TTC Super Ovulation part 2

Hallo Ari, a holiday seems a very good way to pass those interminable 25 days. And yes, I'm afraid for us too sex has become only about procreation, with a thin and unconvincing veneer of enthusiasm!
Joycep, my chlamydia was 6.1 x 10[to the power of 3, can't do a superscript] micrograms DNA. I believe I did read somewhere that it was even possible for chlamydia to be passed non-sexually, but I can't find it now.
I forwarded my results to Louise and asked her what Mr S thinks of it and she said he doesn't use the test as he thinks it inaccurate, and that his colleagues at NewLife don't use it either. So tricky to know what to do ...
On a different note, does anyone have endometriosis? I have, or had, stage 4, the most severe, and was told 20 years ago that conception was likely to be difficult. I left it another 18 years before trying though, and in the end, my endo doesn't seem to have had much bearing on my fertility as far as I know. In fact, now that I've had my son, my symptoms of endo are minimal compared with before, and yet it's now that I have infertility issues. Before it was miscarriage.

Care- so yes your case sounds multi factorial . But perhaps your infections are the cause of your high nk cells so wiping out those infections and using immunes has now got to tip the balance in your favour.! From what i remember your AMH levels weren?t all that bad. I have seen a lot of people on FF with AMH levels below 2 conceiving ? some naturally. I think amh is good at scaring the life out of us ? i have spent the last 2 years knowig my reserve is low for my age and now nervously waiting for the results again 2 years on. I?m praying it hasn? fallen off a cliff even more!

Thanks very much brownstag for posting that. That is helpful. I am interested in her line ?if you have been feeling there was something wrong? ? I have been feeling there is sth wrong but not convinced it?s the hidden C either.! All our GUM tests over here are negative. And Just over two years ago I had never had unprotected sex before. We started ttc and i was pregnant 2 months later and then m/c (I had actually been on antibiotics). Anyway I don?t believe that that m/c was caused by hidden C and I don?t think my inability to conceive since really can be related to hidden C unless I had it pre unprotected sex ? which apparently is possible. I presume that is why people find they eradicate it but then find it is back again or perhaps the antibiotics don?t clear it up. I don?t know , it seems a mystery to me! Anyway I did find people on FF who had negative hidden C results so it would seem not everyone has it.
What level of Chlamydia dna did Serum find in your blood? Mine was 4.2.

Arian- I am glad you are ok on the anti bs so far. Enjoy Spain!

Hi all .. Reading from sunny Spain so been quiet for a few days but following everything with interest. Day 4 of the anti-bs here, caused no issues for OH (he won't stop drinking beer though but says he 'only has a pint or two a day' and thinks that is ok. Sigh. Not caused me any issues yet but taking anti-bs longer than a week in the past has caused me stomach issues so I've been taking daily hefty probiotics alongside.

The hidden C infection won't show up on standard GUM tests so either of you could have had it for years and I read up a bit about the longevity of it, seems other people say what Penny is about it can stay dormant and then cause problems later. I don't know, but I'm thinking I want a shot at getting rid of it and the urea plasma .. and I wont be getting tested again, at 270 euros a shot that's just too much for me plus there's no way I want to be taking another 25 days of anti-bs.

As for DTD I'm afraid there is a general lack of interest (on my part I'm afraid) so no every other day shagging for us, much more on the same lines as brownstag with a few days before and during OV and then that's it. Two years of TTC have killed the romance of it all for me I'm afraid :(

/waves to everyone, will catch up properly when we're back and I'm not on the iPhone!

Joycep, I asked Penny from Serum about the other infection (increased bacterial load) and she said:

'The increased bacterial load is a minor finding and will be taken care of with these antibiotics. If you have been feeling that there was "something" wrong, this is probably the chlamydia infection. The longer it stays untreated the more it affects your body. You managed to stay pregnant with it probably because they hadn't reached that stage yet where they become a problem for fertility. Once they did you started having problems conceiving. I am sure you will see a difference in this "something" you have been feeling that was wrong after the treatment.'

I don't know whether I'm convinced or not. When my DH and I got together 13 years ago, we had everything tested at the GUM clinic and it was all negative. But maybe if it was hidden C I had it all the time, who knows, maybe from 25 years ago even. It just seems strange that it would not affect me for so long, but now in the last 18 months it has done.
As to the infections coming back pretty easily, how can they do so if they've been eradicated in both partners and they stay faithful?

