To (privately) disapprove of my friend having a cleaner

(537 Posts)
Unami Mon 29-Apr-13 16:08:54

Ok. This may be long, but I will do my best to explain where I am coming from. My friend has a cleaner and I privately disapprove. I would never make an issue of it to her, or even bring it up. It was brought up by another friend when we were at her place for drinks. She was a bit hmm about it, and it led to a big discussion, but I didn't say anything committal. I do recognise that she can hire a cleaner if she likes. If she likes she can hire a troupe of jugglers and have them juggle in her kitchen all day, if she likes. It's none of my business, I get that.

But I still privately disapprove. AIBU?

Her cleaner comes to her two bedroom flat twice a week and gives it a full clean, and that apparently includes hoovering all carpets and upholdstry, dusting all surfaces, polishing wood, sweeping and cleaning wooden floor in hall and kitchen, emptying waste bins in the house and taking kitchen bins round the back, cleaning mirrors, cleaning the inside of windows, full clean of the kitchen including inside the fridge, full clean of bathroom. Once a month she also gets the oven cleaned, extractor fan cleaned and polished (!?), cupboards dusted inside and out. She says she pays £45 a week for this.

It's just her in the flat. She doesn't have kids and doesn't live with her bf.

Here's my perspective. People say that having a cleaner is just like hiring any other service provider. But it's not. Domestic cleaners clean intimate, private parts of our houses, and clean up our bodily mess, and it's low paid, low status work. Yes, people hire gardeners and window cleaners, but these are roles which require specialist equipment and insurance, and they only work on the outside and periphery of your home. Yes, I recognise that cleaners are employed in offices I use, cafes I eat in and so on, but it's not really the same either. Most commerical cleaners are employed as staff and so get holiday pay, sick pay, NI etc. Agency workers don't have it so good, and I disagree with the terms of their employment too. But domestic cleaners are often paid cash in hand because employers think they are doing them a favour. But they have no holiday, sick pay - what happens if they have an accident in the house they are cleaning in. I know there are some well organised small cleaning companies, but I think they are the exception.

But most of all, I just feel like my friend is just being lazy or thinks she's too good to pick up after herself. If you are elderly or disabled or immobile, then I see nothing wrong with getting the help that you need. Likewise, if you have a busy family, and don't want to be stuck being the person who picks up after everyone else - get the help you need and show the family how much your time costs. But if you have a quiet life and are fit and healthy, I don't see why you think it's ok to have someone over to clean your toilet. I also think that people who say they are so impossibly busy with work that they can't lift a duster once a week really ought to think about cutting back their ft hours, and give others access to the surplus of work they have.

I'm not going to have a go at my friend. But I just don't think it's right.

givemeaclue Mon 29-Apr-13 16:10:31

Yabu.

Why do you care?

D0GWithAYoni Mon 29-Apr-13 16:10:33

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Trill Mon 29-Apr-13 16:12:10

YABU

It is only unreasonable to have a cleaner if you:
1 - treat them badly
or
2 - then go on to complain that you can't afford other things

As long as you treat your cleaner well and can afford to pay (or are happy to make the sacrifices that you make in order to be able to afford it) then there is nothing wrong with it.

UnChartered Mon 29-Apr-13 16:12:15

if i was her i'd worry more about the friends i had, not how i chose to spend my own cash hmm

I am afraid that I think you are being very unreasonable. If she can afford a cleaner, and it frees her up to do other things that she'd prefer doing, then that is absolutely her right. Some people enjoy house work - clearly she isn't one of them, so why should she do something she doesn't enjoy if she can afford to get someone to do it for her?

rubyslippers Mon 29-Apr-13 16:12:37

Jesus that's a loooong post

YABU

I don't understand the sneering that goes on about cleaners

Your last sentence about cutting down working hours to have more time to clean made me snort

Thegingerpig Mon 29-Apr-13 16:12:55

Maybe she just doesn't like cleaning? If she can afford it, then why shouldn't she have a cleaner?

