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Top 50 women role models - gender fluid

(14 Posts)
MrsCaecilius Thu 05-Oct-17 12:19:05

A link to the launch of the top 50 women role models in business just popped up in my LinkedIn as I know one of the (impressive) women it features.

AIBU to be riled at the inclusion of Pippa/Phil Bunce, someone who says “I like to be Phil one day and Pippa the next, using different forms of dress and make-up to do so.... I am straight, have been married for 20 years and have 2 children”

He likes dressing up so he’s a female role model????

JigglyTuff Thu 05-Oct-17 12:25:58

He's not a fucking female role model - he's an autogynephilic MAN

gunsandbanjos Thu 05-Oct-17 12:36:10

YANBU, what a farce.

misscockerspaniel Thu 05-Oct-17 13:07:27

I agree with you, this is a joke.

But, the BBC website has a BBC 100 Women feature. Today, it is featuring neuroscientist and tech entrepreneur Dr Vivien Ming in a short film entitled "I lost my male privilege". She transitioned in her 30s. Sorry, I can't do links, but it is worth watching. So, I am sort of conflicted because Dr Ming is a good role model and I can see why she has been included on that particular list.

MrsCaecilius Thu 05-Oct-17 13:39:54

Spaniel I'd have some sympathy for someone who's transitioned... possibly. But not for someone who chooses on a day to day basis which gender they prefer that day and whose only nod to 'becoming' that gender is fancy dress!

Jiggly I had to look up 'autogynephilic' but I think you've hit the nail on the head.


JigglyTuff Thu 05-Oct-17 13:55:49

miscockerspaniel - I feel hugely sorry for Vivienne Ming having such intense gender dysphoria. But I'm mystified why you think she is a good role model? Who for?

dinosaursandtea Thu 05-Oct-17 14:12:40

Personally, I think it's terrific. We're at the point where if we didn't have trans women on the list, it would be a bit weird.

MrsCaecilius Thu 05-Oct-17 14:15:36

Dinosaur the point is, he isn’t a Transwoman, he’s a conventional man who wears a skirt once in a while. That is not the same as someone who has ‘become’ a different gender in any way!

morningrunner Thu 05-Oct-17 14:19:51

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

misscockerspaniel Thu 05-Oct-17 14:25:43

Why do I think she is a good role model? Because she is a neuroscientist? Because I regret not taking up opportunities that would have made a massive difference to my life and so I am in awe of, and a bit jealous of, people who have achieved something good beyond the norm? Anyone who studies and works hard is surely a good role model, regardless of gender.

But I don't want to detract from MrsCaecilius' post. I agree with her and I too had to look up autogynphilic when I saw it mentioned on MN a month or so ago. MN is certainly an education grin

CaoNiMartacus Thu 05-Oct-17 14:26:58

I'm looking forward to seeing the equivalent Top 50 Male Role Models list, no doubt peppered by examples of trans-men.

* tumbleweed *

* more tumbleweed *

* tumbleweed for eternity *

JigglyTuff Thu 05-Oct-17 14:30:32

What is the point of these lists? To inspire girls into thinking that they can get to the top of their chosen professions, to inspire girls who, despite doing better at school and being over-represented at university, are still lagging behind in the workplace when it comes to promotion and pay?

Or is it about demonstrating to boys that if they want to identify as women, if they wait until they're at the top of their profession, that isn't going to hold them back?

Because I can't see how choosing a transwoman as a role model says anything to girls other than however well you do, your male colleague may suddenly decide he's a woman and take all the accolades that were designed to inspire you.

I can't see how that benefits anyone other than validating men who've transitioned to women.

Are there any male lists that have included a transman? I don't think there are

JigglyTuff Thu 05-Oct-17 15:06:14

Dr Ming is also the 2nd transwoman on the BBC's 100 women list. So 2% of their list were born men when estimates are that 0.6% of the US population identify as trans.

I don't find that inspiring, I find it profoundly depressing

dontslouchdarling Thu 05-Oct-17 15:22:22


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