To not feel guilty for cheating(154 Posts)
If it's making me happy and therefore by extension making my husband happier too because I am? It's with one person, we are both very clear on what we want out of it and it's just lovely. I don't love my husband any less or any differently. I know it can't carry on for ever and that's ok too. My question is am I a terrible person for not feeling guilty but instead being happy and fulfilled by both things?
I think OP is under no illusions that we all think she is a twat!
Ahh Bun how horrible for you to find this out. You are not worthless, not at all. As others have already said this is not your fault, not even a bit. It's all your husband. He is a bastard!
You are not a plank - you simply trusted your husband - the person who'd made vows to you- why wouldn't you. I'll say it again YOU done nothing wrong here.
Don't worry for now about the tears, let it out but please try not to torment yourself you don't deserve it.
Aww, thank you pickle, thank you for caring. And all other posters who sent their support. I think sweetrosie wrote she felt sad for me although it does not help. BY GOLLY it does. Until this happens no one would know how much a kind word means. Cheshire wrote advising not to cover for him, good sound advice, but I am covering up his appalling behaviour for ME. The shame, being pitied, and to stop my family being hurt by someone they love and trust. Cmon, no one wants to know their dad cheated, lied and shagged because their mum was not good in bed!!!
Today I had to say about the deceit of me seeing him off to work, and found out he used to drive off and park the car where I would not see it and hop on a train, so they could round off their day in a pub. See responsible driver - not ALL bad !!
Although he is obviously still upset about me STILL going on about it, yes I do go on and on and on, he managed to remember an occasion I had been particularly nasty and upset him.
Please advise - does not a two year cheating affair to your wife and mother of your children trump a nasty shouting row, with unkind things said a couple of decades ago? He could not remember what the row was about and what he had done that instigated it, funny that.
I think I am going mad.
Perhaps it’s me that’s not normal.
My heart eased when I read your kind words xxxx
I hope this is a joke post, or one just written to get a reaction from people rather than a reflection of what someone actually thinks.
Bun123 it sounds like the cheating was just part of a rather unkind/ selfish pattern.
Maybe suggest you should find someone and he's not allowed to mention it at all.
Or whenever he brings anything up, point out that if you should keep silent so should he.
Thanks Cheshire, I agree looking back there was a lot of selfish behaviour. Do you know what - what’s happened is horrible for me and has a terrible impact, however reading through threads and watching the news tonight (Syrian kids being maimed and bombed etc) and the story on Bake Off of the young mum dying of cancer, maybe it’s time to accept my tough luck, I was obviously a bad chooser and at least I now know my life partner was a bastard and weak and settle for the good things I have had and still have in life.
I can never forgive this, will remain sad, sad, sad but life must go on.
Just one thing - if anyone would be so kind - can anyone let me have the idiots guide to putting other posters ( my new friends and much appreciated support) in bold please. As simplistic as pos please, I’m a bit techno lacking!!
I rather like this posting lark, would never have done normally, but having just had a devastating blow HAD to reply to a twat claiming cheating was such good fun and spread such happiness and joy😔.
May name change soon as my nickname is based on a pet name from you know who! This Bun is now stale, hard and lacks spice 😁 xxxx
Thanks again xxxx
Find the star key - it's on a number. Mine is number 8
Press button with an arrow pointing upwards at the same time as the star to get this * In needs to be at the start of the name or work and at the end with no spaces.
It , and many other things, is explained under the reply box, near the emoji's
Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.
Whew thanks for that pickle. I’m thinking of telling him I am really sorry I did not know we had an open marriage 14 years ago. I could have had more fun! And cheshire you are right - I now owe him nothing.
Especially boring stuff like loyalty, honesty and consideration.😔
Bun123 it's usually the case that they're systematically selfish.
If he weren't he either wouldn't have done it or he would've come clean.
Do start your own thread though if you need more support, I'm pretty sure your posts are the reason MN have left this thread to stand.
Also, feel free to PM me if you'd rather.
Hope things get easier for you
Thanks cheshire and thanks for caring enough to stick with me. I WILL be ok, I love life too much not enjoy what good is still in my life. I’m still standing, I have lovely sons, daughters in law, and grandchildren, good friends, enjoy my grub and now I have Mumsnet. A full and rich life!
As a poster said it couldn’t have been so bad for him to stick it out all these years, and he certainly shows no signs of wanting to call it a day even now.