Mintyy Mon 29-Apr-13 16:12:55

Did it have to be so long?

I would be concerned if a friend of mine thought her flat needed to be cleaned so thoroughly.

Oh and yes yabu.

Trill Mon 29-Apr-13 16:13:24

I also think that people who say they are so impossibly busy with work that they can't lift a duster once a week really ought to think about cutting back their ft hours, and give others access to the surplus of work they have.

This is ridiculous. Why would it be better to have someone else paid to do my job, and for me to do dusting, than to pay someone to do dusting and I'll get on with my job?

Alligatorpie Mon 29-Apr-13 16:14:40

I have a cleaner - she is wonderful. I love coming home to a clean house. And I don't give a shit what you think.

Tee2072 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:14:44

ODFOD

YABU

So what if she is being lazy, its not like she is asking you to clean her flat. confused

givemeaclue Mon 29-Apr-13 16:15:09

You also sound a bit jealous

Francagoestohollywood Mon 29-Apr-13 16:15:15

Oh, pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeee

Goldenbear Mon 29-Apr-13 16:15:17

YANBU, I agree with you.

PumpkinPositive Mon 29-Apr-13 16:15:37

Is this a wind up? confused

musickeepsmesane Mon 29-Apr-13 16:15:41

glad you are not my friend. Are you for real or just stirring?

IneedAsockamnesty Mon 29-Apr-13 16:16:06

Yabu.

Its a good thing her cleaner should be declaring income ad should also be insured.

Your friend is putting money back into the economy.

Get a grip.

Tee2072 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:16:10

Also:

TLDR

Emsmaman Mon 29-Apr-13 16:16:33

YABU. It's her money and I presume she's not standing behind the cleaner whipping her? Also re badly paid - cleaners in London often get £10/11 per hour so more than many office jobs!

The only time I've been judgy about getting a cleaner was when my NCT teacher told us about one of her former students who took out a loan to pay a cleaner when she had the baby. I do get judgy about getting into debt for a luxury and for someone else to be condoning and suggesting it is a good idea to others!

ApocalypseThen Mon 29-Apr-13 16:16:36

I'd be all over that if I could afford it. Having a cleaner do a thorough job twice a week is something she wants to spend her own money on. If she treats her cleaner properly and adds to her enjoyment of life, why not?

Would you like her to give you the money instead or something?

KellyElly Mon 29-Apr-13 16:16:40

If you don't like cleaning/can't be arsed/have better things to do than clean and you can afford a cleaner you hire one. I don't see your point at all. YABU.

JakeBullet Mon 29-Apr-13 16:16:51

YABU, I really really struggle with housework despite being a SAHM currently. I would LOVE a cleaner and would employ one if I could afford it.

Groovee Mon 29-Apr-13 16:16:57

confused I think you need to find a hobby to stop you overthinking your poor friend.

UnChartered Mon 29-Apr-13 16:17:23

could this be one of those reverse AIBUs?

OP, you know a heck of a lot about how much the cleaner does...

EMS23 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:17:39

That's an odd moral ground you occupy. Are you lonely up there?!

rubyslippers Mon 29-Apr-13 16:18:13

What go your acronyms mean tee?

Dawndonna Mon 29-Apr-13 16:18:19

Gosh, you must be bored. Oh, and I feel sorry for your friend, she's probably unaware of just how judgemental a cow you are.
hmm

forevergreek Mon 29-Apr-13 16:18:24

We have a cleaner. It's a one bed ( with children). We pay £15 per hr, which I don't think is a pittance. 6 hrs is £90, many people don't get £90 for a full days work let alone half a day.

She does the things we don't have time for, there's no shit cleaning as we aren't in the habit of leaving shit all over the place!

Deadhamsterssmell Mon 29-Apr-13 16:18:39

YABU

Why does it bother you so much? Presumably the cleaner is free to leave if she finds this work to beneath her. Have you ever thought that some people are happy in their jobs as domestic cleaners?

tomatoplantproject Mon 29-Apr-13 16:18:39

Yabu. It is up to your friend to make a decision about how she spends her money and the terms/hours that she has arranged with her cleaner. If she takes great pleasure in having a clean house why should she not pay someone else to do it?

