SW London Private and Grammar - applying for year 7 in 2023 (part V)

On a different note….Have to say in this thread, the usage of appropriate grammar and the quality of vocabulary is breathtaking …. I wonder why 🤔

glad to see we all benefited from the process 😂

"Before accepting private school offers it is generally good time to get some specific feed back from different schools. One school could be argued just an outliner cases, but a few should give you a good picture where your DD stands against the entire 11+ SW London cohort. It is just anuseful information and additional data point for your decision making."

The thing is with this - they do not take GCSEs in VR, NVR or 'CAT skills' or Atom or whatever!

Chances are, they will never see those kind of tests again, so they are totally irrelevant.

In any secondary school they will obviously be exposed to a range of subjects across a curriculum. An adaptive computer test or Atom has no bearing on who will enjoy or excel in Geography or RE or History or Latin. Most subjects in fact. In any school, there will be some who are strong in particular subjects - this is regardless of their 'ranking' on entering the school. Those tests are blunt instruments. CAT scores also change.

Oh yes sorry @poppybuttons I totally see the reasons for it, makes sense and thank you for the nod towards that thread, I'll take a look if (fingers crossed) it becomes relevant! Too superstitious to look now .. 😬

There are simply not enough places for grammar school like Tiffin to take in high academic ability girls. I would say if your DD in TGS WL, it means she is more than capable of meeting the high academic standard required by most of the top selective school in London, including Tiffin.

Before accepting private school offers it is generally good time to get some specific feed back from different schools. One school could be argued just an outliner cases, but a few should give you a good picture where your DD stands against the entire 11+ SW London cohort. It is just anuseful information and additional data point for your decision making.

@Pleasegrowmore , it's so all the Tiffin pupils start on an equal footing. The results given to those on the Tiffin WL indicate where they are on the WL. The website elevenplusexams.co.uk (in the surrey forum) runs a thread with Tiffin WL marks and when they translate to offers between April and October.
If you get an offer from any school it indicates they want your dc, everyone has got stories of WL students ending up as top of the year and those with academic scholarships floundering within the first few years.

The waiting!! Ahh ha ha hope you are all ok

Oh yes I certainly wouldn't want to ask anything while the process is ongoing.

Actually occurs to me that Tiffin (DD's first choice) do let you know your results for the Stage 2 tests if you are on the waiting list. Though oddly perhaps not if you get a place straight out!?

KGS said they’d provide feedback (if asked for) in the Summer 2023. Arguably it might feel a bit late by then but the offer was made.

It’s probably easier for them once the admission craziness has died down

Maybe the more theoretical debate about natural intelligence etc could move to another thread.

I think you are right, we shouldn't debate if children are naturally bright enough to get into the desired school in this thread.

Oh, I have no idea if they would actually tell you. From what I have read it seems some schools might. I did try asking how my dd did on the exam to two of the schools we applied to and got no response (perhaps the might respond if we get an offer and I chase them?). I am not sure if I am actually going to chase again to find out....still debating.

@PreplexJ I didn't say whether I agreed or disagreed. I said that readers should note the context to Plomin's work. My reference to a 'ridiculous debate' was a plea for people not to derail a support thread about London secondary school entrance with a debate about the merits or otherwise of genetic determinism.

It is not ridiculous debate. @readingcat you can disagree with other peoples research effort. But I think the other side of the story is also true.

Can post another article here as fruit for thought

www.theguardian.com/education/2018/mar/23/selective-schools-make-no-difference-to-gcse-results-study-says

Let us PLEASE not open a ridiculous debate about this, but for the academic record, I must note that PreplexJ has linked to research led by a controversial figure, Robert Plomin. If you read the paper, you need to be aware of this and to do your own research into the contexts of Plomin's work and the debate surrounding it.

@SamPoodle123 sorry (slow catching up!) you asked if I'd find out where my DD is in her cohort if she gets into one of the academically selective schools.

I feel this is a really naive question, but would I actually be able to find that out? Do private schools (or indeed grammars) tell you where they fall academically at the beginning, or do you mean after a certain amount of time at the school.

A lot of chat on this thread tbh makes me realise how ignorant/ naive/ blisfully ignorant (delete as approrpriate!) I am about school testing outside of state schools tbh.

Seconded.

@PreplexJ would you be kind enough to just let it lie? We are all trying to be supportive and friendly and a couple of posters seem determined to sow division. Thankyou.

@pme just slightly tweak on the slogan 2 as a parent on state primary school.

Slogan 2: if you need to go to 11+ prep school to get in the school, then the school is not right for you. 😃

No offence to any prep school parents, it is just a joke. 😂

@elevenplusmum22 thanks, that is really helpful!

It was a joke 🤦‍♀️

I agree with a lot of what’s being said here in terms of not splitting hairs because of League Tables. Pretty much all of schools discussed on this thread will get your child to the same outcome!

I have an older DC in a super selective (younger one going through the 11+), and what’s key in the teen years is self-esteem and mental well-being, a lot of which is determined by friendship groups. Friends play a much larger role as they get older and parents less so.

The other key IMO is self-motivation. Parents can’t monitor their kids as closely when they are older, so if you have a self-motivated kid, they will do just as well at PHS or G&L or SPGS or whatever.

Furthermore, I’ve seen first hand what happens when parents ignore the prep school’s advice and push their kid really hard into a super selective. They might be ok once there (a gamble) but I’ve seen what happens when they aren’t. The parents have the ‘badge’ of saying ‘my kid goes here’, but what’s the ultimate point? The kid’s self-esteem really suffers and it becomes a downward spiral.

"Sunday Times Parent Power List"

Don't think this is a good league table as indication of academic achievement of the secondary school, maybe it is OK with SW mums at tea time. The other thread in mumsnet has discussion on this at length.

This is a discussion forum, so inevitably people will have different points of views, not least about their criteria when selecting a school for their child.

If you're finding it so boring, nobody is making you read it or participate! I'm sure you can find more interesting and productive things to do with your time - maybe another read of the Sunday Times Parent Power List. :)