Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think you can find a job after 45

61 replies

Hoppity80 · Yesterday 20:54

Just saw an insta post by the influencer Stacey Duguid.

She is a former fashion journalist who has been chronicling her experience on insta of being rejected from hundreds of jobs across multiple sectors. She argues that inbuilt bias in AI applicant tracking systems mean mid life women are often automatically rejected and is speaking up about women having to minimise their experience to get past the systems.

Her latest post says that women are now being split into two groups by employers: under 45s and over. And if you are over 45 you are classed as old and unemployable.

I know there is lots of age based mysogyny out there but AIBU to find this utterly terrifying and to think the situation is not quite as extreme as this.

I am around that age and feel I’ve only properly got going - although I’ve been working for over 20’years. I am full time with bags of energy and a real learning mindset!

if you are an employer pls can you give some insight about why you wouldnt employ a woman over 45?

i

OP posts:
KiwiFall · Yesterday 23:14

I changed job after 45 in a totally different industry to what I was working in. It was my second application and interview.

Toastedham · Yesterday 23:26

I found skilled work quite easily (2nd application) aged 53 after a long gap being a sahm and carer. But I kept up my skills throughout with a second BSc, MSc and internships and was treated essentially as a new graduate. It helped that my skills were quite technical, I was the top performer in my year, and it was in a skills shortage area with lowered limits on recruiting from overseas.

EBearhug · Yesterday 23:27

I got a new job at 52. Most recent hires one in 50s and one 60. It is a very tough market out there currently. No entry jobs because AI is doing all the admin and data entry where people learn, no younger people (especially women) in case they have children. No older people because of ageism and not wanting to pay for experience. There must be some sweet spot around 39 if you're a man where you are wanted...

It's apparently one of the the biggest demographics of working population. People of 45 have possibly 20+ years to work - I wouldn't necessarily expect anyone to stick in a job that long (I was in my last job for 19 years, though.) It seems a daft policy to me.

Hoppity80 · Today 07:30

Thesnowglobe · Yesterday 22:04

As an employer who does not use AI to sift CVs, of course I wouldn’t discount a woman, or a man for that matter, for being “over 45”. Why would I? Some of my best staff are 60+.

Exactly! That’s why I really don’t get it? I can understand having second thoughts if someone seemed really low energy or stuck in their ways during probation or an interview. But why not give people a chance? I am definitely higher energy now I am a bit more out of the early child raising trenches.

OP posts:
rookiemere · Today 07:57

I am 56 and have managed to get two jobs over the past two years after voluntary redundancy at 54.
Admittedly my current one is part time administrative as I didn’t/couldn’t work ft because of demands of elderly DPs, now thankfully in a care home.
My thoughts are yes it’s hard, but I am more worried about DS prospects after graduation. CVs have changed - both roles involved answering questions for the application rather than being CV based. It’s easier to get a job from a job and it’s easier to get taken on if you apply for roles where they are recruiting teams rather than one individual. How much of that is due to my age versus being general, I am not sure.

I would also say if you really want a job, you will get one. Not necessarily well paid, but my experience is if you put in the effort, tailor your applications accordingly and use AI sparingly and importantly at interview have compelling reasons why you want the role other than it fits round your life or it’s all you think you can get, then you will be hired.

Phineyj · Today 08:08

Of course you can. You need skills that are in demand.

bobajob1 · Today 08:49

Yes you can find a job after 45.
But it may be at half or less of the salary you got previously.
And a zero hours contract instead of employed with benefits.
Unless you are a data engineer or AI bot-builder in which case the future is looking good (right now).

It's industry-dependent and depends on what skills you have.
The UK job market overall has kind of seized up, reflecting low growth post Brexit, higher costs for employers (eg energy, NI) and AI (for the over-45s this is less about being replaced by an AI than by firms in a kind of stasis deciding how to respond, or investing money in AI solutions instead of spending on new hires)
And at the same time AI has famously already made some areas beloved of MN freelancers pretty defunct. Translation, copywriting and copyediting, graphic design, audio typing, some jobs in media eg film editing.

So let's say you were previously a Head of Marketing at £70K and were made redundant, now looking for an equivalent role. Or - to use the example of Stacey Duguid - a fashion editor looking for a job in fashion/media.
These types of roles are being squeezed or contracting. So this is where the 100 applications and no interviews happens. If there's a real job the employer gives it to the person a PP mentioned - age 35-39.
The example beloved of MN - get a job in a supermarket - is not useful. The unemployed grads are going for the supermarket vacancies.

Stacey Duguid is right that there is an issue for experienced, over-45, female knowledge workers in certain industries, who want to find similarly senior salaried jobs they are interested in and would choose to do. She was brave putting it out there and has been rewarded with a temporary part-time freelance contract - which is better than the dole.

Hoppity80 · Today 08:51

To be fair I also did find a great job the other year at the grand old age of 44! So hoping it isn’t game over yet!

I wonder if perhaps some of the issues encountered in high profile campaigns like Stacy D’s are down to women taking long periods out the workforce or working in ultra competitive areas like fashion media. Not that this makes it ok.

One observation I’ve noticed from working in a slightly similar area is that there were very few women over 40 in inhouse rank and file roles and zero over 50. Anyone around this age would typically be a contractor.