Thanks again xxxx
Bun you’re going to be ok. Keep your head up and put yourself and your happiness first
Bun just stumbled across this thread and want to send you some virtual .
As others have said, his affair was not your fault. You may have faults, but he could have addressed them like a mature, reasonable person. Instead, he chose to break his marriage vows and hurt you so deeply. Find your anger and never blame yourself for your husband's failings.
Yes, OP, you are unreasonable. Tell your husband you are having the affair to make things fair and equal. Perhaps see if your affair makes him as happy as it makes you, eh? As well as giving the man you say you love the opportunity to decide for himself whether or not he wants to be cheated on.
* By the way that grandson is now a teenager. Which shows time does not heal a betrayal*
Although the event was years ago, your discovery of it is a fresh wound. There's been no time for it to heal.
I'll share my experience, i found out in one if the worst ways (after having been told it was all in my head). Lack of emotional support from my side, drove him elsewhere apparently. In actuality he was physically abusive and I kept my distance as a result but he never recognised that part of the truth. He was always the only victim. We had a child together so i tried to make the marriage work. The cheating was oddly more painful than the abuse. So your heart break is valid to feel so painful. The second time I wouldnt allow myself to feel the same hurt, because I knew if i stayed, it was a risk. Anyways....time absolutely did heal the wound, BUT there was a huge scar.
(My marriage ended, due to the abuse, last year.)
It's up to you if you can forgive and forget. If you're religious and want a divorce based on adultery, then you only have 6 months from finding out, to file. If you dont want to split you need to really figure out how best to heal and minimise the scar.
@bun123 please go and see a solicitor and find out your legal and financial position. Separating need not mean your kids lose out, and quite frankly they would never want their mum to sacrifice her own long term happiness for their inheritance. You only have one life, so live it!
I hope you can value yourself enough to leave him/kick him out. You need to believe that you do deserve to be happy. He is a selfish lying bastard, and does not deserve your continuing loyalty. Plus, you will both pick at each other and your home will be toxic. Get out. Live. And be happy.
Hi there. I think I will just keep posting until I’m stopped. Or until “it has run its course” which is the answer he gave me when I asked why it had ended. Of course I was desperately hoping for the reply that it had ended because he loved me so much and realised what he could lose😢. Mind you he is not slow and two years is a long while to come to a conclusion, so no hope there.
Anyway thanks for the further posts -
Yolo Of course you are right. We have a properly done will, which leaves everything to each other and then to the kids and any offspring they have. My fear is that if I die first he could hook up with someone new and they could inherit all, as a marriage over rules all other wills. This was never a worry for me before as it would seem preposterous for him to want someone else and would always do the right thing by the kids. Obviously now I am not so sure, and have always believed - once a cheat - always a cheat. So do intend to change the will so that on my death, although he could live in the house, my half goes straight to my sons. We also have given the children the right to have power of attorney in the will. Just in case he goes off with a stripper in his 90’s !!!
LiftedHigh 💐 your experience sounds worse than mine and your words are so wise. No I am not religious- I just try to be decent, kind and not hurt anyone if I can help it. Just bog standard muddling through I suppose. I hope your life works out well, you deserve it xxx
As far as the pain goes, as I am sure many know, I feel sore and bruised even though the hurt was all mental/emotional.
Fabaunt and AlargeGin yes I will keep my head up, and I have certainly found my anger.
It’s strange it’s the little things I miss and will miss so much - the shared silly jokes and phrases, sitting down enjoying our favourite programmes, finding little treats when shopping or a bargain which always made me feel triumphant.
Your posts have also helped me articulate how I feel. For example I told him it was a shame I didn’t know 14 years ago and I could have had a fulfilling relationship. I said “I have had opportunity’s you know”. He said of course, you are an attractive person. I looked attractive then too, red eyed, tearful and a nose of snot! I was pleased for a crumb of self esteem, being cheated on diminishes you as a person.
Thanks again, I never knew what really was meant by “the kindness of strangers “. I do now xxxxx
@bun123 you sound so resigned to living the rest of your life with him, with the misery, the mistrust, the betrayal and hurt. Why is this?
Is your self esteem so low that you can't see any alternatives? You do need to get angry. It is never too late to make changes for the better you know. I realise you are still in the shock phase, but you don't need to make any decisions now except to take each day at a time. But exploring options is sensible, so you can make informed decisions in the weeks and months to come.
