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Pronouns at work

222 replies

mrsclaus1984 · 08/01/2024 21:36

HR has mandated that from now on we are to include our pronouns in our email signatures.

I don’t wish to do this and am being threatened with formal action.

I feel I should add I don’t consider myself to be transphobic/ homophobic/ general LGBTQ+ phobic.. but I have an issue with being forced to do this.

They are also talking about us addressing any new colleages with gender neutral pronouns until we know for definite how they wish to be addressed.

Does anyone know where I might stand from an employment law point of view in terms of the action which may be taken against me? I’d be so grateful for any advice please.

Getting a bit worried now😕

OP posts:
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Doingmybest12 · 09/01/2024 00:19

They can take a guess at what words to use when they address me

Bigcat25 · 09/01/2024 00:34

I wouldn't choose this as a hill to die on, I'd probably just go with it.

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 09/01/2024 00:35

Fireyflies · 08/01/2024 22:32

I think the best parallel to explain to people why you might not want to is if we were all asked to put "Allah Akbar" on our email footers, on the grounds that it was inclusive to Muslims who wanted to include that phrase.

I was going to say something similar. Nobody is trying to undermine, deny or disrespect anybody else's beliefs, but the same courtesy must also be shown to those who do not share those beliefs themselves. This is 'Inclusion 101', and it is what most adults know and practise instinctively.

These dictatorial demands boil down to the simple fact that some vocal people do not want inclusion at all; they are actually seeking to exclude everybody with different beliefs and practices from them. They seem to have the idea that only they and their preferences matter; when, in actuality, they matter no more or less than anybody else and theirs do.

As I gather from the deleted posts upthread, one of the activists' key weapons is to deliberately use gross hyperbole, catastrophising and emotional blackmail, by deliberately pretending that other people who want their own beliefs and preferences to be respected as well are spreading hatred and wanting people with different beliefs to die.

This is absolutely NO different whatsoever from the tactic that very immature children use, when they're asked to do their homework or tidy their bedroom.

I so wish that so much of this demand for 'inclusion' - i.e. "Everybody must be made to think, believe and do exactly the same as I do and dictate" could be properly described as gynophobia (among others, but that's the main one). Words matter.

BaronessBomburst has outlined above just one of the great many reasons why this misnomered 'inclusive' misogyny is so hateful and predatory. A woman is told that her ability to do her job - to protect her livelihood - in safety matters nothing when compared with somebody else's demand that she be exposed to the wrath and refusal to communicate ('cancelled') of misogynists, because it somehow makes them feel all warm and lovely. Remind me who the haters and the phobics were again...?

DissidentDaughter · 09/01/2024 00:36

“I’m not religious / I don’t subscribe to that ideology” 😂

siressmins · 09/01/2024 00:41

Weird @mrsclaus1984 . Also weird is the staff member at my work who instead I provide a title. Ie. Miss, Ms, Mrs. I refused.

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 09/01/2024 00:41

Bigcat25 · 09/01/2024 00:34

I wouldn't choose this as a hill to die on, I'd probably just go with it.

Did you see BaronessBomburst's post upthread?

Don't be fooled into thinking that this is a neutral thing and just some silly little hobby that pedants like to pursue. It is about people demanding that their preferences, and only theirs, must be respected - even when that directly leads to harm caused to other people.

It's a fire that's been deliberately set in society that very soon will have spread so far that it will not be able to be extinguished - and in true DARVO fashion, the ones who are being harmed and persecuted are not the ones who claim that they are.

siressmins · 09/01/2024 00:41

*insisted

dinglyping · 09/01/2024 00:44

I think Dr Who's wrapped this one up.

Meep: My chosen pronoun is the definite article. I am always "The Meep".
Doctor: Oh. I do that.

Kind regards,
The Dinglyping

starfishmummy · 09/01/2024 00:50

I only use first person pronouns (I, me). Please refer to me by my full name at all times .