I told Louise about taking the Gonal F in my tent at a festival. She thought it was very funny. Didn't mention the vodka. That was for hygiene purposes though so I'm sure she wouldn't disapprove.

Abney, yes the Gonal F in the cool bag. When I ordered it they said they told me to keep it in the fridge. I've just read the instructions and it says to refrigerate it but then it says that if refrigeration is not available you can store it below 25 degrees Celcius for up to 3 months. When I've had it delivered it comes with the cold packs around it, wrapped in a giant polystyrene box so I just assumed it needed to be kept the same way as the Ovitrelle. I don't generally keep the cold packs in the freezer. I did keep all the ones I'd had delivered so far (totalling 6) because they stay frozen for a very long time and are much more useful than the icepacks you get for picnicking! I had them all in the bottom of the freezer when the lodger moved out last week because I need to defrost the rest of the freezer and figured I could just put the few things that were left in there in one of the drawers with the cold packs whilst I sorted out the freezer. See, very practical, me! Not just with the vodka. They were in the cupboard prior to that. I tell you what though, they are well worth keeping. Once I'd done my last injection, my OH put the beers in the cool bag with the packs that had already been in there for 36 hours and when we got back to the tent at around midnight the beers felt like they were straight out of the fridge!

Joycep I think the quote you posted on the 10+ thread is really interesting, that these infections may not affect otherwise perfectly fertile ladies, but if there are other issues they can tip the balance. My situation seems to be low ovarian reserve, high natural killer cells plus these infections, so no wonder nothing is getting through. This next month i'm finishing the anti-b's, doing IVF plus taking immune drugs - if all of that doesn't work well i'm not sure what i'll do after that!

i might re-test at some point, i think it will depend on what happens.

Oh and Kittens, I also loved the festival story - brings a whole new meaning to the phrase 'doing drugs at festival'!

And Euro, so sorry to hear about what a crappy time you've had regarding the smear results. I am certainly going to get very regular smears over the next couple of years now. Best of luck with the treatment and I'll be really interested in what Dr G says.

yes a bottomless pit indeed - we have spent a hideous amount already and still no further forward! I don't think I'll retest either. On my google ramblings tonight, I have found that it can come back pretty easily.

Hi Joycep, yes, I too am a bit dubious about the chlamydia DNA's prevalence in the normal population. I think the vaginal infection you mentioned is the same kind of thing as mine; but the way I understood it was that E. coli and proteus were just examples of what it could be; basically it wasn't one of the specific ones they tested for like ureaplasmas, etc.
If I do take the antibiotics I don't think I'll retest; it seems as if this fertility business is a bottomless pit for me to throw my money down as it is!

hi there - sorry to drop in unannounced but brownstag, I got my serum results today and also tested positive for the chlamydia dna. They found some minor vaginal infection as well caused by the ecoli/proteus bacteria. I am wondering whether everyone tests positive for this chlamydia. Slightly nervous about taking all the anti-bs as thrush plagued me every single month last year. I would be really interested to hear what your sister has to say once she has spoken to the consultant!

carebear - I am glad the anti bs are going ok for you. Will you get your tests redone after you have finished~?

sorry, eurochick, just saw your post. Yes, that pain is quite a shocker, isn't it?EBut I suppose it means more than egg is coming out, so it's got to be goodin the long run.
... 6dpo ... how the days drag. I'm going to a festival on Saturday, will be 10dpo then and if the test is negative will be drinking all day, I'm afraid! I've been so virtuous lately that I need to let my hair down.

Pebbles, we generally shag for 5 days up to and including ovulation, and then nothing else for the whole month!
And re. the Athens test: my sister the sexual health nurse is going to ask her consultant at work when she's back from holiday what she makes of my results and the suggested treatment. The thing is, if I have chlamydia then I must have had it for a very long time as we've been together for so long and haven't been with anyone else since we got together. And I conceived my DS despite it; it's only since having him that I have infertility issues as well as NK cell problems, so it's the other 'unknown' infection that I'm more interested in, as that's only been going on, I think, since his birth.
BuzzyBee, thanks, yes I will be doing all that with the yoghurt. When I was about 14 I was on long-term antibiotic treatment and had thrush virtually constantly for a year or two. Then it went away for years and years, but I've had it again frequently recently since DS's birth. Maybe because of the imbalance caused by the other infection.