It makes me so sad to think that a strong, sassy woman like you is accepting and resigning herself to unhappiness for the rest of her life. It is time to put YOU first.
YoLo. You are so right. I need a kick up the arse. Part of me is wallowing in my pity party.
I would not have believed the effect this could have on me. The physical pain and feelings of worthlessness.
I know I cannot sustain this level of pain and grief. I have always been an optimist (he is a miserable moaner). I will come through. As I said before, I am hoping for when I feel nothing but contempt and don’t hurt any more. It will come, just need time. I look at him and don’t even like him anymore, and that is sad - after nearly 50 years.
It’s the bloody waste.
Thanks for the robust support xxxxx
@Bun123 when I had the epiphany that should have ended my marriage, I was equivocal. I didn't want to throw away so many decades of being together, I was frightened of change, of being on my own, of being the one to end it. I was wavering, even though i knew the relationship was toxic to the core, and that I had to get out to protect me and my DC. I was just scared. But lovely MNers helped me see that I should stop looking back and start looking forward. It didn't matter what had gone before, or the poor decisions I made in the past, regrets, etc,. What mattered was what I did NOW. How I wanted my life to be for the rest of it. Yes, I wasted 20 years on this man. But I was not going to waste the next 20.
I wanted to be single for the rest of my life, as I was done with men! And I was for a while and loved it. Now I have the most wonderful partner and could not be happier.
You can be too.
Perhaps start your own thread too. Your posts on this one will get lost, and there are so many great MNera who can help and support you.
Do him a favour and leave your Husband. I hope you're dropped from a great height and land on your head.
I would want to know if one of parents had cheated on the other as then I could understand what they are going through and help support them. That’s just me - maybe other people have different views.
But exploring options is sensible, so you can make informed decisions in the weeks and months to come.
Yes, even if you decide to stay. It'd be a well explored decision, and you'd enter it from a position of strength and choice, rather resignation.
YoLo and LiftedHigh and others. You have given me a lot to think about and this has helped.
I know for certain I can never forgive him. I do feel I am too old to start again. (Think 50 years marriage,rounding it up by a few months, and knowing him years before and married in my 20’s). I know I should be on gransnet, just a bit too “naice” and cosy for me in the main, love the humour, straight talking and diversity of MN.
I don’t feel like starting another thread at the moment. I realise this will peter out eventually (soon?) and I always have the option to do so in the future. As I said have never posted before, lurked and enjoyed posts for ages saw that nasty, stupid post from OP and had to spill out all the hurt that I had been caused by the very thing she thought was acceptable, even commendable and received love, support and help.
Best thing I have ever done.
There does come a time when your options are limited through age. Kicking him out would result in less financial security, important in old age, possibly having to give up my home, the home we have lived in for over 40 years, the home I bought my kids up in, welcomed our grandchildren, had parties, Christmases, had friends round, visited by my mum dad, - long gone 😕 had good times and bad, struggled when money was tight, but always our home. Also my final gift to my children(fingers crossed) which is something possibly only my generation have the luxury of doing for most ordinary people.
Why should I lose this when he has caused me to lose so much - memories, self esteem, trust, certainty, mental peace etc.
If I had known what was going to happen 10, 15 or 20 years ago it would have been a different story.
Which reminds me, churning it over constantly in my head, I can’t make all the dates tally, I now think it was for much longer than I was told,and who knows if this was the only one. It’s difficult to make sense of a web of lies 😊. For some crazy reason it’s important that I know - so I can torture myself further. Strangely I want every detail. Is this common?
Apart from sneaking, sex and lies, what really hurts is the emotional closeness, the fact he may have loved her. During one of my tearful outbursts I told him I could not bear to think of him discussing me and my shortcomings ( how I know another woman would enjoy that, that type of lowlife anyway) and he assured me he only spoke of me “in a complimentary way”. Even then it gave me a (mental) grin. Why wouldn’t she say - if she’s so great why the hell are you here (in my mates house/room/flat) shagging the arse off me! He must think I’m simple. (Spoiler - I’m not)
Nice to end on a laugh 😆. Thanks all xxxxxx
Surely you should be asking your husband this question instead of strangers. But you won't because you know the answer and that would be that your husband would not agree.