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 09/01/2024 00:51

Also, referring to a person by default as 'they' - when that person is a known and observed individual (i.e. not an abstract 'somebody') is absolutely not a neutral act. This is an outright lie that is spread by those who want their beliefs to be the only ones that are accepted.

The vast, vast majority of people choose to identify as - and therefore would want to be referred to - as 'he' or 'she', directly corresponding to their sex.

This is instinctive and ingrained from the start - if you don't believe me, next time a proud mum introduces you to her new baby girl or boy, start referring to the child as 'they' and see how well that goes down.

soupandcrackers · 09/01/2024 00:52

Dear Sir/Madam,

Blah blah blah.

Yours faithfully,

Soup A. Crackers (Mrs)

NotARealWookiie · 09/01/2024 01:03

RitaFromThePitCanteen · 08/01/2024 21:42

Tell them thay they're being discriminatory in forcing you to out yourself against your will (you don't have to say what you'd be outing yourself as).

I came on to say this. It’s your best line of defence.

randomuser2019 · 09/01/2024 02:03

This reply has been withdrawn

Removed at poster's request due to privacy concerns.

MissTrip82 · 09/01/2024 02:17

SheFliesLikeABirdInTheSky · 08/01/2024 23:06

If that is the case, what in the everloving FUCK is wrong with putting MRS in your name if you're married?! Confused

What fresh hell is this? This would only come from (jealous) single females.

(I said the JEALOUS ones, not all ones.)

Edited

Goodness going for the misogynist tropes bingo card here.

How embarrassing.

BetrayedAuntie · 09/01/2024 03:17

hoarahloux · 08/01/2024 22:28

Sounds great. Inclusive. I can't see the problem.

It's utter nonsense

sashh · 09/01/2024 03:40

My pronouns are: adult human female

Or all of the other advice about protected characteristics.

IAmAnIdiot123 · 09/01/2024 04:13

I wouldn't usually agree to putting my pronouns in my email signature however now I have discovered Thy/Thou I may have to change my mind.

I'm about to enter my God era.

FatFemale · 09/01/2024 07:17

Thy/Thou is perfect! This could get really hilarious!

Fireyflies · 09/01/2024 07:24

Thy/Thou are substitutes for you/yours unfortunately (rather than she/her). You could of chose give you/yours as the pronouns must people will use in your presence and say you have no view on what they use to describe you when you aren't around.

Rainbowshit · 09/01/2024 07:59

It's against Yogyakarta principle 6f.

f) Ensure the right of all persons ordinarily to choose when, to whom and how to disclose information pertaining to their sexual orientation or gender identity, and protect all persons from arbitrary or unwanted disclosure, or threat of disclosure of such information by others.

yogyakartaprinciples.org/principle-6/

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 09/01/2024 08:09

RitaFromThePitCanteen · 08/01/2024 21:42

Tell them thay they're being discriminatory in forcing you to out yourself against your will (you don't have to say what you'd be outing yourself as).

Very very good point

ClairDeLaLune · 09/01/2024 08:32

DrBalenciaga · 08/01/2024 23:45

Is that so? 🧐

@DrBalenciaga yup.

whynotwhatknot · 09/01/2024 10:59

theres already been a court case they cant make you do anything tell them tostuff it

Wednesday6 · 09/01/2024 13:28

redfacebigdisgrace · 08/01/2024 23:19

@Wednesday6 why does it matter if they’re a man or a woman?

Because when multiple people are CCd I mispronounce their pronounce so say "he has a complaint" etc when I'm talking to a woman and it's not great for relationship building which is part of my job..

Wednesday6 · 09/01/2024 13:31

No one signs Mrs.. Italians do add Dr or Dr-a to their signatures..
So when I received an email from Ashley and then talking about him and copied him in saying things like "Ashley needs support with it can you email him directly" CC him in and then when he was retiring I found out it was a woman I was embarrased!

Anyway my point being that although this started off a a trend for supporting trans/non binary people it actually helps me a lot with work when dealing with people all over the world.