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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
MrsOvertonsWindow · 22/10/2025 12:45

The comments under both the Times & Telegraph have developed over the years to being totally terfy, including in relation to sport.
It cheers me up to see so many men sharing factual, clear sighted information about sport, biology and facts - especially in the Times when it's in response to sports "journalists" spouting the Stonewall lies. There was a time when it was women commentators "educating" the readership about reality but there's now no need. People see this for the cheating dishonest fuckery that it's been all along.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 22/10/2025 12:50

ThatZanyFatball · 22/10/2025 12:41

You know, I thought I'd take this opportunity to talk about the importance of cycling in feminist history. I'm not big into cycling but I do have a bike and as an adult still enjoy a leaisurly ride on the many trails in my community. You may not have noticed this, but the difference between a men's and women's bike is the center bar, which is lower on a woman's bike than a man's. This has historical significance, because when bicycles were first introduced in the late 1800s women primarily wore long skirts and the lower bar allowed for them to ride bicycles while wearing them. But do you know what this really means? It means that the bicycle was literally the first vehicle that allowed women to get from point A to point B independently. It freed women from being trapped in their home, from needing to depend on a carriage or other form of transportation either owned by or paid for by their husband. It also ushered in the first time women could acceptably wear pants, because special "bicycle skirts," which were basically flowy pants, were developed so women could ride even more comfortably.

It's no coincidence that the rise in popularity of the bicycle happened alongside the women suffrage movement. Bicycles freed women and gave them a sense of empowerment and independence they had never experienced before. And also why it's no coincidence that cycling is the sport that's most targeted by trans-identified males to participate. There's something truly perverted about the impulse, whether consciously or subconsciously, to take awards and opportunities from women in the very activity that is most aligned to their empowerment and freedom.

Brilliant post . Flowers

This is my favourite old cycling poster as it encapsulates that early freedom for women:

https://in.pinterest.com/pin/641974121901216886/

Cycles G. Richard. ca. 1895 | Cycling posters, Vintage posters, Vintage bicycles

Bid online in live auctions from all over the world. Browse fine and decorative art, antiques, estate jewelry, coins and stamps, collectibles, and more!

https://in.pinterest.com/pin/641974121901216886/

Stillreadingalot · 22/10/2025 12:52

The comments btl which I read this morning (quite early) were overwhelmingly appalled by "Pippa's" attitude and statements. There are several regulars who comment on stories like this in the Times challenging the "only bigots mind about men in skirts in the female changing rooms" narrative.

Glittertwins · 22/10/2025 12:57

The comments in the Times are not supportive of Millar from a quick review. The article is also not written by the usual cycling expert David Walsh either.

Igneococcus · 22/10/2025 13:00

ThatZanyFatball · 22/10/2025 12:41

You know, I thought I'd take this opportunity to talk about the importance of cycling in feminist history. I'm not big into cycling but I do have a bike and as an adult still enjoy a leaisurly ride on the many trails in my community. You may not have noticed this, but the difference between a men's and women's bike is the center bar, which is lower on a woman's bike than a man's. This has historical significance, because when bicycles were first introduced in the late 1800s women primarily wore long skirts and the lower bar allowed for them to ride bicycles while wearing them. But do you know what this really means? It means that the bicycle was literally the first vehicle that allowed women to get from point A to point B independently. It freed women from being trapped in their home, from needing to depend on a carriage or other form of transportation either owned by or paid for by their husband. It also ushered in the first time women could acceptably wear pants, because special "bicycle skirts," which were basically flowy pants, were developed so women could ride even more comfortably.

It's no coincidence that the rise in popularity of the bicycle happened alongside the women suffrage movement. Bicycles freed women and gave them a sense of empowerment and independence they had never experienced before. And also why it's no coincidence that cycling is the sport that's most targeted by trans-identified males to participate. There's something truly perverted about the impulse, whether consciously or subconsciously, to take awards and opportunities from women in the very activity that is most aligned to their empowerment and freedom.

My Mum, born in 1933 in Germany, used to go on cycling holidays with her female friends (I think, but I'm not sure all part of a Catholic youth organisation) in the early 50s. They stayed in hostels and church halls provided by other groups (it's how she met my Dad). One of her friends who wasn't allowed to go on a trip by her parents, climbed out of her window on the morning they set off once to join them. My Mum was an enthusiastic and speedy cyclist until she had a stroke at the age of 86 and all her children are too. There is no better feeling than setting off on your bike on a nice summer morning.