For info I have a cleaner. I have also been a cleaner back in my youth so am perfectly capable of keeping a clean house if i have the time. I have a 6mo and I had naively assumed I would have plenty of time when she napped during the day to clean. She doesn't nap and I spent my days stressing about how I could carve 15 minutes out to eg clean the bathroom and constantly seeing all the dirt. We have the money to hire a cleaner and I pay her a 'fair' rate for the hours she does (well over min wage). It makes a difference to me and is worth the money.

Personally I would think twice a week if you live on your own a bit much, but I would be far judgier of her if she lived in a complete pigsty.

PrinceRogersNelson Mon 29-Apr-13 16:18:52

YABU and judgemental.

Manchesterhistorygirl Mon 29-Apr-13 16:19:12

I have a cleaner, she is glad of the cash and I am glad of the time she frees up and having a clean house. You are being unreasonable, ludicrously so.

Your friend may work very hard and also appreciate having a clean house and I'm damn sure her cleaner is very glad of the money.

Unami Mon 29-Apr-13 16:19:36

It's not a wind up. I'm not stirring.

I am a good friend and would never do or say anything judgemental to my friend or try and make her feel bad. That's why I'm trying to explore my inner reservations about this on MN. Sorry the post was so long.

I just can't shake the feeling that picking up and cleaning up after yourself is one of life's levellers. I don't see why someone should feel their time is so special that they can farm it out to someone for a few quid an hour, and not be concerned about that person's other work/income.

And yes, I do believe that if more people with high earning jobs worked fewer hours, then there would be more good work and cash to go around for everybody.

Tee2072 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:19:40

ODFOD = Oh Do Fuck Off Dear
YABU = I think you know this one, ruby grin
TLDR = Too long, didn't read.

RememberingMyPFEs Mon 29-Apr-13 16:19:49

ODFOD - YAB*UTTERLY*U!

Oh, before you go, can I find out where you are, cos my cleaner only comes once a week for £40 so I'd love to know where I can find someone to come twice for £45.

Lj8893 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:19:53

Wtf?!?

So she has chosen to hire a cleaner and pay them a wage, therefore helping keep this particular cleaner in business?! And this is wrong because....??

kerala Mon 29-Apr-13 16:19:56

Is this thread serious or a joke? DH and I used to work in the City and had really really long hours - often most evenings and at least one day of the weekend. So OP would advocate we should have spent our 1 day off together scrubbing the flat, when we both had very high salaries, rather than pay someone else to do it? Madness.

LaurieFairyCake Mon 29-Apr-13 16:20:30

You've clearly given this a lot of thought.

Thought which could be better employed by doing something else.

hth

Tee2072 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:20:31

I suppose you think the Queen or David Cameron or President Obama pick up after themselves?

What colour is the sky in your world? Is it pretty?

Thepursuitofhappiness Mon 29-Apr-13 16:20:34

Is this a joke??? Of course she is fully entitled to have a cleaner. I think you are doing domestic cleaners a disservice by belittling their work by saying unless you are ill etc you shouldn't get cleaners and talk of them 'cleaning our bodily mess' In these times of high unemployment some people rely on these cleaning jobs for income.

'Give others the surplus work they have'... So you suggest a doctor and a cleaner swap jobs for a few hours a week to redistribute?? Hmm...

She has clearly put a value on her time and decided it is worth it. Absolutely nothing wrong with that.

ouryve Mon 29-Apr-13 16:20:45

YABU.

It's her business, not yours.

caramelwaffle Mon 29-Apr-13 16:21:09

Well of course you are being unreasonable.

Reverse Aibu's are arse-aches - unless the subject matter is funny or a major jest.

mrspaddy Mon 29-Apr-13 16:21:21

I actually think YANBU and if it help to say it here than in RL then what is wrong with that. I do think it is lazy. But I wouldn't tell her that either. I earn a very good salary but love the satisfaction of running my home.. but then I am home early in the day..live and let live and all that. She obviously isn't worried what people think and it's her money.