I also think you do feel guilty and trying to convince yourself that you don't.
So grow up have a conversation with your husband and let him decide whether or not he wants to be with his cheating wife.
Bun just one more thing to think about before you settle for financial security, and I do understand the appeal, if he becomes ill in old age and need your care, will you be prepared to give it?
Probably ALargeGinPlease. I have thought about this, and the other way round.
No one knows the future, so a hyperthetical question. Although an interesting one. We promised to love and cherish each other, forsaking all others, in sickness and in health etc. Well vows were easily broken, by him, so it depends what the circumstances are at the time if he becomes needing care. I feel I really don’t owe him anything so anything would be done out of basic human kindness to another sick person, but I would not consider it to be my binding duty at all costs to me and out of love. And I have learnt that I cannot ever rely on his unconditional love.
@Bun123 Have you thought about separating but still live in the same property? That would give you the ability to start living your own life and seek happiness by yourself, without the upheaval of moving out. Or that he should be the one to move out?
Anyway, there are many practical and financial options that are different to remaining together in a marriage where you have to live with his betrayal. This is what you can discuss with a solicitor, so I'd urge you to get that advice and then think about what is best for YOU. Going to an appointment and having a conversation about options does not commit you to any decision or course of action. It's just information gathering.
YoLo thank you. As ever good practical advice. An ounce of help is worth a pound of pity. Other ancient homilies are available!
Yesterday was only two weeks since I found out. He spent the next few days convincing me it was my fault. Didn’t work of course. Shouting at me even acting like the injured party. Justifying himself saying hateful things.
Due to being old (I hate writing that) I have less options. I am for sure never leaving my home, if he lived elsewhere this would have a cost implication and our combined savings would be insufficient to maintain two households ( to be honest I never budgeted for finding out my husband was a lying cheating rat after 49 years) and I will be buggered if I am going to live in poverty or relative poverty for my final years.
Sorry I forgot to address the fact that you had given me practical advice to face these issues. My head is still all over the place. I think we will stay together, living in the same house. I can see no other way. There will be no intimacy, and by that I mean no hugging, kissing, love you’s, affection, phone calls to check he is ok and when he will be home, no our poor you’s when things go wrong and shall I make you a nice cup of tea love etc etc. I will still cook meals ( when I feel like it) and he will still put the bins out. We have separate bedrooms and he goes into the other room to watch sport. It’s a bundle of laughs here.
Financially we have completely shared joint accounts. I think I would be wise to do something about this, separate accounts, split fairly. I thank you for making me aware of this when all I can deal with are my emotions at the moment.
He has now changed - he is meek and regretful, desperate to get his old cosy life back and anxious to please. This cuts no ice. I have been too deeply hurt, I cry every day, can’t sleep, food tastes like dust and the pain does not lessen in fact it deepens. I have not got dressed this week and have cancelled a couple of arrangements with friends as I can be bothered. Will pull my socks up after the weekend and have to see a couple of mates who I cannot let down.
Thanks again xxxxxxx
@Bun123 He is regretful at getting found out, not for the pain he has caused you.
You sound very low right now, but you also strike me as a woman who won't be kept down for long. All strength to you. I hope you feel able to open up to your friends and seek their support. Don't keep his dirty little secret for him. You need and deserve your friends' support far more than he deserves to keep his pride. Remember, you did nothing wrong.
Stay strong @Bun123 and keep posting if it helps you at all.
I don’t know about a terrible person, but you do sound morally confused. Betraying the trust of someone who loves you in such a basic and huge fashion, all the deception involved in that ( including of yourself by the sound of it) is not okay. This applies whether they know about it or not. How about this scenario. You have stolen a huge sum of money from a friend who trusts you. To date, friend has not missed said money. Does this make it okay? Of course it doesn’t, and you have done way worse than just steal money from the person who should be able to trust you more than anyone else in the world. My advice would be, completely daunting as it is, to end the affair right now. Confess to your husband. The rest is up to him. He may very well dump you I’m afraid. Regardless, the way you living right now cannot continue. It isn’t right and I think you know it or you wouldn’t be here asking about it. I probably sound hideously judge. Hard not to, but I hope I don’t. Sincerely hope all comes out well.
