What is the dividing line between feminism chat and feminist activism?

[stumbledin]

Have been happily on mumsnet for just over a year now and as my name suggests do tend to stumble into things.

eg I got caught out by petitions being somehow exiled to a remote island that no ones knows about.

And not I feel I have post info on this thread that are "activism". But as I see feminism chat as feminist activism never occurs to me to post it to a thread that fewer women use.

If anyone can explain the logic of the division.

And maybe along with the lengty notes on moderation and trans it might be more proactively positive to have a pinned post that shows the different segments of feminism on mumsnet, and the logic behind it.

Apart from clarifying things, it would also act as a signpost to these other postings on feminism

[FrothyDragon]

I just frequently forget FA exists. brain fog is a shit

[Creepster]

The original name of Feminist chat was Feminism and Women's Rights, which is why we still call it FWR.
Most organizing goes on elsewhere now.

[Alicewond]

God so many names, and each have an agenda. As a woman who has been a leader over men several times, I’ve not seen gender take a role. But I expect my opinion will be thrown down and criticised as it doesn’t say what you want it to say

[OneEpisode]

Hi Alice, where do you work? Can we come there too?

[Ereshkigal]

The original name of Feminist chat was Feminism and Women's Rights, which is why we still call it FWR.

I think it's more important than ever to keep that focus.

[TheCountessofFitzdotterel]

The majority of active posters didn't want the split because of the way discussion and activism are impossible to separate, but it was done anyway, and most people just forget about the activism section.

[PassingIntoTheWest]

@Alicewond, I don't understand.

You imply that you've never experienced sexism in the course of your working life, therefore you say that it doesn't exist.

I've never seen Mount Everest, but I'm pretty sure it still exists.

[PassingIntoTheWest]

@stumbledin, I agree - the two topics should be merged. I reported your post to flag it to MN. They kept trying to merge topics recently (some of which posters absolutely didn't want to be merged!), so hopefully they'll be open to the idea 🤞🏼.

[APerkyPumpkin]

God so many names, and each have an agenda. As a woman who has been a leader over men several times, I’ve not seen gender take a role.

Huh?

[ErrolTheDragon]

I can't remember the rationale for splitting up FWR into a load of sections.
Maybe the original idea was that threads on eg theory or books could get lost amid more general discussions - having just taken a quick look at the former there may be some interesting stuff there that most people are oblivious of. On the face of it, it's not a bad idea, up to a point. In practice it doesn't work well because regular users tend to have one or two favourite default topics which they check for new posts, plus maybe scanning Active.

I think for the FWR domain it might make sense to have one main topic and one 'reference' topic for threads which people may put a lot of effort into and want to refer to.

[PassingIntoTheWest]

MN have replied to my report, and said that they'll discuss this next week and let us know the outcome.

[stumbledin]

Just popped in for a quick catch up - certainly wasn't thinking about suggesting anything to MNHQ - well not yet. Wouldn't want anyone to think I had crept in and tried to get changes over a weekend!

For me it is specifically chat and activism cant be split. And because it is feminism it is obviously about women's rights so either or both threads combined would be about women's rights surely???

So maybe combine chat and activism, and if worthwhile have an events thread. I think that could be useful to quickly scan through and see events .... maybe?

I can see feminism theory as being a separate thread, but again would like to see this area some how signposted. Or when a chat/activims thread starts getting bogged down by a few posters with dogmatic ideas of the "correct" approach they could be asked to take it outside, ie onto the theory thread.

As for feminist support - what is that? Many women's services aren't necessarily feminist but come out of an acceptance of a need for women centred services, which for me as this is mumsnet should just be a prominant thread on its own.

Oh okay, have just seen my last paragraph clearly illustrates that I never get beyond "chat". So feminist support is for women asking for a feminist focused support in response to particular (personal?) issues. Now I feel bad as I have never looked at it, and not sure I would have relevant support to offer. So maybe we should each take on to check this thread, if not everyday, everyweek to see if someone is asking for help and we are all driving by on the other side of the road.

[ErrolTheDragon]

A lot of feminist activism is pretty much impossible to do on a public forum anyway. We can't even use it for posting petition links, they'd just get shuffled off to the petitions board.

[Creepster]

As a woman who has been a leader over men several times, I’ve not seen gender take a role.

Oddly enough, I too have been in a position of authority over men and it was impossible for any of us to ignore that gender roles were the obstacles we had to overcome to achieve our goals.

[TooLateThePhalarope]

it was done anyway, and most people just forget about the activism section

And the Feminist Support and Feminist books sections.

[YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet]

Hello everyone - thanks for your thoughts. We're certainly open to discussion about consolidating the Feminism topics (as we've done elsewhere on the site) and would consider it if there were enough demand for it to happen. We could merge some topics or go back to the old FWR board, for example. Happy to hear what you all think.

[ErrolTheDragon]

Thanks, Becky!
Perhaps you could gather an idea of what more people think if MNHQ was to start a pinned thread canvassing opinion - is it possible for you to pin the same thread to each of the feminist subtopics?

The options might include something like :
A) stay as it is
B) revert to just Feminism and Women's Rights
C) FWR and a 'reference' topic - theory, books, links to relevant external sources

D) any other suggestions?

It might inform the discussion if we could collectively remember why FWR was subdivided in the first place. Unfortunately I suspect that the relevant threads are Swiss cheese now after some very active posters deregged for various reasons and got all their posts deleted. Maybe MNHQ has some record of the rationale?

[stumbledin]

Thanks Becky @MNHQ

My original post was more about helping when newbies first sign up to make sure they dont blunder around like I did to clearly "Signpost" what went where via a pinned post. (eg the exile island of petitions!)

But the idea of a pinned post to survey seems good.

I would go for:
Combining chat and activism,
A new thread for events and consultation deadlines (to easily find when and where and meeting up)
Theory, reference sources, suggested reading

My worry about the support thread is those who find it to ask questions are then not responded to as so many dont know it is there. Not sure what the solution is to that.

Thanks

[ShesDressedInBlackAgain]

Can we go back to FWR and get Orchid back please?

[PassingIntoTheWest]

I like options B and C from @ErrolTheDragon's list.

And I love the idea of the board being called Feminism and women's rights. It's old school and strong 💪🏻.

[YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet]

Thanks everyone - really appreciate your thoughts. We were thinking one possibility could be to merge all into a new FWR and then have a pinned thread for resources - does that sound workable?

[ErrolTheDragon]

That sounds good, although I tend to think there's still a place for 'theory' - longer posts/ slower moving discussions. However, it's not clear that it would get used - though if there was a pinned resources thread that could point to the extra topic.

[stumbledin]

Hi Becky @MNHQ

Thanks for following this thread.

Was just thinking, though I am sure you all have, that if you are going to make a change it would be better that MNHQ started a thread putting forwart the suggestion.

Not that many have actually commented here, so better to get wider feedback.

Sure you have thought this.