Caitycat Mon 29-Apr-13 16:21:32

I would love to have a cleaner, I hate cleaning but love having a clean house. I would not be in the least bit worried about what anyone thought about it. I love my job and I love my leisure time and would happily spend the time the cleaner saved me doing more of either activity - no way would I cut back working hours to do a chore that I hate if I could afford to pay someone who was happy to do it for me. Yabvu

HazleNutt Mon 29-Apr-13 16:21:35

YABU and what Trills said. How does it make sense for me to cut down my hours so I can clean myself, a job I don't enjoy? Because the cleaner would be better off unemployed?

"But most of all, I just feel like my friend is just being lazy or thinks she's too good to pick up after herself." And?

Lj8893 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:21:46

Oh and I'm sure the many cleaners of this world wouldn't do the job if they really hated it?

I have many friends who earn a good living cleaning, and they enjoy it! Shock horror!!!

UnChartered Mon 29-Apr-13 16:22:03

Laurie

grin

pickledginger Mon 29-Apr-13 16:22:35

So she pays someone a decent amount per hour to clean her flat? Providing regular employment? Damn her.

flippinada Mon 29-Apr-13 16:22:37

I think you have far too much time on your hands.

In the time you've spent fretting about this you could have done something enjoyable or useful.

Bedtime1 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:22:59

Strange. You seem jealous. I'm sure there's loads of things she doesn't approve of with you, one being your attitude.

caramelwaffle Mon 29-Apr-13 16:23:02

Cash on delivery or cash on service does not mean a person does not know their way around a self assessment tax form.

Ledkr Mon 29-Apr-13 16:23:06

Sounds lush. I'd love my house to be that clean.
Are you a little bit well jel do you think?

Op - you have way to much time on your hands!! Do you over-analyse everything?? Life must be really tiring for you!

ilovexmastime Mon 29-Apr-13 16:23:51

YABU. I don't think I've ever seen such a strange post!

Ledkr Mon 29-Apr-13 16:24:16

I also bet she couldn't give a fig whether you care or not as she relaxes in her clean tidy flat grin

Bedtime1 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:24:49

Oh it sounds a great life for her nothing worse than cleaning especially after work. I'm sure you would if you could.

woozlebear Mon 29-Apr-13 16:25:28

oooh my first!

<trumpet fanfare>
<dry ice>
<dancing girls>

biscuit

pickledginger Mon 29-Apr-13 16:26:02

I really don't think cleaners 'clean up our bodily mess' either. That sounds like a specialist service grin

PumpkinPositive Mon 29-Apr-13 16:26:04

I don't see why someone should feel their time is so special that they can farm it out to someone for a few quid an hour, and not be concerned about that person's other work/income.

Peresumbly you never eat in a restaurant then? Or buy your clothes from any outlet you aren't 100% cast iron guaranteed is from an ethical source?

AhCmonSeriouslyNow Mon 29-Apr-13 16:26:12

YABU, definitely.

I mean, I guess you can't help having those feelings but they are unreasonable. I think you are jealous.
And, you know, some people enjoy cleaning jobs or find it a great way to make some money.

Unami Mon 29-Apr-13 16:27:18

This is the first time I've mentioned it to anyone, so I'm not obsessed with it. Like I said, I wanted to mull this over on MN and really think about whether or not IABU. I would also never mention it to my friend, and I recognise it is her choice.

I'm not jealous. I think getting your house cleaned that thoroughly twice a week is a bit excessive, whether you are doing it on your own or paying someone to do it.

I'm not a domestic control freak, nor do I hate cleaning myself.

Empress77 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:27:27

Cleaning isnt necessarily low paid low status work. When I worked as a cleaner it was the highest paid job ive ever had. Its also only low status if people think it so. Plus people can choose to spend their money on whatever they choose. I think people are mad who spend money on fancy cars/i phones/tvs/furniture etc, yet many people think im mad for spending tons of money on my pets or on traveling - we all choose what to spend the money we earn on and its not really anyone elses business.