OP posts:
Greyskybluesky · 22/10/2025 13:06

Glittertwins · 22/10/2025 12:57

The comments in the Times are not supportive of Millar from a quick review. The article is also not written by the usual cycling expert David Walsh either.

I read that York and David Walsh are good friends. They collaborated on a book together and DW has previously written supportive articles about PY. Nice to have friends in the media.

Igneococcus · 22/10/2025 13:10

Greyskybluesky · 22/10/2025 13:06

I read that York and David Walsh are good friends. They collaborated on a book together and DW has previously written supportive articles about PY. Nice to have friends in the media.

Here is David Walsh' article from June:
https://www.thetimes.com/article/7f86fd16-4492-49ed-8d87-507ab8dd77d1?shareToken=1b61b7335d9e6a4d9ab845adc6f83cba

My friend Pippa — who used to be one of Britain’s best male cyclists

The Scottish cyclist Robert Millar won the polka-dot jersey in the 1984 Tour de France — but hated who he was. Now known as Pippa York, she tells David Walsh how becoming a woman at 41 finally helped her find happiness

https://www.thetimes.com/article/7f86fd16-4492-49ed-8d87-507ab8dd77d1?shareToken=1b61b7335d9e6a4d9ab845adc6f83cba

OP posts:
ParmaVioletTea · 22/10/2025 13:27

Brilliant post @ThatZanyFatball !

Greyskybluesky · 22/10/2025 13:40

Great, thanks @Igneococcus. I tried to read it earlier but didn't have access.

So much there to unpick.

Not least the fact that the journalist really sneers at German guy Thomas for not recognising PY is Robert Millar. But later in the article, PY says he had facial feminisation surgery precisely to make him look like a woman, i.e. to not look like Robert Millar!
Why would Thomas realise that "Pippa was once a great cyclist"?
Surely, logically, it's a good thing that Thomas didn't recognise PY? Otherwise why spend all that money on changing his appearance?

It doesn't make sense!

Igneococcus · 22/10/2025 13:46

Greyskybluesky · 22/10/2025 13:40

Great, thanks @Igneococcus. I tried to read it earlier but didn't have access.

So much there to unpick.

Not least the fact that the journalist really sneers at German guy Thomas for not recognising PY is Robert Millar. But later in the article, PY says he had facial feminisation surgery precisely to make him look like a woman, i.e. to not look like Robert Millar!
Why would Thomas realise that "Pippa was once a great cyclist"?
Surely, logically, it's a good thing that Thomas didn't recognise PY? Otherwise why spend all that money on changing his appearance?

It doesn't make sense!

I don't think Robert Millar was/is as well known in Germany as he is here. Thomas would probably have recognized Jan Ullrich though.

OP posts:
Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 22/10/2025 13:47

Thanks for the share tokens. The long article from the summer includes various expected comments:

From her first days at Abbotsford Primary School in Glasgow, she knew she was different. Everything about the girls’ world appealed to her. Not much about the boys’ did. When the girls went to their part of the school yard, she wanted to follow but already sensed that sissies weren’t tolerated.

She coped by creating a secret world, tiptoeing into his sister Elizabeth’s room at their 11th-floor flat in Pollokshaws, south of Glasgow. Elizabeth was a year older and her clothes fitted Robert. Picking the moment carefully, he would sneak into his sister’s room and put on her clothes. Dressed in his sister’s clothes, he felt more comfortable and more secure. He liked that feeling.

Every. Single. Time. Boy doesn't like what boys are expected to be like, so decides this means he isn't a boy. If he's not a boy he must be a girl. He does after all like girly things. They give him a special feeling, especially after puberty. How handy for a boy to have a sister of a similar size! But it has to be a secret. How can a boy admit to liking those things? He can't! Poor, poor boy. Sorry! Slap on the hand. Poor, poor girl. Never mind, though, once the girl has spent years in a male-dominated career, got married and fathered Hmm children, those obliging medics will step in and help the now middle-aged girl to be her true self at last. Shame about the wife, ex-wife and children, but they'll cope.