My post is directed at notanaccidentaltouri
OP.. If you have no story, can't tell a story or make something small a story, then wtf are you doing calling yourself a ='journalist'. making people spill their guts to a 'kindred spirit' instead of a supremely untalenteed user who could not make their OP better than a just17 problem age letter. Fuck right off.
@Bun - I’ve had a long marriage and appreciate I’m not in your position. I don’t think the last 50 years are a lie and although he was childish when caught (‘it wasn’t my fault”!) remember he still confirmed you are attractive. I don’t think his affair was that important to him (gave the old dog an ego boost) - though I realise that isn’t a comfort. He’d clearly forgotten about it to the extent that the affair ended up getting discovered. I think you are being very sensible and I would do the same as you and stay in my own house on my own terms - it’s still very raw. Set the pace and be kind to yourself - you are worth it!
I think your husband is trying to make himself feel better about what he’s done by saying things like the last 40 years were just “making the best of it”. It’s much easier for him to process ending a relationship that was of no value than one that was built on love and trust. He’s being extremely selfish saying things like that to make himself feel better but which will make you feel even worse. It was a totally unnecessary thing to say.
Thanks @heidivodca and @user1480880826 and all others. Concerning getting comfort from my friends by telling them - I honestly think the dearest friend would be getting pissed off with my continual misery-fest. Other people have their own life and problems, and self absorption is not an endearing trait.
Posting on here fulfils the need to vent, rant, try to make sense of it and tell my sorry tale. And what have I received in return? Kindness, understanding, good practical help, empathy and good solid shoulder to shoulder support. All the things you look for in a partner I suppose.
Without you I would have nothing.
Can’t believe I am on AIBU - surely someone should come along and tell me I’m a sad old git, should get over it and there are plenty worse off. Still maybe that is what a partner is for?
Regards saying I was attractive still, I think being attractive is much more than looks, particularly as time takes its toll. I was happy, confident, smiled a lot, fun and good company. I am now miserable, tearful, shake a bit, full of pain and self pity, confused and don’t know who I am any more. The party invites are stacking up!😆
I read a lot of posts, betrayal and hurt feature a lot and I cannot imagine how women cope with this with young children to shield from the hurt and still have to work and deal with financial worries. My heart goes out to them and the courage they show.
Bless you YoLo - I * will* stay strong. He is not going to destroy me.
It’s interesting seeing the different stages he is going through- anger, blaming and justification, then self pity and minimalising and sorrow for being found out. I think the next stage is going to be impatience with my constant dwelling on it and refusal to accept and move on and my not realising how bad this has made him feel. But then this is more evidence of how unreasonable I am. Cos he loves me as a friend and it was only sex and excitement. What every woman longs to hear!
Please anyone with experience can you tell me whether it is normal to want to hear every detail. Or is it just me? Today I asked him if he made some excuse to shower immediately on coming home, in case I could smell her perfume or sex on him. His reply was a pained face and a shouted “ I expect so” and stomping off. Wasn’t it kind of him to try to spare me the hurt and suspicion at the time?
Anyway, this show will run and run (for me at least!). I am not going to make a fake apology for such a long post, it’s done me good and in the words of the master “I wouldn’t have done it if I regretted it”.
Thanks again xxxxxx
@Bun123 You go, woman! Strong and feisty. Remember this when you feel tearful. You can survive this and be stronger for it.
I often see this resource recommended here www.chumplady.com
It might be useful to you.
Oh YoLo chumplady is great! Just read a bit - “when does the pain stop” and some contributions from fellow “chumps” - inspiring and educational. Also some quite funny.
I do like funny. Also had a read of a thread on MN on a poster fancying Rees-Mogg. Hilarious.
Also done a little post this morning saying how lovely the thread was (it was about babies). By the time I had written the post and it was posted the whole thread had turned nasty. My post looked like I was taking the pee or that I was a complete idiot. Gave me a grin!
Anyway - breakthrough- I have found out the next stage in his repertoire- sulking. Tried nasty, tried nice - now sulking and hard done by. Also irritated.
Strong and feisty- my mantra.
Thanks xxxxx. No crying tomorrow 🤞
@Bun123 glad you are starting to see his behaviour for what it is. Soon, he will get annoyed with you that you haven't got over it yet, that you haven't moved on and forgiven him, that you keep bringing it up and harping on and trying to punish him and why can't you just stop talking about it...