EasilyBored Mon 29-Apr-13 16:27:31

I would love to have someone come over twice a week and clean. It sounds like heaven. She is employing someone, helping stimulate the economy. YABU and judgy and very odd.

I do have the time to clean, but I would still pay a cleaner if I could because I hate doing it and can't be arsed most of the time.

Icelollycraving Mon 29-Apr-13 16:27:33

Yabu & odd.

caramelwaffle Mon 29-Apr-13 16:27:44

Also - you are not privately disapproving: you are here disapproving.

Secretly....perhaps.

Mintyy Mon 29-Apr-13 16:28:12

I agree its a bit excessive.

Alwayscheerful Mon 29-Apr-13 16:28:13

We all choose different luxuries in life, cars, meals out, clothes, handbags, shoes, alcohol, clubbing, fresh flowers, waitrose food, days out or holidays. Your friend chooses to keep her home immaculate, her money her choice, perhaps her cleaner loves her job, perhaps your friend sees is as her way to help the economy. What luxuries do you prefer?

pickledginger Mon 29-Apr-13 16:28:56

Cleaning is work. Whether you enjoy it, loathe it or just get on with it, it's something that takes time and effort. What's wrong with assigning a monetary value to that?

UnChartered Mon 29-Apr-13 16:29:10

so, OP

Are YBU?

you've had lots of replies...

Dawndonna Mon 29-Apr-13 16:29:52

Okay.
You have no idea about her time when you're not there. Many years ago I was a single Mum. Had a six year old. Worked. Was also a local councillor. I used to find myself bleaching the lavatory at 2am. At that point I got a cleaner.
The other point is, it's a myth about people working fewer hours and other people picking up their jobs, eg. more work to go around. Not everyone is qualified/interested/motivated by other peoples work situations.
So, back to the original point, yabu and it's a little worrisome that you have so much time to worry about the situation of others.

ApocalypseThen Mon 29-Apr-13 16:30:26

You're the only one suggesting that cleaning for a fee is demeaning, which I find odd. Disliking housework does not imply that you think it's beneath you, you're putting this attitude from your belief set onto your friend and maybe you've something to consider here.

I think having your house cleaned thoroughy twice a week sounds heaven...how nice for her to come home to a lovely clean flat so she can have a nice chillax!!

Try and unclench just a bit.

pickledginger Mon 29-Apr-13 16:31:17

Apart from the windows and the fridge that cleaning sounds pretty normal to me.

curryeater Mon 29-Apr-13 16:31:34

YABVU.

1. how do you know she is not concerned about the working life of the cleaner? Maybe she is and it is a very good arrangement for the cleaner.

2. "she does not live with her partner". Oh, so if she did then that would be different, because - why? because there would be more to do, because you can't expect a man to clean?

3. "I just can't shake the feeling that picking up and cleaning up after yourself is one of life's levellers". No it isn't. One class of people is much better than the other at getting out of cleaning: men. If there were an existing status quo where it were generally accepted that every individual do a basic level of personal cleaning, and everyone else did this, and she were a lone individual breaking the rules, then maybe it would be fucking with some sort of social contract. But no such social contract exists. She isn't fucking with anything.

4. Main point (for me). I am actively, ideologically, in favour of the existence of (well-paid, well-treated) domestic cleaners. Not as a necessary evil, not as a guilty secret, but as a Good Thing. Because I think housework should be recognised and paid. The more of it is privately done and economically invisible, the more you reinforce a structure where some people think that fairies wash the socks and others are stuck washing socks at 1 am. Guess which people are which. There will always be households - many households - who cannot afford a cleaner. But pulling cleaning out of the shadows of invisible, free, negligible labour, and into the economic daylight, helps to inform the world that it takes up real time, and it has to be done.

LadyClariceCannockMonty Mon 29-Apr-13 16:31:39

'But most of all, I just feel like my friend is just being lazy or thinks she's too good to pick up after herself.'

