Would you accept somebody who reapplied?

[SarahH12]

Morning all, I thought this would be a good place to ask as I don't really have anybody in real life I can speak to. I started on an EPSRC funded CDT course in September 2014 based between 3 different universities. The first year was an MRes and then I started the PhD in 2015. The MRes year was great but when I started on the actual PhD my mental health took a huge tumble (personal circumstances rather than work related). As well as that the topic wasn't very interesting. My group was tiny - new academic with one PhD student, myself and two MChem students - and there was zero support. When I signed up to the CDT it was sold as we would get a choice in our projects but in reality there was very little choice and I chose that university out of the three because of personal circumstances which in the end turned out to be a bad choice - abusive relationship which then ended just before I started my PhD year but then left it too late to change university and project. I had no self confidence, my motivation was lacking because of my depression and I just couldn't cope. I was offered to switch projects but because my mental health was at rock bottom, I couldn't face it and last January I made the decision to leave so that I could focus on getting myself better.

Even though I know it was the right choice at the time, part of me still regrets it. I've always wanted to go back and recently have been thinking about it a lot. My mental health is significantly better and I'm in a lot more stable place. I still have bad days but I feel if I wait until I never have any bad days I'll be waiting a very long time. I don't want to jump straight in with anything so I want to spend the next few months really reading around and trying to find something that really interests me.

But my question is, would you accept somebody who'd left? I'm in such a different place now than I was then but how do I get that across in applications? I don't want them to dismiss me instantly but I also don't want to go into the ins and outs just in my cover letter.

[Summerswallow]

It's such a shame that you didn't get more advice at the time, you could have possibly suspended the award for medical reasons for a year. Did the university go through the different options with you? It sounds like they did if they offered you a transfer.

One option is to just put you have done an MRES on your CV and make no mention of being a doctoral training candidate. Bit dishonest in one way but in another avoids the complexity of having to ask and answer questions, would work fine if you did well in the Mres, you may also pick up a PhD not connected with the EPSRC but one funded through a large grant- this opens up your options.

Otherwise, I don't think you will get another EPSRC award if I'm honest, as one of the criteria we evaluate on as they are very competitive is likelihood of finishing the course and you won't be favourably evaluated for that (the others for us are academic success and strength of proposal). Unis are penalised if students drop out (I can't remember how, it may be that supervisor can't hold a studentship for a while). It's not something of no consequence. I don't say this to make you feel bad, just to explain why you can't go back in necessarily on the same type of course.

There's no reason you can't apply for PhDs though at all, in fact, if you are stable and well supported, then given your MRES you would be a good candidate. I would not discuss your mental health in the covering letter at all, half my PhD students have issues and a few significant problems but we just deal with those as they arise once they start, this in most cases isn't a barrier to working in academia unless they are really severe. Don't explain, highlight what you can do.

I may have it wrong though about the funding so if anyone knows better or is a graduate entrance director, feel free to correct me, I'm speaking from the social sciences and my own experiences as a supervisor.

[user7214743615]

One option is to just put you have done an MRES on your CV and make no mention of being a doctoral training candidate.

This is not good advice. The OP has to declare that she has received EPSRC funding as she is the EPSRC database - it will show up very quickly if she is awarded an RCUK studentship.

I agree though that it would be hard to get another studentship if you have dropped out of one. The likelihood of you dropping out again would put many groups off although the RCUK rules are not quite as harsh as student drops out -> supervisor cannot take a student for a while. This would be very unfair as students drop out for many non-academic reasons (health, mental health, personal life) that are beyond a supervisor's control.

[Summerswallow]

If she put MRES (EPSRC funded) and no further explanation, this would be fine though, if she didn't go for further RCUK funded PhDs? There are heaps of PhDs out there. If I were you, I'd start looking on jobs.ac.uk OP at the different types of projects available, I don't think it makes sense to say I will start thinking up a topic, when most PhDs the topic are already specified (unless you are self-funding). The chances of getting an EPSRC funded very open ended project are probably fairly low at this stage, but with a bit more flexibility, other opportunities may open up for you. Do you get alerts from jobs.ac.uk as a starting point? Could you get relevant work experience in the meantime?

[SarahH12]

Sorry should have clarified. By read around I meant by looking on findaphd.com etc and find one that sounds really interesting rather than just applying for the first one that sounds okay. I have never heard of jobs.ac.uk, I'll check it out thanks.

[SarahH12]

Also no I wasn't given much advice at all at the time. My only options were to stick with my original choice, switch to one very specific project with one supervisor or leave.

[SarahH12]

So on my CV I've got that I obtained the MRes at the Centre for Doctoral Training and I've listed my research projects. Should I also write my PhD project / supervisor or just leave it off? I don't want to be seen to be deliberately trying to hide it but also I didn't see it through so not sure whether to include it or not.

[Summerswallow]

Are you applying for more of the same type of funding (i.e. RCUK)?

If so, then somewhere in the application, you need to let them know you already had this type of funding- and I do think this won't go for you, if I'm honest.

If I wasn't going for that type of funding, I wouldn't put it on the CV, but I might mention in the letter that you started a PhD in X topic but want to take your career in a different direction...you could not mention it at all, but they might puzzle over the MRes at the DTC and ask at an interview. I really don't know, sorry!

[Hefzi]

My institution got rid of a student who had lied by omission about a previous stint as a doctoral candidate, so be careful- applications for internally-funded PhD's can be treated like job apps.

Personally, I would confront it in your application: supervisors want to know that whatever stopped you last time has not been resolved before they'll consider taking a punt on someone who's failed to complete previously. In your case,I would leave out the bits about it being a dull project, and focus on the personal issues being the reason, stressing that these have now been resolved. I don't want to rain on your parade, but, bluntly, funding is already a lottery, and a previous drop out won’t go in your favour, so perhaps also consider your other options.