. In this instance, the volume of accusations and the large number of women accusing him would make my blood run cold.

I agree with you

Yes this - there are some good explanations - read the thread

As said you are guilty as soon as you commit the crime, not when a later court determines if you will be punished or not

the innocent until proven innocent is a legal principle used in this process - it doesn’t apply outside of the court

Some horrible stories here, my sympathy is with @ItalianChips @Thewonderfuldollypartonsbra and everyone whose abuser was found not guilty or didn’t even make it to court 😔💐

Yeah fair enough - you have a point there.

Have you read the thread at all @Autumngirl5?

(There’s been quite a lot of discussion of ‘innocent until proven guilty’)

What about innocent until proven guilty? We seem to have forgotten this when it comes to celebrities. Everyone is so keen to jump on them. And maybe she loves him and is concerned about his mental health?