Tell me we haven't lost the plot to be turning down a grammar place for DS

My eldest DS decided he didn't want to go to grammar so went to the local comp. It was a disaster as it wasn't 'cool to be bright' He went from a hard worker at primary to someone who did the bare minimum at high school as he didn't want to stand out as being clever. Needless to say his younger siblings are at grammar school!

Hi
we did this (turned down the grammar school place)
not entirely the same situation as you, since both schools were easy to get to, but the grammar was single sex, and the comp had things I was not so keen on...but DS did fine, went to good university, all was fine. If the child is bright and prepared to work, it will be fine.

I went to the local good but not outstanding comp instead of the single sex grammar miles away. It was absolutely the right decision for me - I would have been miserable at the grammar. Having said that, a friend of mine went to the grammar and did very well and was happy - although the people who did go there eventually moved to the town the school was in due to the commute.

I've also taught at grammars and seen students who absolutely thrive there and others that are miserable and would have been much happier at a comprehensive. Only you know which category your ds is most likely to fall into.

I'm sure you've thought about this, but what may seem a big deal at the start of Y7 - commute, friendships from primary - soon fade.

I don't think the journey sounds excessive - many grammar students have long journeys - but it's very important he feels motivated to make the journey. He can shop around for sixth form later if he wants.

agree

the private school kids OFTEN struggle

Take the grammar school place.

I went to a "good" comprehensive, but it had none of the advantages of the local grammar.

it's single-sex, heavily religious, is difficult to get to, has a claustrophobic and tired campus, he knows no one there, etc). It would be difficult for us logistically - I honestly don't know how I'd make the grammar work with transport/work/DS being able to participate fully in after-school clubs (he wouldn't be able to)

you're not selling it to me.

I know you feel like you are passing up something good, but surely that is because the grammar system is operating in that borough. not yours.

And what Stationary just said is also true.

The fact that he has been offered a late place from the waiting list suggests that he is perhaps one of those who 'only just' pass for the grammar.

Not necessarily, it depends how they do it. DD's school, there was a catchment so anyone within that just had to pass the 11+. That left residual places for people out of catchment, which were awarded by score (possibly with some distance factor, not sure). So the girls who got waiting list places would have got better passes than many of those within catchment, and there were many with good passes who didn't get a place.

I don't buy the whole "just passing therefore will struggle at grammar" line. Maybe 5 years ago, not now.

I've just accepted a place for DS at a SS, with a score that "just" got him in. Because I know that at least half the children that have high scores and have been offered places have been spoon fed, privately educated or excessively tutored to get their place. They are the more likely the ones that will struggle once they are there, IMO.

I went to a grammar school which was a 20 walk to the train station and 20 walk the other end to school.

It was exhausting and my social life really suffered as I couldn't meet up with them Easily.

For me on balance I think it was the better choice academically as I have a tendency to do 'enough' so was middling there but would probably have been middling at the local comp too.

I do think your child must be able to get to school without your involvement though as it will be a logistical nightmare.

No scope to move I presume?

The fact that he has been offered a late place from the waiting list suggests that he is perhaps one of those who 'only just' pass for the grammar. Those kids can end up having a very hard time if they are bottom of the heap academically. You need to be realistic about your DS's abilities. There's nothing wrong with being in the bottom few of a grammar school class (someone has to be), but could your DS cope with being in that position, especially if he wasn't keen to go there in the first place? Going to a grammar school doesn't guarantee a good outcome at the other end. The grammars get the best academic students who would do well anywhere, so it doesn't guarantee that they have the best teachers.
It sounds like a world of pain in so many ways going for the grammar.
Disclaimer - turned down a GS place at super-selective for my DS because I felt the atmosphere and ethos was all wrong for him. He graduated from Cambridge last year….

Why isn't your DS keen on the grammar?

Whilst I don't agree with letting your child choose, I wouldn't want to send DS to a school he really didn't want to go to. Are his worries about it real? Is there any chance you can visit it tomorrow with him?

Hm. Well, my DD goes to a single-sex GS in the next city, and is absolutely thriving. But although it's quite a long journey it's relatively easy - a short drive to the bus-stop, there's a school bus and lots of service buses for coming home if there's something after school. And she was always convinced it was the right school for her so she's never complained or missed the bus. (also despite being a GS it has a high added value score, and is definitely not religious - that would have been a no-no for her).

So, despite knowing how good a GS can be, my gut feeling reading your posts is that if I was you I would not force him to go there.

Back in the jurassic era, I turned a grammar place down to go to the local secondary modern. The worst-case scenario is that he goes to your local comp, which you all seem reasonably content with. The best-case scenario is that he goes on the fantastic comp's waiting list and eventually gets a place.

The competition is so tough at grammar schools that the difference between just 'failing' and passing must be pretty small. Hardly something that would mean someone would struggle.

I take it you couldn't move closer to the grammar?

If he's happy with the comp, then he'll do fine.

If you are unsure, why don't you all visit the grammar school (and comp) tomorrow, before you make your decision. You'll know instantly if it feels right or wrong. Include the. Logistics of travel. Ask at the school whether many people do the same route. If so, the travelling won't be so bad.

You sound like a good supportive parent. That's the biggest influence on a child, not the school.

My dd scraped a pass at the 11plus but then didn't get a place on distance. Here it's just a pass mark and then places are allocated to the nearest x number of kids who passed.

So she went to the crappy comp with its 40% gcse pass rate. She's thriving and is on target for Bs and As at gcse. Maybe if she'd gone to the grammar she would have been on target for straight As.....who knows?

But she's happy, she's in top sets for everything, the teachers love her. I reckon at the grammar she would have been disheartened by the really bright kids and her confidence would have suffered. Though I guess some kids may react different and rise to the challenge of trying to keep up, others may give up.

If it was an "unexpected" pass on the 11+, then perhaps the Grammar may not be a comfortable experience for him. And the single-sex thing is not ideal.
Do some horse trading with him. Say that you will agree to local school, not Grammar, if he agrees to fully participate, seize opportunities and get involved in stuff - in school or out - so he creates his own 'grammar experience'.

You can always re-visit the decision at sixth form.

Are there other DC to consider?

For the transport issues Id turn the grammar down. Sounds a nightmare. How would he manage the reverse journey? Would you be home in time to pick him up from the station?

Personally I'd appeal for the nice comp. See if you can get a late place.

My able DS turned down a grammar for a fantastic comp. It was the right choice for DS. The school suits and stretches him.

Would be hesitant about a poor comp though. I'd also be hesitant about him being at the very bottom of a grammar too. Would it effect his self confidence.

I think you're mad, sorry. I would choose the grammar like a shot.

which school is it?

I can only talk about my personal experience ...

I went to a single sex grammar a long way from my home from 11-14. I was miles away from my new friends (60 minute journey) which made a social life difficult. By the time I went to a mixed sex school at 14 (also a grammar) I couldn't speak to boys (weird aliens) and it took me years to deal with this.

Maybe I would have been a social cripple regardless but as such I will avoid single sex schools.