It will all be about him and his feelings. He may even suggest you are being nasty and abusing him. Everyone makes mistakes, right? What is wrong with you, that you can't just drop it now? You must have a vindictive and spiteful character flaw if you are intent on making him feel bad all the time...blah blah blah me me me.
All the while refusing to acknowledge the hurt he has caused, and that it is still fresh for you because you've only just found out about his lies and betrayal, when he has known for years.
You need to get your 'angry woman' in gear to deal with this bollocks.
Dear YoLo get your crystal ball and set up on the pier - because you are spot on 😊
He is at exactly this stage. He does not get how this has affected me and definitely feels I am making too much of this, he feels like the injured party. And HE is unhappy. Oh dear, never mind.
I feel hurt in so many ways. The betrayal, the disbelief, the sadness and the loss of everything I believed was us was one thing. His reaction of attack, telling me I was to blame, dragging up times I made mistakes- nothing like this I hasten to add, at times I thought I would lose my mind.
I alternate between anger and misery. He asked yesterday what would be our future. I just had to say “ I don’t know”. Bleak is my educated guess.
I told him I did not love him anymore, which is a sad thing to say. He said he still loved me - the only reply to that was “ you have a strange way of showing it”.
I told him I did not accept it was my fault ( please add sound effects of hysterical tears, sobbing and the hurling of remarks like “ every time I look at you I can see you in bed with her, kissing, touching, fingering her and her giving you a blow job ( I have never pretended to be be a lady) and telling her you love her ( in my opinion you can’t get a woman in bed without sweet talk, and he never contradicted me) and IMO some things are just for couples- and in nearly 50 years I have never said I love you to anyone other than him or my children and grandchildren..
Anyway we went to bed (separately) and this morning he came down, face like an arse and banging about, throwing papers etc and I carried on having a “ pass the salt, have you seen the news etc sought of conversation “
Don’t know what to do 😔
Thanks for sticking with me xxxxx
If you really don’t feel guilty, tell your husband.
I can promise you, nobody is going to come out of this with a smile on their face.
You’re a mug, your lover is enjoying extra sex with no strings, your husband is being conned and your lovers wife will suffer for your selfish actions. Trust me, just leave your poor husband.
Bun, it might be in your best interest to stop interacting with him for a while. Look up the grey rock technique. It might give you some space mentally to think about how you want to proceed.
If this is real then yes you're U selfish and immature.
I can't relate to someone who thinks it's fine to lie to your loved ones
@Bun123 good advice from CraftyYankee there.
It looks like his behaviour NOW is killing whatever might be left of your relationship since the revelation of his historic infidelity.
Can you spend the next few months really concentrating on YOU. Sideline him and just focus on your needs, mental, physical, spiritual (if that's your thing). I don't know what your usual hobbies or routines are, but self care can include joining local classes (yoga, a walking group, cookery, whatever), enjoying lunch out with your own friends, seeing family by yourself, seeing a counsellor, reading books and other helpful resources like the SurvivingInfidelity website, buying yourself flowers every week, having a weekend hotel break with a friend, treating yourself to a mani/pedi/new hairstyle, etc etc. I'm sure you can think of better ideas. My point is that you should spend time on you, looking after your own wellbeing, gathering your strength and self esteem, and working through all the mental headfuck (with professional help ideally), and then you will be in a better place to make decisions about your future. I reiterate my advice upthread too about the information gathering.
In short, forget about him for a while. Live your life, regroup, recover, get strong and then move forward (in whatever way you decide).
The kind of attitude that gets women a bad name! I find myself hoping that he's doing the same, hence the real cause of his happiness
You're not BU to feel no guilt. But you are BU for cheating.
Tell your DP. He won't be happy. He can then find someone who does make him happy. This relationship isn't just about your happiness.
Well. Spot onCraftyYankee and Yolo. He does need to be ignored because interacting with him is not helping, adds nothing to my life and to be honest adds to the pain.
I need to start to envisage a life where he is not important to me. Just writing that makes me cry.
Thanks for the advice. Promise I will act on it.
Today we have been civil. I think he thinks it will “blow over” given time.
He has broken my heart. It will never “blow over”.
Tomorrow going out with group of friends for meal. Without him. On the plus side I have lost weight - on the debit I look a hundred years older.
Thanks again xxxxx
Join the discussion
Registering is free, quick, and means you can join in the discussion, watch threads, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.Get started »
Please login first.