Just piss off please.

LadyClariceCannockMonty Mon 29-Apr-13 16:31:55

PS and you're not this woman's friend if you think that of her.

woozlebear Mon 29-Apr-13 16:31:55

<sneaks back sheepishly>

I can say something as well, right?

<ahem> I know loads of people who do what you'd probably deem perfectly acceptable jobs, but freelance. They don't get sick leave or holidays. Why don't you spend all the spare time you clearly have on your hands writing to companies who, say, use freelance IT consultants and tell them how much you disapprove?

And really, it's ok if you have kids, but not otherwise? What a strange rule!! I hope you get as righteous about things that you personally could do something about. Have you checked out the labour conditions behind the manufacture of your white goods, for example?

Tee2072 Mon 29-Apr-13 16:32:22

So, now you know YABU are you willing to take that on board and change your opinion?

bakingaddict Mon 29-Apr-13 16:32:52

Jealousy is never a pretty thing to see....what other things do you resent your friend for and regarding a cleaner having an accident in any house they are cleaning, i'm pretty certain that if it was negligence on the part of the home-owner then they would be able to claim through the home-owners insurance

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 29-Apr-13 16:32:54

YABU

BUT

I think that you are entitled to feel what you feel about this. I'm sure many people agree with you, deep down.

I think people should know how to clean, in case they have to, and they should probably be tidy enough so that it doesn't impinge on, for example, their work colleagues or their partners.

But if they simply want to prioritise other things above cleaning, and can afford it, then it's not a problem to have a cleaner.

I have had a cleaner for about 10 years but she's gone off on a long holiday so we are doing more now. The increased amount that needs to be done is a good opportunity to teach my DCs how to do things I didn't bother teaching them before.

EuroShaggleton Mon 29-Apr-13 16:33:18

You are being completely unreasonable.

I work full time with unpredictable hours (sometimes 7 days a week, lots of overseas travel and so on). The little free time I have I do not want to spend cleaning and ironing. So I pay someone else to do it. That person has 5 children. No doubt she finds that money useful. I've done this for 10 years and I am very happy with my domestic arrangements.

BTW, unless you only buy pick your own fruit and veg, you are paying people indirectly to do menial tasks for you. Also, do you wash up your own cutlery and crockery when you eat in a restaurant? Thought not. So once again, you are paying indirectly to have that menial task done for you.

HeadFairy Mon 29-Apr-13 16:33:28

I'm quite envious of your friend (though strangely not envious of her choice of friends)

I'd love to have a house that was sparkling and clean and not have to actually do it myself. As it is I'm usually doing housework well in to the evening because I can't afford a cleaner.

LadyClariceCannockMonty Mon 29-Apr-13 16:33:36

Very good points, curryeater, especially the last one. I completely agree.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 29-Apr-13 16:33:38

... my DCs are boys

Abra1d Mon 29-Apr-13 16:34:20

My cleaning job was one of the best paid 'casual' (and I don't use that word lightly) jobs I ever had. It was brilliant. Hard work, though.

TheRainbowsEnd Mon 29-Apr-13 16:34:30

Of course cleaners have insurance. My friend owns a cleaning company, and employs around 10-15 people now - so yes of course she has insurance, very stupid of you to assume that cleaners don't tbh.

Your friend might not like cleaning and would prefer to do other things with her free time? As I'm assuming she works full-time. She is also giving someone else a job.

YABU and extremely snobby.

CMOTDibbler Mon 29-Apr-13 16:34:37

YABU.

I have a cleaner, and we've talked about the thing that theres some shame in not doing your own cleaning. Her thought is that she likes cleaning, she likes working for herself, and since her clients don't like cleaning this works out very nicely. If she doesn't like someone, she drops them as a client.

She factors in sick and holiday pay into her hourly rate, and has her own insurance in case of accident.

So, is my time worth more than hers? No. But a job I (and dh) hate is turned into someone elses income, and it is therefore a mutually good thing.

Squitten Mon 29-Apr-13 16:34:43

YABU!