Jaffa oh god you are good shagging every other day, not sure I could manage that! Top marks for effort .

How about everybody else are you all every other day shaggers, am I slacking?!

Kittens also living the vodka wonder what Mr S would make of it, ha ha!

Brownstag I am the same ad you re the Athens test, not sure if to do them or not. Might wait and see how the people taking treatment for it get on.

pebbles I got a bit freaked out when he said have the hysteroscopy and I'm glad I waited until the next cycle, well I had my last injecyion today and haven't had any twinges at all also I only had 1 bar on my cbfm and usually I have 2 this will all send me insane

brownstag a friend of mine always ate yogurt when on anti b's to combat thrush, when I was at school they told us the best way to deal with thrush was to put yogurt on a tampon, I have to say it works and is a lot cheaper than the canestan stuff athough a little gross

Hi all. Reading all posts with interest. The first SO attempt I had about 3 follies and then it finally went down to 1. The 5th time I was on Gonal F for the first time which appeared to kick start my left ovary 2 x 24 mm follies found. Previously my leftie was deemed not to be working. No weight loss found with Gonal F but the Hydroxy definitely surpresses your appetite.

HavingKittens I am interested to know what you are keeping in the cool bag. Not the Gonal F I hope? I was told that this did not need to be kept in the fridge. Is this the case? What was you keeping in your freezer along side the peas and carrots? Strange that I am asking but I am very curious. :)

Thanks Carebear, I'll try to do the same. I'm in two minds about it really; my sister is a sexual health nurse, and she regards most of these infections they're testing for 'as of no clinical significance'. I also stumbled upon a website run by a gynaecologist which had a Q&A section, and someone asked him about these tests, and he said he used to test for them, and treat them, but he'd found no improvement in pregnancy rates so had stopped. On the other hand, I'm prepared to exhaust every avenue. Certainly with the bacterial load thing, it makes sense to me that if the vaginal ph isn't right, it could be killing off sperm. I have suspected I had something like that ever since having my DS but NHS tests found nothing.
Not looking forward to the anti-bs though. I will definitely get thrush (it doesn't take much), and therefore create another problem!

kittens I love your improvised use of vodka! How very rock and roll. I tended to use that antibac hand gel stuff when I was injecting.

I was only getting one follie on the Letrozole too and Mr S was plannign to bump up my dose when I decided to stop. Then I had an unmedicated IUI cycle and there were two mature follies on the scan! I don't think my ovaries liked being told what to do (like me - the easiest way to get me to do something is to order me not to do it!).

Brownstag I think the antibiotic regime Serum prescribe is more hardcore than what would be given by a GUM clinic here for "normal" chlamydia.

I had really bad pain with one cycle of superov, and all the symptoms od mild OHSS. It only lasted for a weekend though. By the time I saw Mr S on Monday for a scan I was no longer in pain and everything looked fine.

Brownstag wow another positive. How do you feel about it?

I emailed Penny regarding recommended treatment as I was told to, and she emailed me back instructions of what antibiotics to take when, it wasn't a prescription just an email. I took this to the GP and they prescribed the antib's. The total cost came to £45 for both of us, as you have to pay a certain amount for each item don't you, even with an NHS prescription. They did make DH go in as well as me though, they wouldn't give me a prescription for both of us.

We're on day 13 out of 25 now, and other than feeling a bit sick at times (the anti-feeling sick drug om-something really helps) its been fine. I'm just having AF now and am mentalling as to whether it looks any different from normal! I did have a lot of brown/black discharge last week pre-AF that i convinced myself was my body expelling the nasties.

Just got my results from Serum: positive for chlamydia DNA and increased bacterial load, which means some type of infection but not one of the ones they tested for. I've been asked to contact Penny re. treatment.
I've forgotten now which of you got sent the prescription without having to pay for it; is there anything you did or didn't do to prompt that, do you think? Is contacting Penny going to make any difference?
I was just thinking, what about if you go to your GUM clinic with the results; might they not prescribe?

