Gynocology provision at gp surgery- how is this ok?

[9448djdi]

Need some advice as I’m going to be making a complaint and can’t get my head round it. Wondering if I’m missing something.

So I needed to see the gp for something that is a woman only issue down below. I requested a female GP with an interest in women’s health and explained why. All good. Was put on non emergency so had to wait 2 weeks for it and something else not gender specific,all still ok. Turned up to the appointment only to be told that she could see me for the other issue but the gynie issue would need a gynie appointment. It would have taken 2 minutes to check out and was not internal. I told her that I had already had to wait 2 weeks and struggled to get GP appointments that work round work. Just given a shrug and told to book with their gynie clinic. So I go to book only to be told it’s not running atm. So I ask why the gp I just saw who would be one of the GPs used for the gynie clinic couldn’t have just done the appointment How long I’d have to wait etc- shrug shrug.

So I complained to the practice manager. Have now had a text saying I have a GP gynie clinic appointment for the end of July!!!!! Which will be 2 months after requesting one.

So my anger with this is if I was a man and requesting an appointment for a male specific issue I’d be seen in the normal 2 week wait. How is making women jump through hoops and wait extra long to see the same GP for something specifically female anything other than sexist? I have asked around and it wasn’t just my bad luck. It is the surgery policy! My mother saw the GP I have just seen at the gynie clinic after a long wait !!😳

How is this ok ( maybe I’m missing something)and how do I formulate a complaint to PALs?

That is crazy! It makes no sense! I have always seen GPs for these things.

I bet it is some kind of funding thing, like they get more money for "clinic" appointments.

I don't quite understand why you just didnt make a normal appointment if you just needed something looking at. It's common for GPs to only look at one thing per appointment. As to if it's exist, I suppose it depends on if there's similar clinics for men's issues .

It's common for GPs to only look at one thing per appointment.

This.
They are 10 min appointments. If they’ve already discussed one thing with you, to then have you remove clothes, lie down, don gloves, examine you, write up the notes, clean the couch etc it’s way more than the 2 mins you think it is. It’s also why they frequently run late, miss tea breaks, lunch, toilet breaks etc because patients always trot out the dreaded words ‘while I’m here..‘

Oh yes I quite agree however when I booked I had put the 2 issues on the form, I was told as such it was a double appointment, only it wasn’t. I needed to be seen again for the non gynie issue and she booked me in to be seen again 2 weeks later. So why couldn’t she have booked me in for the gynie issue 2 weeks later? Why do gynie issues have to only be seen in a “gynie clinic” appointment with the same GP but after a much longer wait. This issue would take 2 minutes to look at!

I don't understand.

A GP appointment wouldn't be under a 2ww.

You said it was non-emergency so no 2ww but you later complain saying you weren't seem within a 2ww.

What do you mean by 'normal 2 week wait?' That isn't normal.

It is normal now. Under the new online triage system you fill in a form. Emergencies same day, non emergency is a 2 week wait. Most things are non emergency and a 2 week wait. Not great but it is what it is. I get this condition is not classed as an emergency however uncomfortable it is. No problem with the normal 2 week wait.

What I do have a problem with is having to jump though extra hoops and a far longer wait because it’s a woman’s issue ie a 2 month wait instead of 2 week for the same GP who saw me last time a couple of years ago in a normal generic GP appointment prior to the new system.

The really bizarre thing is that it will be the same GP you eventually see at end of July. That makes no sense whatsoever. Is the G Clinic in the same building? Does it have any special equipment that the GP might need? How often are the clinics held?

I am not sure whether it is sexist or not. Are there any other clinics in the surgery you could compare the process to?

And given that you have to wait 2 months for the appointment to occur do you think that whatever it is you needed checking can wait that long?

Do you mean how you go about booking gp appointments? We used to have similar at ours.

You say you're looking for a gynae appointment so that could explain the delay? Or do you have gynaecologists based at your GP?

Exactly this!!!! Same GP, same building and I presume same room. My poor mum is at the practice and in her 80s and had exactly the same. She saw the GP I just saw in the “gynie clinic” after a long wait. It has made her 18 month hospital fine referral wait even longer.

Re it waiting I’m uncomfortable and I do think I could be prescribed something to help so the 2 months instead of 2 weeks is frustrating on that point too.

Is it because they have a chaperone at the gynae clinic? Or because they organise women only days? Just reaching desperately for a as n explanation…

When you’re there, ask for an explanation and tell us!

No I just want to see a GP!!!!! I don’t want a fancy “gynie clinic” appointment with an extra wait. But you’re not allowed that now, anything gynie has to be seen in “gynie clinic” with a much longer wait. We have loads of female GPs at our practice with an interest in women’s health. You always previously just specified a female GP in your appointment requests.

How do you know men would be seen quicker?

If it were the same doctor, it is crazy she wouldn’t see you there and then. I could understand if it were a different doctor.