She's using her money to employ someone else to do the jobs she doesn't want to spend her time doing. She gets to live in a sparkly clean house (envy) and doesn't have to worry about it herself. Sounds bloody brilliant! Her cleaner is getting paid well to do a job that she evidently does well.

Whether you think cleaning is demeaning or not is really irrelevant. I assume you must ask for a list of cleaners everywhere you go because I would bet my house on the fact that you've either fed yourself or made use of facilities in places that are cleaned by people who really are exploited.

WTFisABooyhooISBooyhoo Mon 29-Apr-13 16:35:02

YABU

for so many reasons

but most importantly because life is too fucking short to clean if you dont want to and can afford to PAY (she's not taking advantage of anyone here) to have it done for you.

also, who the fuck cares?

quirrelquarrel Mon 29-Apr-13 16:35:13

One of the most judgy OPs I've ever seen on AIBU!!

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 29-Apr-13 16:36:29

Excellent point curryeater

It sort of links to my post though. By having a cleaner and not making my DCs do cleaning for themselves, I was sort of enabling.

(I have always made them clean their own skiddies from the toilet, wipe their own spills and empty and fill the dishwasher though)

MrsSpagBol Mon 29-Apr-13 16:36:45

"
I just can't shake the feeling that picking up and cleaning up after yourself is one of life's levellers. I don't see why someone should feel their time is so special that they can farm it out to someone for a few quid an hour, and not be concerned about that person's other work/income."

What are you on woman?! Stop superimposing your own views on other people. TBH your post shows that YOU think cleaning is menial work.

Yabvvvvvu and you sound completely jealous. She can spend the moneybshe has earnt any way she wants!!!

CaramelLatte Mon 29-Apr-13 16:37:28

I am a self.employed cleaner..I earn a very decent wage from it as I charge my customers what I am worth. It is not cash in hand, I declare all my earnings, I have insurance, I take my job very seriously..you sound like you look down on cleaners. I decided to do this to spend more time with my children while they are still young, I will then possibly go back to a "proper" job when they are older.

Unami Mon 29-Apr-13 16:37:35

Thanks for your considered reply curryeater. That's given me a really different perspective on things.

And thanks for everyone else's responses too - even the people telling me to piss off, I guess.

I can see that the vast majority of you think IAB(V)U.

But I can also see that this topic seems to have triggered a lot of very strong (maybe disproportionately strong) feelings. Which to me indicates that there might be something else at play here - maybe some other feelings as to where guilt/money/power lie in this exchange.

I agree that it would be totally inappropriate to make an issue of this in rl, but I'm still not totally convinced that my feelings are 100% wrong. Also, thanks to those posters who think IANBU. I am actually surprised how one sided opinions seem to have been.

I'm going to have to ponder what curryeater and others have said

HazleNutt Mon 29-Apr-13 16:38:24

She works hard enough to afford the cleaner, but is still lazy because she does not want to dust herself? Even though I would guess it's quite likely that her job is in fact more difficuly to do than dusting.

curryeater Mon 29-Apr-13 16:38:58

Euroshaggleton, right.

Our lives depend completely on the labour of others but we are squeamish about it because it is being done out of sight.
Which is worse, employing a skivvy on a small wage to wash up, or having a dishwaster manufactured in another country by people on tiny wages? Arguably the latter, because of the environmental impact as well, and because if you could see your skivvy you might at least give them time off if they were sick, or a lovely Christmas box. Patronising, yes - not good enough, no - no substitute for dignity and decent employment rights, no not in the slightest - but face it, these are both ways of not standing over your sink washing every greasy pan yourself.
We don't have cooks but there are people in factories chopping vegetables and making soups and sauces and we don't have to look at them. etc etc, it is endless.

You are saying she is jumped up. You are making a judgement on what women should be able to get away with.

lynniep Mon 29-Apr-13 16:39:03

LOL. YABU. And talking utter b*ll*cks

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 29-Apr-13 16:39:04

Unami

I think some of (us) feel a bit guilty.

But I think that's because we are women

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