Jaffa, I didn't ever get more than one follie on the Letrozole either. That's why I'm on Gonal F and Tamoxifen now. Last cycle I had 2 follies with that. No BFP though . I have my tracking scan on Thursday (CD13) and am planning to start "trying" from tonight onwards. I've tried the two/three days prescribed and had no luck so I reckon it can't do any harm to continue with the methods we were following prior to Super Ovulation. Also, as an insurance, in case I happen to ovulate earlier. Louise said they only suggest the essential days so it puts less pressure on. I still think having a good "run up" is a good idea.

Not sure how it's going to go this month. I ended up at Latitude Festival over the weekend due to being offered freebies on Friday afternoon. It was all very last minute and the one concern was that I was supposed to do my last injection on the Sunday, when i would be there. I had kept all the cool packs from my various injection deliveries so got them out of the freezer and kept the injection in a little cool bag from Sat morning, when we left, until Sunday afternoon and it was still cold when I got it out to use so hopefully it will be ok. My concerns were that it may have been kept too cold and also that I ended up doing it 5 hours earlier than I was meant to because I knew that I wouldn't get the chance to go back to the tent at 9pm to do it. They say you're meant to do it at the same time each day. I don't suppose it will have a dramatic effect changing the time. Never thought I'd be doing that in a tent though. I didn't have an alcohol wipe so ended up using vodka to clean the area!

jaffa, I wish I could tell you the Gonal F made me loose a stone (or even a few pounds would be a start)! The first cycle of using it, it made me really tired. I didn't find that so much this time. I can't tell you what effect it has on your mood because I have plenty to make me feel sad at the moment so can't tell if it's worse from taking all the drugs or whether I'd be like that anyway.

I hate the being told. Puts me right off, so we just shag all the time so it's not noticeable. Mr S says it's good to refresh the sperm every two days, so we just do that all month apart from the last evil week where pmt has taken over my body oh and we don't shag during AF because the Fertility Plan book says not to (can't remember why).

Was just checking in case we weren't doing enough shagging!!

Just curious dues everybody just try for the two days or do you carry on for another day?? Just wondered as was looking at the egg meets sperm plan and when you ovulate they say try for three days miss a day and have one last try. I guess that's because generally you can't be sure when you ovulate where as we know it's in that 48hr time frame. Apologies for the personal question!

Sorry you're right, pebbles as my DH reminded me it's trigger shot tonight and shagging wed and thurs. I got confused what day we're on.

complete strangers should have said before posted! (smile)

Hey Jaffa sorry you only got one follie I can imagine you are disappointed but remember it only takes one!
Re the gonal f I have only had it for ivf so taking it for over a week sodon't think you can compare. I was very bloated but as I said earlier I did over stimulate so sure if you only have to take for certain ammount if days you will be fine.
Can I ask why you have been told to start intercourse (great word, I hit try from Dr G which is much better!) same day as trigger shot? I was told to do injection Saturday morning and try from Sunday. Who would hCve thought we would be discussing when we ate going to have a shag with co

Hi, all. I've just had my first ovary scan of the first super ov cycle (note it's my second 'go' on super ov after a miscarriage earlier this year). I'm on 7.5 of Letrozole (no messin'), on CD11, and there was only one follicle measuring 15mm. So not great. pebbles, I've just read your results, and they look really good considering you'd have a couple of days for them to grow a bit more as well. My uterine lining was 8mm, which he said was good, like ari said, but I'm sure my first ever scan (last time round) he put me on Progynova when a scan showed 9mm. He says that we'll stick to the same treatment for now, but if the next scan doesn't have two or more good sized follicles, I should start gonal-f injections. So, who can tell me about those? They sound doable, but what effect do they have on one's body? Ideally I'd like someone to tell me I'll lose a stone - ? No?

So it's 'intercourse' tomorrow night and trigger shot, then more shagging on Thursday night. Ho hum.

cavemum I'm sorry but I don't know much about the medication you've been recommended - hence my queries! Sounds like pebbles has got it covered though.

brownstag that sounds like some serious ovulation! We'll be expecting triplets, then? I hope the pain has died down, you poor thing. And I'll be interested in your Serum results. I haven't decided if they'd be good for me to try given my history - are they for conception itself or avoiding miscarriage? Sorry I really should go off and read up on it. Just easing myself back into this whole thing and trying not to stress or let it take over my life.

Jx