Help me be clear about the GRA/Equality Act Exemptions

[FreezerBird]

Sorry, I'm sure this has been done elsewhere but possibly mid-thread so I can't find a specific thread about it.

Discussing GRA issues with DH last night, and he is starting to see the issues (the turning point being that Millwall - MILLWALL! - were bullied out of hosting the meeting subsequently held at the HoC.) We're in Wales, in a Plaid constituency, and DH asked what Leanne Wood says about it, so I directed him to her tweets. She's someone we generally think pretty well of (we used to live in David Davies' constituency and detested him so the news that he hosted the HoC meeting, standing up for free speech, was also a pretty big deal).

So there's the tweet in which LW (who has worked with women's refuge organisations) says she doesn't consider the GRA to be a problem because exemptions under the Equality Act will still apply. I need to get my head round this; I know that there are plans to change the protected characteristic from 'having a grc' to 'gender identity' (is that right?).

So does this mean the exemptions become a nonsense, in that eg, a refuge might advertise a position for women only, and this male-bodied person applies, but the exemption can't be used because this person is legally female?

Or is it that the exemptions exist but are not used properly because of pressure from TRAs and organisations wanting to be progressive?

Or is it something else that I'm missing?

DH is aghast at the whole attempts to shut down debate (Millwall!) and has signed the petition because he totally gets that there is a debate to be had, but I'm a bit stuck on the Equality Act stuff, and throw myself upon the wisdom of you lot.

[Sanderz]

I'm pretty sure there are no plans to change the protected characteristic on the EA - it's currently "gender reassignment".

The exemptions will remain and mean you can discriminate against people with that protected characteristic (or any other) so long as you have a good reason.

Refuges/prisons etc. will still be able to use those exemptions, but they don't seem to be using them at the moment.

[MacaroonMama]

Following this. I think that whenthese changes were initially mentioned, both the Equality Act and the GRA were going to be ‘updated’ (no, not in a good way) - since then, the Tories have said they do not plan on altering the Equality Act, but until we see the consultation documents, we will not know for sure.

FairPlay for Women has an excellent resource on this, let me just go see if I can find it...

[MacaroonMama]

fairplayforwomen.com/equality-act-2010_womens-rights/

Could someone clicky link this please?

[MacaroonMama]

Oh I did it myself! 😂

[Sanderz]

Macaroon some of the responses from Tory MPs have said explicitly that they will not be considering changing the EA - thankfully! I saw loads of quotes in a thread some time last week.

[GenderApostate]

Trans groups ARE going after the exemptions though, they want to be allowed anywhere and everywhere. They are very open about it on their blogs and chats.

[Sanderz]

Yes I believe that :(

[MacaroonMama]

That is the worry, isn’t it? The whole thing is awful, but when the TRAs decide to go after the Equalities Act, I feel the whole land will go a bit Handmaid’s Tale...

[Ellenripleysalienbaby]

So can I ask then - is Paris Lees correct or incorrect in these tweets then?

[Sanderz]

I think she's right isn't she?

This has come up a few times on thread I've been reading recently so yes, I think she's right.

I could have misunderstood though so I don't know, I hope someone else can confirm for us!

[Patodp]

She's right but she's wrong.

The point about toilets

there are no laws in Britain on which facilities people can use
Is a lie.

Your employer has to provide same sex provision of bathrooms and it is illegal to have unisex bathrooms unless they are completely self contained. You can't have makes sharing with females regardless of their "self declared gender". Stonewalls guidance wrt this breaks the law. (Stonewall suggests people struggling with their identity should be free to pick and choose bathrooms at work).

[Patodp]

You can indeed ask for a female passport or drivers licence without a female GRCyou just need a letter from your gp.

The GRA is a symbolic tipping point really.

[Sanderz]

Great info Pato do you have a link or anything to the laws about bathrooms at work? Is it just at work that is true? Thank you

[Pratchet]

The point about Equality Act exemptions is that they are wholly dependent on them being offered by schools, shopping centres, services etc, and they are not required by law: for example, we can't force any institution to offer them. Under the pressure of self ID they would collapse.

[thebewilderness]

Having read numerous accounts by transgender identified males full of their anger at being escorted out of the women's room by security, and even being arrested for repeated violations, I have to say that the word "sharing" that PL is using does not mean what PL thinks it means.

Changing legal status on the birth certificate will have far reaching effects on society and this pretense that it is no biggie and everything has been fine so far is absurd.

[Patodp]

The more pressing issue is that TRAs are absolutely targeting the exemptions laid out in the EA2010 that permit service provided to exclude trans identified people on the basis of biological sex.

They want these eliminated.

As it stands the exemptions are not used anyway, because people don't realise they exist.

[Sanderz]

"Danielle" is in the US though, you can get a drivers licence as easily as a stick of gum over there can't you? hehe

[Patodp]

Lol true. But you can here too you just need to ask.

[Pratchet]

Paris is profoundly disingenuous. Explaining that he has been violating women's spaces for years is not a good argument for him and every other man to be able to do so in the future.

[CapnHaddock]

In the UK, I suspect GPs are very unlikely to write a letter for the likes of Muscato though I'm sure they did for Lees, given the extensive feminisation surgery.

I've become very aware of late that not having a GRC is a deliberate act of defiance by TRAs

[Pratchet]

Changing legal sex with ease will also have a major impact on crime statistics, prison services, women's refuges and sports. It's a truly terrible idea. It's an insane idea.

[Pratchet]

Haddock, I'm sure it is, especially for Paris, who could get one with ease.

[Ellenripleysalienbaby]

Thank you Pato.

And I assume that currently there are laws around who you can turn away from a women's refuge for example?

I too feel like there is symbolic tipping point around the GRA. If self id goes through, and 'woman' and 'man' become meaningless, it will become much harder to abolish the patriarchy.

[Sanderz]

I've become very aware of late that not having a GRC is a deliberate act of defiance by TRAs

That's a really interesting observation

[Pratchet]

Paris has twice tweeted that he doesn't have a GRC. It is part of his armoury of weapons. 'Look I don't have one and see how much I look like a lady'. He is definitely weaponising it.