Well I’ve explained to the manager and sitting out the 30 day reply so she may have a good reason although I’m scratching my head as to what. Will
update when I do. I will go to PALs if necessary. I’ve had to get undressed and had boobs, upper legs etc looked at recently unchaperoned so it can’t be that. Wouldn’t men need to be chaperoned if they needed to be examined near intimate areas?
Also frankly if it was they need to sort it out. Women shouldn’t be waiting 2 months as opposed to 2 weeks for doctors appointments whatever the reason.

You’re so lucky to get things seen in two weeks at your surgery. In mine non urgent things are routinely 6-8 weeks ahead. Sounds like you’ve got an efficient surgery, possibly because they’re strict about the one issue per appointment thing, and because they put on extra specialist surgeries for particular issues such as gynaecology and route people to those which takes slightly longer. I can see it’s annoying to have to wait, but I’d never expect a routine issue to be dealt with in 2 weeks at mine, sadly - I think you’re unusually lucky.

That makes no sense at all OP, given tgat it's the same GPs running the gynae clinics as you see for the routine appointments? Do they have specific clinics for other things, eg urology, respiratory, ENT? If not, then why only gynae?

No we’re really not lucky as some of the things I’ve had to 2 weeks for are not just routine- pre existing melanoma( then suddenly treated as urgent care), cyst on an eye etc. that’s if you can get an appointment. The booking system is switched off not long after it opens. We don’t go that often thankfully.Women’s health can often be dismissed. I don’t see how the condition I’m struggling with can be dismissed as even less needy than “routine”. It isn’t and does not deserve a longer wait.

I think the thrust of your complaint should be that the surgery has overmedicalised a relatively minor issue that would be reasonable to expect to be treated in a non specialist GP appointment.

This approach has led to unnecessary delays and discomfort which is not putting the patient needs at the centre.

Could you do a freedom of information request regarding waiting times for men and women?. Or even say to the practice manager that you think they're discriminating against women by pushing them into a special clinic with a long waiting list and you'll be submitting a freedom of information request unless they sort out a better system?

My cynicism would lead me to infer that they get more money for running the clinic and that that’s why you’ve been batted over to it.

Two months for something minor, though, is very poor. Particularly if the discomfort it’s causing you could be alleviated by medication.

We’ve got far too used to shrugging off long waits in the NHS as ‘that’s just how it is… you should see how long MY surgery makes me wait.’

Death by a thousand cuts and all that.

I understand the logic of this. But it has consequences, because a human body is not just 'one thing'.

When I lived in the UK, my GP surgery has signs all over the place saying ONE APPOINTMENT ONE PROBLEM. I complied, and over a number of years brought a number of symptoms to the doctors' attention.

Several years on, somebody - a locum who didn't know me at all, as it happened, but read through my notes - put all the separate symptoms together and started the process by which I was finally diagnosed with a chronic condition which I'd been struggling with, untreated, for years.

So while I have huge sympathy for overworked GPs trying to get through their day's list of appointments, the 'one patient one problem' thing may be administratively helpful, but it can be medically negative, as some illnesses have a range of symptoms.

It sounds like the OP's surgery has taken it to the next level by shifting a whole range of symptoms ['women's troubles'] out of the normal consultation scenario and into a separate, less accessible category. It probably makes organisational sense, but not great patient care - hope you get the care you need very soon OP.

Exactly this. Also I was trying to save them time. Filled out 2 online forms with 2 things on each vaguely related .Haven’t been for a long time and don’t go to the GP a lot but as you get older things start piling up which you’re foolish to ignore. Everything was documented before the appointment so down to them to organise. Frankly I would have thought they’d prefer me to have 2 doubles instead of 4 but if they’d rather it was 4 appointments then fine they can crack on and organise them. They didn’t do either. They told me I had a double appointment but I hadn’t and pulled the gynie issue out completely.

I strongly suspect the women’s problems get extra funding if in a “clinic” appointment even though it’s exactly the same staff and building and giving extra hoops to jump though frees up more Gp appointments for everybody else. Neither are ok as women’s issues are just as valid as anything else.

I hoping they’ll tell me otherwise but honestly can’t see any other reason.

Is it because you had 2 issues and dealt with the non-gynae one first during the appointment? My practice also only deals with one issue at a time, and state that clearly.

Sorry if I misunderstood, and that's not what happened.

I recently contacted my GP due to irregular bleeding, and was seen within a week. It's a postcode lottery really, as my doctors really go the extra mile to ensure fast efficient service.

Hope you get all issues sorted xx

Our practice runs a lot of specialist clinic sessions. Asthma, COPD, diabetes, heart disease, baby checks, menopause etc.

They seem to run differently to standard appointments and generally have a good reputation.

If you feel that the practice manager has not - or has avoided - dealing with your query or complaint, then you should go back to him or her and explain why they haven't dealt with the issue you were raising.

Regarding taking your complaint further, I don't think GP practices are covered by PALS. The body you need to complain to is the one that commissions the practice's services. They used to be called Clinical Commissioning Groups but are now called Integrated Care Boards:

Find your local integrated care board (ICB) - NHS