Girl pulled dd’s pants down

This happened at my school, year 5 I think. Three kids, two boys and the victim's best friend thought it would be funny to make the "class scapegoat" girl take her knickers off. She refused so they forced her on the ground and did it anyway. The class teacher who was also the head teacher didn't believe the girl. All the kids were given a good talking to. I don't think it happened again. This was early 90s though and the school did have a bullying issue. I don't know how it would be dealt with these days, I would like to think schools would be better in safeguarding bullying issues.

What happened in the end op? X

That makes things much more clear, thank you.

Do you think DD would go back if the girl wasn't there? Absolutely speak to whoever runs the club and ask what they intend to do to make sure it doesn't happen again. Perhaps they need another teacher to help supervise if they can't run the club safely.

Yeah, that's bad.

You really need to kick up a fuss with the school, OP.

I'd start by asking to see safeguarding guidelines they supposedly have in place for the club.

I think it would help to separate the two issues. 1, the girl did this on purpose to your child so there is a risk of bullying and you've made this known and 2, your daughter is too embarrassed and threatening to withdraw from her activity. If she had her pants fall down in some sort of accident situation what would she do then? There would be no one to blame but the embarrassment would be almost the same. I think you could use this as a 'teachable moment' to show her that she can hold her head up and get on with it because she is a proud and brave girl. Try to help her understand that she has the power here to move on from this and losing her activity is the easy way out, and allowing the other girl to win.

I understand she is now self conscious. I don't understand why no one spoke up at the time though, I am hoping this means that it wasn't that obvious and although she thinks everyone was watching, no one did see. Poor girl.

Yeah, I was thinking this too. Little kids aren't exactly subtle when something like this happens. You'd think the teacher would have heard and been alerted to what happened.

Your poor poor DD. I'm so sorry that happened to her.

Yes I’m serious. It was not the only worrying behaviour of that child and helped build up a picture of very worrying home influences. Social services became involved and after investigation remained involved.

I think we need some context. I also think that your daughter (if old enough, I can't judge without the info) is entitled to have a say. If it were me I wouldn't have wanted my mother giving the details to everyone, that would add to the embarrassment.

I would also be making sure that it wasn't an accident as part of the sport? If it was tag and she accidentally pulled her shorts and the pants came with them? Obviously not great still, but there wouldn't have been malicious intent if that was the case.

I understand the distress people- my comments are in line with guidance from the government and experience with social services, not my personal options. I wanted to give OP an idea of what to expect.

I assume you took your DS straight home after the apology to reinforce the message that his behaviour was unacceptable?

Yep, my mum would have come down on me like a tonne of bricks for something as horrid as this

My DS did this at a birthday party (at a house) when he was about 6. He was made apologise by me, I apologised to both the boy and his mother. The boy was very upset. I had a chat with DS about appropriate behaviour and brought this up again with him a few times before parties or social occasions. It was never mentioned again by the parent, the boys were never really friends but their older brothers were and relationships are still good. Whether the other child still remembers or feels upset, I don't know. I was embarrassed of course but honestly what else could have been done that is in everyone's best interests?

I can’t believe some of the responses on here. It is an outrageous thing to happen to someone.

One of my little brothers pulled my shorts and knickers down once at the school fete. I was slightly older than this (year 6). I felt like the whole school saw my bare bum and my hairy fanny.

To this day I have not got over the humiliation.

Please kick up a fuss.

How things haven't changed. Disproportionate to punish the child?!

I think seven year olds do know that even pulling down someone’s shorts is wrong. But I don’t think a suspension would be about punishing the other girl; it would be about restoring DD’s equilibrium.

I agree there is a real chance this was acting out or a cry for help. The other girl needs to talk with a professional rather than to be punished.

The club should have a safeguarding policy and act on it. The genders of the children are irrelevant and all 7 year olds know not to do this.

Ex teacher here, we had a similar incident with 4/5yr olds, before present day safeguarding came in and it was still logged and reported to SS as inappropriate sexual behaviour. The mother of the child who did it was furious, but it was a legal obligation - and this was 20+yrs ago. The club need to step up and deal with it as a safeguarding issue. It's absolutely not about punishment, though the girl in question needs to know it's serious and not acceptable.

But, @yellowsun , why shouldn’t OP’s DD get what she needs to be comfortable in the activity? In her place I wouldn’t be able to bear looking at the other girl for a few weeks. I think hardly anyone would.

It seems wrong to penalise OP’s DD. She had already been harmed.

How old is DD?

How did everyone else see and the teacher not notice? Tbh I'm amazed a teacher missed that, because I'm sure there would have been a huge commotion if that happened on a school yard normally.

As for the child, she is very young and would not have fully understood the seriousness of what she did. What needs to happen there is for her to be made to understand why what she did was terrible. Then it likely won't happen again. Having her miss a few weeks of club doesn't get to the bottom of it.

Of course report it to the school, not because it's their responsibility because it's not school run, but they might schedule a brush up lesson on the topic for kids in the girl's class.

I’m a safeguarding lead in a primary school. Even though it is not a club run by the school, safeguarding guidance means that the school need to ensure policies and procedures sre followed. I would definitely speak to the head/DSL from the school.

in terms of suitable next steps , context is key. Obviously there is no situation where it it’s acceptable, but there is a difference between this happening in a chasing game situation rather than a targeted incident meant to embarrass or done in secret. The age of your child is also relevant when responding to such incidents as safeguarding staff will need to think about any imbalance of age/power.

The guidance around behaviours like this recognise that some behaviours, while not acceptable, can and do happen. Young children are curious and schools deal with similar incidents regularly. We do not use language such as ‘perpetrator’ for young children- the aim is to educate not criminalise.

In situation, we would investigate first. The school will also know if there are other concerns that need acting on or that build a bigger picture. Possible next steps would be some work with the other child around these behaviours and some support for your daughter. Also some safety planning for the club. It would likely not be proportionate to suspend the other pupil from the club.

OP,

I agree that the incident was awful. Seven year olds have a sense of right snd wrong. @Fountofwisdom makes the excellent point that pulling your DD’s pants as well as her shorts might have been a mistake with big consequences. We will never know. But pulling down her shorts would have been bad enough.

However that is secondary to the lack of supervision from the teacher, the minimisation from the other mother, and above all this appalling reply to your email. Please, please pursue this with the Head, the Safeguarding Lead and if necessary the BoG. I agree you should be clear what you want before you begin these talks - eg improved safeguarding and for the other girl to be suspended for X sessions whilst your DD regains her equilibrium.