Not a scintilla of sympathy for those whose lives have been turned upside down by the transition, nor for his sister's feeling on discovering that her brother has been rooting through her underwear drawer and using her makeup.

So frustrating. I am a couple of years younger than Robert Millar and I also lived in Scotland when young. I can well believe that life was tough for gender nonconforming boys, but some managed it.

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 22/10/2025 14:10

Robert Millar ( Pippas previous incarnation) was banned from (male) professional cycling for a year, because he tested positive for doping with testosterone. So he took extra male hormones to increase his competitiveness in men’s cycling…..but he doesn’t think male hormones make any difference to performance. Perhaps they make a difference to one’s logical capacity.

ParmaVioletTea · 22/10/2025 14:23

So the man is a confirmed cheat.

Glittertwins · 22/10/2025 15:37

As is his son, EPO I believe

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 22/10/2025 15:51

Here's the interview. It was on STV (Scottish Television) the other night. I am in Scotland at the moment and saw a few seconds by chance. My impression was that there was no challenge at all from the interviewer. It was a human interest piece, just filler stuff. https://x.com/SportSEENuk/status/1981003222073610397

SEENinSport (@SportSEENuk) on X

Listen to yet another trans identifying male athlete who sees no problem with males competing in the female category because; - there’s so few - they are not winning anything - there’s no evidence it’s unfair - he’s never met another trans person in...

https://x.com/SportSEENuk/status/1981003222073610397

dynamiccactus · 22/10/2025 17:31

ParmaVioletTea · 22/10/2025 13:27

Brilliant post @ThatZanyFatball !

Agreed. I'd never made that connection before!

Form1ess · 22/10/2025 21:27

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 22/10/2025 15:51

Here's the interview. It was on STV (Scottish Television) the other night. I am in Scotland at the moment and saw a few seconds by chance. My impression was that there was no challenge at all from the interviewer. It was a human interest piece, just filler stuff. https://x.com/SportSEENuk/status/1981003222073610397

The STV interview was pish! Millar was totally unchallenged and allowed to spout nonsense about how there were so few men in women's sport that it was a non-issue. Not sure where he lives but I see TIMs frequently, including in leisure centres and in sporting events.

YouCantProveIt · 22/10/2025 21:32

ParmaVioletTea · 22/10/2025 10:57

Oh, and socialisation into masculinity, a sex-based set of behaviours which gives men permission to compete, think they're the centre of the world, and that their needs are the most important.

All the things that socialisation into femininity, a sex-based set of behaviours which proscribes all those things for women.

@ParmaVioletTea I know these things to be true but you say them so easily & eloquently.

It’s so self evident when you say it so clearly.

ParmaVioletTea · 22/10/2025 21:54

Anger is great motivation but thank you 🙏

StanfreyPock · 22/10/2025 22:18

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 22/10/2025 07:51

“Your hormonal system runs your health. After the transition, the system that repairs muscle with protein no longer works the same. You hurt yourself training and don’t recover. And you lose that competitive edge that testosterone gives you.”

Translation: ‘here is some made up science to make me feel better about my nonsense beliefs because I don’t really think much about how women feel despite enjoying role playing as one’

Yes, so all these amazing female cyclists like Lizzie Deignan, first winner of the women's Paris-Roubaix, just crumple up and never race again after injury?
Absolute bloody nonsense...

AbsentosaurusRex · 22/10/2025 22:25

Fck off Robert

InvisibleDragon · 22/10/2025 22:28

You lose that competitive edge that testosterone gives you

Well. If that isn't the very definition of male advantage.

I had a falling out with a (male) friend about trans men in women's sports (among other things). He was incredibly condescending and put out that I thought trans women should have to choose between immediately progressing their transition and their sporting career.

I pointed out that female athletes very often have to choose between getting pregnant and their career goals. (And that for women generally there is by definition a loss of career progression when you take time out to have a baby.) It had never occurred to him, because these things don't happen to men.

Cynic17 · 22/10/2025 22:41

Glittertwins · 22/10/2025 15:37

As is his son, EPO I believe

If you mean David Millar, he is not related to Robert Millar/Pippa York.

Glittertwins · 23/10/2025 04:15

Yep, I’m an idiot!!

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