There would be some older women at senior levels but far fewer than men. If there was a restructure or a sacking they would typically disappear and go freelance. A man might be out for a few months but then would be found back somewhere else in a similar senior role.

OP posts:
bobajob1 · Today 09:08

I wonder if perhaps some of the issues encountered in high profile campaigns like Stacy D’s are down to women taking long periods out the workforce or working in ultra competitive areas like fashion media.

Is it the individual's fault they can't find a job? For example, should Stacey Duguid have been more far-sighted 30 years ago when she left school and not ever become a fashion journalist?
Or is it structural factors in the economy and changes in the work environment (eg new tech) meaning that there are fewer jobs overall and fewer of the type Stacey D (again for example) would be qualified for and interested in?
Plus a dose of good old fashioned sexism and ageism. And a few other -isms, not forgetting that black women have historically found it harder than white women to find the work they want.

Rocknrollstar · Today 09:41

I got the best job I ever had when I was 50. It was some years ago and even then people told me it was comforting to know that people could still get new jobs at 50.

happydaysout · Today 09:52

I have found it depends on the industry, when I worked at a music venue over 35 was deemed past it, now at the BBC they are plenty of people older than me (50s), some still working in their 70s

bobajob1 · Today 10:14

at the BBC they are plenty of people older

Yes but surely @happydaysout the BBC is a special case, meaning that once in, almost no-one leaves, staff turnover is very low/retention is very high. This has been the same all through my working lifetime. The same people who joined in their 20s and 30s are now the people in their 50s and 60s. If the older cohort left now, very few would be able to find a similar job in media, because the landscape has changed so much since they joined.

JaceLancs · Today 10:18

Not true in my field - all ages are considered
At shortlisting for interview stage we have no idea of candidates age
Experience is always the key and being a good fit within the team

Bridgertonisbest · Today 10:19

I was made redundant earlier this year, was interviewed for most of the jobs I applied for, and through to second round. Landed a new (better) job pretty quickly.

Im late 50’s

bobajob1 · Today 10:21

@Bridgertonisbest What industry?

Phineyj · Today 10:48

I am a teacher/lecturer and have secured four new jobs since age 45 (two are part time and I'm doing them simultaneously). When I got fed up of the job I had in 2022 I quickly had interest from four schools and two of them offered.

I'm sure there's lots of ageism around but there's lots of skills shortages too. An HR specialist friend is struggling to retire as previous employers keep begging her to come back and sort out their messes!

Phineyj · Today 10:49

Oh and my jobshare in one of them.is over state retirement age.

loveawineloveacrisp · Today 10:50

Of course you can. I got a new job at 55. Senior, corporate environment. The job market is very tough at the moment though.

happydaysout · Today 12:58

bobajob1 · Today 10:14

at the BBC they are plenty of people older

Yes but surely @happydaysout the BBC is a special case, meaning that once in, almost no-one leaves, staff turnover is very low/retention is very high. This has been the same all through my working lifetime. The same people who joined in their 20s and 30s are now the people in their 50s and 60s. If the older cohort left now, very few would be able to find a similar job in media, because the landscape has changed so much since they joined.

Maybe, but I joined when I was over 50!

notquiteruralbliss · Today 13:37

I got my current job (front office tech in an Investment Bank at 65)

Legoleopard · Today 13:42

Over 40 is my preferred group of candidates for our customer care roles as they have compassion with the customers, build rapport and are reliable!

Entry level in my dept but once your in and do 12 months options for marketing and hr etc open up.

Hoppity80 · Today 14:19

bobajob1 · Today 09:08

I wonder if perhaps some of the issues encountered in high profile campaigns like Stacy D’s are down to women taking long periods out the workforce or working in ultra competitive areas like fashion media.

Is it the individual's fault they can't find a job? For example, should Stacey Duguid have been more far-sighted 30 years ago when she left school and not ever become a fashion journalist?
Or is it structural factors in the economy and changes in the work environment (eg new tech) meaning that there are fewer jobs overall and fewer of the type Stacey D (again for example) would be qualified for and interested in?
Plus a dose of good old fashioned sexism and ageism. And a few other -isms, not forgetting that black women have historically found it harder than white women to find the work they want.

No of course it's not the individual's fault. I was reflecting on whether there are a number of structural factors at play that mean it is harder for some professional women to find roles in mid life. I think the situation is more nuanced than if you're 45+ you're old and out.

OP posts:
CosyDenimShark · Today 14:55

I was made redundant from my job of nearly 2 decades 2 years ago. I've been offered all 3 jobs that I applied for since! I took the third one. I'm 51.

bobajob1 · Today 15:12

It's uplifting news that some over-45 people/women in some industries are getting new jobs. Great to hear. However this doesn't make it any less true that other over-45s in other sectors and industries are not.

It would be really insightful to dig into the successes to understand what industries they are in, what work areas they cover, what level the vacancy they have filled is at.

Hoppity80 · Today 15:47

bobajob1 · Today 15:12

It's uplifting news that some over-45 people/women in some industries are getting new jobs. Great to hear. However this doesn't make it any less true that other over-45s in other sectors and industries are not.

It would be really insightful to dig into the successes to understand what industries they are in, what work areas they cover, what level the vacancy they have filled is at.

Agree - are these ‘heads of’ kind of jobs, paying £60k plus I wonder?

OP posts:
Swipe left for the next trending thread